TrueCar, Inc. (TRUE) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

All right. I think we're live. Good morning, everyone. I am Rajat Gupta, member of the Automotive Equity Research team at JPMorgan. Very pleased to have with us Mike Darrow, President and CEO of TrueCar; and also Zaineb Bokhari, Vice President of Investor Relations. TrueCar is a leading automotive digital marketplace that lets cars buyers connect to the nationwide network of certified dealers and discover a new or used vehicle that is right for them, their budget and needs. TrueCar provides consumers with useful tools, research, market context and price transparency as they embark on their car buying journey. As part of the marketplace, TrueCar powers auto buying programs for more than 250 leading brands, including Sam's Club, Navy Federal Credit Union and American Express. TrueCar also partners with their certified dealers to bring more of the purchasing process online while delivering a great customer experience that is personalized and efficient. With that, I'll hand it over to Mike.

Thanks, Rajat. And I have a little boilerplate statement here. I want to read before we get started. Before we get started, I want to remind everyone that our discussion today may include forward-looking statements. Please review the Risk Factors section of our annual and quarterly filings with the SEC for a discussion of the factors that could cause our results to differ materially from these statements.

Great, Mike. So maybe we'll just go into Q&A. Just to kick it off, could you give us a sense of what you're seeing from a consumer demand perspective? We are starting to hear from many firms, including large retailers on a slowdown in the lower-end consumer. We are starting to see some ripple effects to the broader consumer from maybe a slowdown in housing, stock market is down. But vehicle sales still seem to be in an area where there was actually a lot of pent-up demand that has been built over the last couple of years. But also one of the retail verticals that is big ticket and has seen substantial price increases more than the broader inflation. So curious to hear your thoughts on what's going on, on the ground, what are you seeing? And just how do you think all of this plays out over the next few months or quarters?

I think clearly for us, demand is still outstripping supply. There's still a lot of demand in the marketplace. Our traffic for the first quarter was really solid after pulling back on some of our marketing expenses to manage our budgets. So upper funnel traffic is very strong. We have other metrics we look at through the purchase funnel that kind of indicate further elements of demand. Our connection rate with retailers is maintaining, where our business seems to be facing the most headwinds is around close rate. So we're getting people to come to the site. They're working through the process. They're having a hard time finding the vehicle they're looking for. If they do find a vehicle similar to their needs, I think they're surprised by the pricing that's out there in the marketplace. So those sort of things are starting to have an impact. A lot of unique data around our industry right now, 64% of cars in the first quarter, in Q1, sold above MSRP. I can't remember a time in automotive where that was the case. And it went up a little bit even in April, it went up to 66%. So pricing is high. That's how dealers have responded to the new car shortage is raising prices and that's created room for used car pricing to go up. So there's very stout pricing out there, particularly for someone who hasn't been in the marketplace for 4 or 5 years, I think they're surprised by the limited inventory and the level of pricing.

Got it. Just shifting gears a little bit. Just maybe once things normalize or once we get to -- I don't know what normal looks like anymore, but say we get back to a more normal supply/demand environment. Many OEMs have highlighted their intent to shift to structurally leaner inventories as compared to what they were pre-pandemic, maybe like 40 days supply versus 65 days traditionally. Do you expect this change in inventory management having any sort of structural impact to your business? How do you manage the business with that kind of like an inventory dynamic?

Well, we certainly keep a close eye on inventory levels and then what manufacturers are telling us about production. Pre-pandemic, new car inventory ran about 3.5 million units across the industry. Now it's a little over 1 million units. So there's been a significant decline in inventory availability. We track that decline pretty closely as it happened in the marketplace. And we think there's a sweet spot for inventory to come back to the market. We think that number is somewhere around 2 million or 2.5 million units versus the 3.5 million pre-pandemic. That was inefficient. It drove a lot of expense into the dealership and OEM structure. So we think it will build from here. We think it's going to be slow. A lot of the vehicles that are coming in now that are being built, even though production is going up a bit are already presold. So AutoNation made a statement, the largest retailer in the nation, made a statement earlier in the year that about 50% of their mass market brands, Chevy, Ford, Toyota, the vehicles were presold before they came in. And about 3 out of 4 of their luxury brand vehicles were already presold and they're in the pipeline. So even as production starts to ramp up, we think it will be a while before inventory starts to build. But we do think OEMs will raise it back up. I spent the first 20 years of my career on the OEM side, and they track things other than profitability, which they're thriving in right now. But with -- there seems to be an erosion of brand loyalty because people can't find the vehicles they're looking for. So folks who are typically Toyota and Honda buyers end up considering vehicles like Hyundai and Kia and Mazda because they're out there in availability. So we think the industry will drive to take that inefficiency out of the marketplace. Toyota and Honda invest a lot in building that consumer loyalty. And I don't think they want to give it up because they don't have the cars in inventory. So there is going to be a push by the OEMs to rebuild it. I don't think they'll push it all the way back to 3.5 million, but we think it will go up significantly from the 1 million where it is right now.

Got it. And maybe as a follow-up on the used car side, there's -- I mean, used car prices, even though they've ticked down slightly, I mean, they're still well above normal. So how are dealers managing their inventory today? And what implications does that have to your business just given the uncertainty in both the demand and the pricing and the supply, like how do you see that progressing? And maybe like beyond like the next 6 months or a couple of quarters, lease penetration over the last couple of years has been below normal. New car sales have been below normal. How do you just think about used car supply in general, like over the next 2, 3 years as prices start to moderate as well?

Yes. dealers have been aggressively pursuing used car inventory just to fill up their lots. And new car pricing kind of sets the ceiling for used car pricing. So as new car pricing has hit extremely high levels, it's created room for dealers to price their used cars higher and higher in the marketplace as well. So we continue to see dealers aggressively chasing used cars. We've launched some products to help some of our dealer partners acquire consumer cars called Sell Your Car. So we think dealers will continue to try to fill their lots up with used cars. The used car marketplace is changing and Mike Manley from the CEO at AutoNation made the statement that new car franchise dealers are like the factory for used cars. So when you think about it, all used cars start out as a new car on some dealers' lot, some franchise dealers' lot, and then get sold. And the fact that leasing penetration is down, will affect the type of used cars that are coming back. We've seen the mix. In 2019, nearly 50% of the used car inventory was 2 to 4 years old. In 2022, it's 25%, and the vehicles have aged. So there's less of those current new models. Leasing pen is down, which will create even less of them coming back in the future. So we'll have to keep an eye on the used car market. It's certainly going to adjust. And what we've seen from retailers in order to meet consumer affordability needs, terms on financing has actually stretched out. So it used to be 60- or 72-month financing was about as far as you could go. Retailers are now writing 84-month contracts. We're hearing some 96-month contracts on cars. So that takes both the car and the consumer out of the market for an extended period of time. So it's going to have an impact on used. Dealers are gobbling them up now. They're getting as many as they can, and they're trying to fill the void left by a shortage of new cars, but we think we see that shifting over time.

Got it. Got it. That's helpful. I do want to come back on like some of the broader industry changes that might happen. But moving to like just your business model and just the asset-light approach. I have a long question here, but over the last few years, there has been an ongoing debate about the winners and losers in the industry and how different participants in the industry might converge in their approach over time. Traditional model for many years has been the brick-and-mortar model, in-store shopping, dealers listing cars on platforms such as yours and large wholesale auction houses locations. Now we have Carvana, doing everything under one head, more so with the ADESA deal. We have franchise dealers that are looking to take a similar approach, although more omnichannel, but still increasing vertical integration in-house, including financing. And then you have CarGurus, a direct competitor that is now slowly touching the assets directly with the CarOffer acquisition. You've always kept an asset-light approach and would like to keep it that way. Why so? And do any of the moves that the competitors are making worry you at all or make you rethink, ignoring the stock price for now.

Right. Yes. We actually looked outside the automotive vertical for our inspiration around what a modern day digital marketplace should look like. And to be honest with you, automotive is behind many of the other sectors where vehicles -- where consumers have been purchasing products online for a number of years. So if you look outside of automotive, you see companies like Amazon and Etsy and Airbnb who create a connection between supply and demand with their digital platform without actually owning the assets and create a marketplace where those supply and demand can come together in a real efficient way. So we've tried to stick to those type of models. We think it's important. We have about 12,000 dealers on our platform, almost 1 million cars. And by using that inventory and providing that inventory to consumers, we can create a much broader selection than what many of the vertically integrated partners have to go through and in acquiring vehicles, reconditioning vehicles, shipping them, staging them, all the things they have to do if you own that whole vertical. So we think our spot will be in that -- being that digital connection, being that really good product opportunity for consumers and dealers to come together and create an efficient buying process all online.

Got it. Makes sense. I do want to get into TrueCar+, but maybe one more question in relation to the previous one. We're hearing about some of the recent issues at Carvana, Vroom, Shift, et cetera, some of these online-only players with investors focusing more and more on profit and cash flow. Those companies are now needing to slow down some of their investments. And so what are you hearing in your conversations with dealers today, especially over the last few weeks? How are they responding to this? Many private dealers have generated above-normal levels of free cash flow in recent years. Do you think this emboldens them to invest and pivot more aggressively to digital, including leveraging tools like TrueCar+?

Yes. I think the current business environment has spun in favor of the brick-and-mortar models and dealers are making more money than they've made many years in the past. So many of them have begun to understand that now is the time to make that pivot, and they can do it with a company like us without making that big investment. So we have the software, we bring the traffic. We do the constant product iteration. And as dealers think about how they want to compete with companies like Tesla and Carvana, to jump into that as a retailer and bring all those aspects to their business is a huge undertaking. And what we're hearing about TrueCar+ and you opened the door for the TrueCar+ discussion. By being able to provide their inventory to us for us to build the process for that vehicle to be shopped and actually purchased online, using all the dealers, parameters to do that becomes very interesting to them. So we're getting dealers leaning in. We want to make it efficient for them to participate in our channel, and that story seems to be resonating.

Got it. Got it. that makes a ton of sense. It will be really interesting to see how this all plays out. So moving to TrueCar+, a really nice value proposition for dealers to gain digital retailing presence quickly and cost effectively, as you mentioned. Now that this platform has been launched in Florida, could you -- since earnings also maybe, could you give us some more color around how you're monetizing these transactions? And also curious if financing on TrueCar+ is specific by dealers lender partners? Or is there a lender network you're building as well just to make the whole transaction a little more easier?

Yes. We're convinced in the digital retail space, the one with the best product will win. And we say the best product, the best consumer-facing products. So we haven't put a lot of pressure on the TrueCar+ units to drive revenue at this point. We've been running them through our current business model. For us, Florida is a pay-per transaction state. So we charge $299 for a new car sale and $399 for a used car sale, and we're running the TrueCar+ units through that model. So we've tried to take the pressure off of it. We've been focused on handholding the dealers in a small group and the consumers into the flow to iterate, to test, to check and make sure we've got the product right. And we're seeing some very good signs. So we've started to expand our footprint. In Florida, we've got most of the 9 DMAs in Florida covered with new car brands, and we're starting to build out our footprint there. And the ease of use is what's bringing dealers to the platform. They provide our inventory to us. We do a little bit of integration with them that takes a day or 2 and then a little training, and they're up and running versus trying to do this on their own in a significant investment that it would take to be part of a digital platform. So...

Got it. And maybe you mentioned handholding and iterating and testing. Could you give us a sense of the resource requirements for the company as they expanded to -- more further into Florida and also into more regions, what's the resource need that you need? Like what's the go-to market? What's the spending like? Maybe just some color around how we could expect that cadence to be as you roll out in more and more regions.

Well, the resource requirement through the early stages of this product development, we're mostly product and tech. So our core offering was a mature product. So we took many of the product development resources and the technical resources, moved them to TrueCar+ to work on that. So those were costs that were already contained in the company. We've begun to transition the sales team in Florida to support TrueCar+, and we'll do that across the country as we begin to roll out. We do have a national sales force that covers the entire U.S., and we'll eventually begin to train all of those folks up to be ready to support the product. So it's a fairly lightweight transition. And most of it be contained in-house. We do have some marketing resources at the ready. And if we begin to see some traction and some volume flowing through, we'll quickly lean into marketing and start bringing more people in the top of the funnel.

Got it. Got it. And maybe like just an expansion of that, you also introduced distance retailing. Could you just elaborate a little bit more on the opportunity there? Maybe some key metrics from some of the early results you're seeing, average shipping distance, conversion rates, et cetera? And also, if you could provide some color on how the fulfillment is completed? We're assuming you're using third-party partners for now. And how do we expect that to evolve as well as you get more scale?

Yes. We tested our distance retailing product in Texas in the first quarter of 2022. And we opened up 3 markets. It was Dallas, San Antonio and Houston. And our core product generally was a local market experience. So a dealer who participated in TrueCar generally had a 20-mile radius, sometimes expanded it up to 50 miles in exposing their inventory to consumers. And what we tested in our distance retailing effort was growing that and opening it up. And what we saw very quickly was that the consumer engagement with our dealers doubled in a very short period of time and just expanding into those few markets. So we think there's a big opportunity. We've taken the digital -- or the distance retailing initiative, moved it into our TrueCar+ work in Florida. So all of the dealers in Florida, their new car and used car inventory is available across the full state. And what it does is it gives consumers a better selection. They get a more opportunity to look at vehicles, and it allows dealers to reach consumers they hadn't touched in the past. So it's incremental business for the dealer, not only on the sale of a vehicle. Oftentimes, they get a trade in, that comes with that. So they're seeing value from the retailer perspective in broadening their platform and consumers are benefiting from that in that they get more vehicles to look at, more vehicles they can purchase. We're working with a company called ACERTUS, who's in the logistics and distribution business has been for a while, and they're handling the shipping for us. I think we'll probably continue to do that through a third party for the foreseeable future. It's another one of those. It's not really a core skill of ours, and one we'll probably stay away from and let the folks who do it well continue to do it for us.

Got it. I'm getting in one question from the audience here through the webcast. In Florida, what portion of your dealers you used in new or adopting the TrueCar+? And is it getting more tractions with nonexisting dealers and maybe then add some color on why they adopt and why they don't?

Yes. The early adoption was with our core network of TrueCar dealers. We went in and installed TrueCar+ there. We have seen some uptick in the number of dealers who weren't familiar with our platform coming on because of the TrueCar+ experience. So there's a blend of both that are coming to the platform to sell TrueCar+. What we've seen is the dealers who are not signing up for the program, do it generally for 1 of 2 reasons. They don't believe in the digital aspect of car selling. They're kind of anchored in the more traditional model and are interested in a TrueCar+ type model. And then the other one is business is so good right now for dealers in their traditional business they just say, hey, my business is too good right now, come back and see me in 6 months as this market changes, and I'll take a look at your product. So we've got good adoption. We started with our own dealer network because we were familiar with them, and it was the smoothest dealers to transition onto the TrueCar+ platform.

Got it. Got it. Makes sense. Maybe if you could -- with the iteration that you did with some of the consumers, any metrics around like just average transaction time or just average inventory searches? Just trying to see -- just trying to compare it to some of the online peers like Carvana, CarMax, and also like some of the franchise dealers website, Clicklane and AcceleRide and Driveway all seem pretty slick platforms. So how much are you able to bridge that transaction time with the TrueCar+?

Yes. So there's a lot of metrics we're looking at as we test this product. So the first thing folks talk about is how fast can I do it, right? Can I get through the system? So for a very unique buyer, someone who's typically a lease customer, who's leasing their third version of a vehicle, they know what they want. They know the color they want, they know the options they want. You can go through the process clearly in 30 minutes and be done all the way to signing the buyer's order. What we're seeing that consumers really like who are using the product is the opportunity to start, save their work, go engage in another part of their life, come back, continue the shopping process. So many times it happens over a couple of days. And what consumers are telling us, it's that convenience that they really enjoy. They don't feel like they have to sit and go the whole way through it. They can create a list of vehicles, they can generate some pricing, get a value for their trade, go pick up their kids from school, come back, start again later after dinner, all those sort of things. So we're seeing the convenience elements for consumers being the big thing more importantly at this point for us than how quick can they get through it.

Got it. Got it. The -- on the Sell Your Car portion of the experience, how has that uptake been? Could you maybe highlight a few key initiatives in the pipeline specific to that Sell your Car experience? A few of your peers are providing guaranteed offers and some digital D2D auction companies are following into that space as well. So what are the key differentiators in this intensifying competitive landscape?

Yes. So because of the dealers' need and desire to buy as many used cars as they can, we've gotten a really good adoption rate for Sell Your Car. Dealers are quickly coming on to the platform. They find that they're getting vehicles from consumers that they hadn't seen in the past. So that's a very positive sign for them. And what we're seeing around Sell Your Car is that consumers love the idea of getting a guaranteed cash value. So a number of the tools out there are a little different than ours. They present a range to the consumers versus an actual cash value. We create a cash value that we'll stand behind. If the dealer doesn't want to keep the vehicle, we'll actually take it from them and move it through a wholesale network. You mentioned the dealer-to-dealer activities that are going on out there. As dealers begin to open up their sales, their retail operations to market outside of their's, we think it may reduce the number of D2D or dealer-to-dealer trades that end up going on. And we were sitting with a large retailer, just recently, you had a car at one of their dealerships in Austin that the dealer in Phoenix wanted, and they were going through the process of picking the vehicle up in Austin, trucking it to the dealer in Phoenix for it to be sold by that dealer who was part of their network versus the dealer in Austin just opening his market up to consumers in the Phoenix market and sell in the car retail. So we think as dealers open up their markets, they understand the opportunity to branch out beyond their local market. We think it will reduce the number of vehicles that have to get transferred to a wholesale dealer, to give consumers a better opportunity to look at vehicles and acquire them directly from the retailer who has it versus having it shipped from one dealer to the other dealer and then being sold to the consumer in the local market.

Got it. Got it. I have a question coming in. And this is something I wanted to ask as well, is TrueCar different from TrueCar+? When I go to the website, there's like /plus website. And so how is working with the dealer? Like is it like 2 different websites? And why is that the case?

Yes. So from a dealer perspective, it's one website. From the consumer perspective, we wanted to keep the product development for TrueCar+ pure, so we build it in a separate actual path that is \plus on our website. So there is a separate flow that's TrueCar+. We're now in the process of bringing those 2 together. And we'll use our core traffic now and expose them to the TrueCar+. But we wanted to keep them separate so that we didn't disrupt the traditional shopper who wanted to connect with a dealer to finish the transaction and then those who wanted to do the whole process online. You'll now see those come together in a single store front where we give consumers the option to choose the path they want to go down.

Got it. Got it. I have another question from the audience, which I think I'd prefer to ask at the end, it's a simple but complicated question, but maybe we'll leave that for the end. Just moving to -- just capital allocation in -- I keep getting asked the question like your stock is trading like relative to the cash per share that you have on the balance sheet, it's a pretty attractive investment. And you seem to be in an enviable position with your cash today, especially when investors are looking for cash preservation at least in the near to medium term. So what are the key priorities here in the near term? I mean how are you looking at your cash balance? Are you trying to be a little more careful, like just in the context of the environment? Are you still in the market for buyback, for M&A? Just maybe help us just recap that.

Yes. So we're -- for those of you who aren't familiar with our cash position, we're pretty excited about where we sit. We have about $235 million in cash on the balance sheet at the end of Q1 and no debt. So we're in a good position. Previously, there was a lot of questions of how are we going to allocate that capital? What are we going to use it for? Those questions have shifted a bit recently with the changing environment to, hey, it creates a nice cushion. And we are looking at it as we're in this product pivot, we do have a cushion that we can work through until we get the product right and the way we want it. So it does create an opportunity for us. We are looking at allocating some of it. We mentioned potential acquisitions, small tuck-ins, things that would accelerate our ability to get TrueCar+ to the marketplace quicker, to bring in some experience that we don't have in the company that could help us with that product is -- or some things we're looking at. We have bought stock back in the past, and we do have some funds available to reengage in that process. So -- if we choose. So we're sitting in a pretty good spot. We love our cash position. We think it creates some comfort for us and some flexibility for us that's going to be important as the market tends to tighten, inflation starts to rise. It doesn't appear to be a good time to be for cash, and we're glad that we're not in that type of a position.

Got it. Maybe just to follow up on the acquisitions. Could you elaborate a bit on the type of assets you're looking at? Is it more just tech capabilities on the existing platform? Or maybe more functionality in other parts of the supply chain that you're looking at to integrate?

So initially, we've been looking at elements to the purchase flow that may exist already in the marketplace that someone else has built. We've been looking at those opportunities for the past couple of years. The market was -- I guess I'd characterize it as a little overly frothy for an extended period of time. Things were very, very expensive. So we chose to build path. But now as valuations have started to come back a bit, it's given us an opportunity to look at some companies with very interesting technical capabilities with experience in areas that we don't have on the commerce side. And ways to do that in what we're characterizing as a tuck-in way, a small way that wouldn't put a huge -- have a huge impact on our cash, but would accelerate our road map significantly over the next year to 18 months. So those are the type of opportunities we're looking at.

Got it. Maybe shifting gears to like just the operating leverage, you're in investment mode right now with TrueCar+. How should we think about the cadence of expenses going forward? You mentioned on your earnings call that costs in the legacy business will likely remain flat, but investments in TrueCar+ will continue. So how should we think about operating leverage over the next few quarters as this continues? And are there any areas of offsets we should keep in mind, especially if the environment starts to get even more tougher?

Right. Well, the -- coming out of the Q1 call, we didn't guide going forward because of all the uncertainty in the marketplace. But we tried to set up a framework. Our expenses have settled in at around $50 million a quarter. and we can sustain the business at that going forward. And what we've looked at is the only thing that would really increase that force is when we lean into TrueCar+ from a marketing perspective. We've been restrictive on our marketing funds waiting to get some traction. Once we get that and we begin to see a tipping point, we could lean in with our current cash position and begin to fill in the top of the funnel as we're going forward. So we're introducing some new products, Sell Your Car, you mentioned, distance retailing. Hopefully, those will have a positive impact on the revenue line, and then we'll continue to manage our expenses as we go forward, similar to what you saw in Q1.

Got it. And what's a good rule of thumb to think about your variable versus fixed expense today? Are there any areas where we can see more agility in terms of ability to flex?

Yes. We've got a pretty simple business from an expense point of view. And the way our CFO explained it in the earnings call was we've really got 3 buckets that make up most of our expenses. It's our marketing that we spend in the marketplace, our headcount and then our fixed expenses. We've been very restrictive on our fixed expenses. We have a footprint in Southern California that's a little bit expensive. We had 6 different locations that we've begun to sublease. We're a distributed workforce now. Many of our folks are working from their home. So we've begin to reduce some of those expenses from a fixed cost point of view. Our headcount's, we did a restructure in the summer of 2020. So our headcount been stable since then. We haven't really added to it. We've shifted the tech and the product people from TrueCar to TrueCar+ to facilitate that development. And then marketing, we've really cranked down to a point of efficiency. And people are coming to the Internet now to try to find vehicles. You -- many of you, I'm sure, as you've driven past your local dealership's lot realized there's not a lot of cars sitting there. So the days of driving to a dealership and walking the lot and looking for a piece of inventory are kind of behind us, and we're getting a lot of traffic on our site just folks looking for cars. So we'll continue to be restrictive on the marketing, make sure we're efficient. And then when we get the right signals on TrueCar+, I think you'll see us lean in.

Got it. Got it. Maybe just to see if anyone has any questions from the audience. No. Maybe one more question before I ask the final one. You've shifted to the used vehicle opportunity leaning to that over the last couple of years. How do you see that changing your monetization mix or cross-sell ability going forward? And how big of the opportunity you see that longer term for the business?

Well, when we launched the brand back in 2012, we were very heavy new car-focused and the brand for our retail partners was very heavy skewed to the new car side. Recently, we've expanded our offerings in used. We've shifted from about an 80-20 new to used to almost 50-50 now our mix on new and used cars. We think it'll allow us to be a better full service provider for our retail partners. We'll have both new cars and used cars that we can help them with. So we think at the end of this, as new cars come back, we expect our new car business to bounce back up again, but we like the platform and the things we're able to do for our dealers on the used car side. And we think it will have them view us as a more comprehensive provider to them.

Got it. So one last question here, and this is from the audio -- from the webcast. It's a simple but complicated question, why does TrueCar need to exist?

I think TrueCar exists to be an unbiased, transparent third-party site where consumers can go to really understand. It started trying to understand the complexity of the purchase of a vehicle new or used. So we're very transparent around our pricing data. We help consumers understand what other consumers in their marketplace are paying for their car. We've been very transparent with our used car offering, and we allow consumers to shop across brands. So there's many great OEM solutions out there. There's good dealer solutions out there, but they're restrictive based on the limitations that their model provides. So if you go to an OEM site, you're only going to be able to shop one brand of vehicles. If you go to a dealer site, you're only going to be able to shop the brands that he carries. If you go to one of these vertically integrated used car providers, you only see used cars and not new. So the reason TrueCar exists is to be that comprehensive full-service marketplace for new cars across multiple brands for used cars, for certified preowned and to really give consumers a safe area to go where they can really, in a transparent way, shop for vehicles.

Great. I think that's a great way to end. And so thanks, Mike, for doing this. And also thanks Zaineb. And thanks, everyone, for joining.

Thanks, Rajat. Thanks for having Us.

Yes. No Problem.