United Therapeutics Corporation (UTHR) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

January 11, 2021

NASDAQ US Health Care Biotechnology conference_presentation 43 min

Earnings Call Speaker Segments

Jessica Fye

analyst
#1

Great. Good morning, everyone. My name is Jess Fye. I'm one of the senior biotech analysts at JPMorgan, and we're continuing the health care conference this morning with United Therapeutics. I'm joined by the company's CEO, Martine Rothblatt. And unlike in normal year where I'd send you down to the Yorkshire room for Q&A, this is going to move seamlessly into a Q&A after her presentation. If you want to participate in Q&A, there's a ask a question button on your screen. Just click on that. It sends the questions to a portal so that I can read them to management. But in the meantime, we can get started. Let me pass it over to Dewey Steadman from IR, first.

Dewey Steadman

executive
#2

Hey, good morning. Our remarks today may include forward-looking information about our business. And please see our SEC filings for risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ. Also, Martine's presentation today is available as a PDF on our website at ir.unither.com. Thanks.

Martine Rothblatt

executive
#3

Thank you, Jess. Thank you, Dewey. We're happy to be presenting at the virtual JPMorgan today. I'd like to start with Slide 3. If the organizer can bring up our Slide 3 titled, our focus. The focus at United Therapeutics is in 2 different pulmonary conditions. One is called pulmonary arterial hypertension and the other is called interstitial lung disease. Both of these conditions have a large number of subconditions, and it's generally necessary to prove that the drug is effective and safe in any particular subindication in order to be able to commercially market that product. To date, we have developed 4 FDA approvals in the area of pulmonary arterial hypertension, the #1 on the left side of your screen, and we are expecting our first FDA approval in ILD in April of this year, and we're also conducting a large Phase III trial in a specific type of ILD called interstitial pulmonary fibrosis that is enrolling starting this quarter and will continue during '21 and '22. In addition to this study, we have 4 additional Phase III studies going on. Two of these involve one of the best-in-class oral agents for treating pulmonary hypertension, called ralinepag. One of them is a study of -- in another type of pulmonary hypertension called COPD-affiliated pulmonary hypertension, and a fourth is a gene therapy potential cure for pulmonary hypertension. So quite a lot of activity going on in both pulmonary hypertension and in other types of interstitial lung diseases. If you could please move to Slide 4. I just want to do a quick check to ensure that everybody is looking at Slide 4, titled excelling in operational efficiency. I think this slide gives a good overview of where United Therapeutics stands compared to some iconic names in American business. We have a market cap per employee which is on the rank of great companies such as Amazon and Alphabet. And we have a revenue and a profit per employee which is even higher than some of the most successful names in American industry. You see these operational efficiencies perhaps most dramatically in the column called free cash flow, where free cash flow per employee at United Therapeutics tops pretty much all of the iconic and household name companies that you see on this slide. Yet while United Therapeutics stock growth over the past 18 years has been greater than even the first couple of decades of great firms such as Disney and Alphabet, Apple, it's still been not as high as some of the companies that have really taken off in their first 20 years such as Netflix and Amazon. So I think when you take a look at this dashboard overall, you see that there is tremendous upward potential at United Therapeutics. We are running a very efficient, very successful business. And I believe the value of United Therapeutics is going to be increasingly appreciated in the next few years to come. If you could please move on to Slide 5. Slide 5 is titled Tyvaso, 8 mixes of products and indications. One of the reasons we're most excited about the continued growth of United Therapeutics is because of the large number of Phase III studies and pending approvals that we have as well as the fact that for each of these new types of indications, we have 2 shots on goal. We have both a nebulizer, which delivers a liquid form of Tyvaso as well as a dry powder inhaler that develops that is much more compact and convenient for the patients to use. And so going across this chart from left to right, you could see that the Green Square called PAH, group one, FDA approved, our Tyvaso product is already approved in that area. It's now growing at a double-digit annual rate quarter-over-quarter. And we expect it to continue to do so. Now right beneath that, you could see 2021 NDA, we will be filing in April with the FDA for a dry powder inhaler that will be addressing the same indication of PAH. This is a filing which we've been able to accelerate its PDUFA date by purchasing a priority review voucher. So right here, you've got 2 shots on goal in the largest current pulmonary hypertension market, called WHO Group 1. Now if you move over to the next column over, you have a disease space called PH-ILD, also known as WHO Group 3, or at least the PH-ILD is a portion of the WHO Group 3. Here, we conducted a study called the INCREASE study during the years 2018, 2019. And we reported out that we hit all of our primary and all of our secondary endpoints in 2020 and filed for FDA approval. And the PDUFA date for the approval of this Tyvaso product in the WHO Group 3 based on the INCREASE study is April -- right at the beginning of April of this year. Now this is a very important data point to rest on for a moment because there are no approved medications, none, to treat WHO Group 3 pulmonary hypertension. This is a group of patients who have both pulmonary fibrosis as well as pulmonary hypertension. We are treating in this study, we showed we successfully treated their pulmonary hypertension. So we are quite optimistic that we will receive an approval in April of this year, and be able to launch our Tyvaso product into this virgin market of PH-ILD, where there are no other products currently approved. Now if you drop right below where it says INCREASE study, you'll see, again, 2020 NDA (sic) [ 2021 NDA ]. So the reason for that is that when we met with the FDA to discuss our dry powder inhaler, or DPI, form of Tyvaso, we were advised that an approval of that product for one pulmonary hypertension indication would cover its approval for all the different pulmonary hypertension indications where Tyvaso was approved. So because in April, we expect to get approval of Tyvaso in PH-ILD, then when our 2021 NDA is up for approval, which we expect to be in December of 2021, we should receive approval of the DPI, both in WHO Group 3 as well as the WHO Group 1 I referred to before. So just in that half of the slide, you've got a nice [4] mix of our products and indications where we will be able to market this product for both Group 1 and Group 3 and market both a nebulizer and the dry powder inhaler, providing us really with 2 shots on 2 separate goals, quite exciting. Now over on the right side of the slide, there are studies which are now underway. So on the left side of the slide, those studies are completed. On the right side of the study, we're conducting a study in another type of WHO Group 3 pulmonary hypertension, called pulmonary hypertension associated with COPD. This is called the PERFECT study. It will enroll throughout '21 and early '22. And then we would expect to be able to file for approval if we achieve successful results in that study, most likely in '23. In addition, we are also developing that same dry powder inhaler. It goes by the name Dreamboat BluHale. This is a Bluetooth-connected dry powder inhaler. In fact, this is very same one that we will file for in April of this year and hope to have approval for in December of this year. This product would also be available to be used in COPD should we successfully achieve our PERFECT study in that indication. And then last but not the least, over on the far right-hand of the slide, you see the indication idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis, or IPF. Here, we're conducting another Phase III study. This study will enroll during '21 and '22. Results will be reported out -- it's actually 2 studies -- I'm sorry, one study. Results will be reported out likely by the end of '23. And then that would allow us to hopefully launch that product in early '25. This is a study that is designed to show a disease-modifying effect in pulmonary fibrosis, something that has not been shown with any other drug. And if successful in that indication with our nebulizer, we'd expect to also be able to attack that market with our dry powder inhaler as well. So all told for Tyvaso, currently already growing at double-digit rates quarter-over-quarter -- I mean, year-over-year in the same quarter, we expect this now to be able to have 8 different combinations of drugs and indications to propel further Tyvaso growth throughout the 2020s. Next slide, please. Something that really can provide now some metrics associated with all of these new indications and new products that we have in Phase III development and pending approval. If you -- let's take a walk around this circle, starting, say, from the 11 o'clock or noon position, where it says 45,000 PAH. So that's the number of patients that are currently being treated by about 10 different approved therapies from the FDA. As mentioned, 4 of those therapies are from United Therapeutics itself. But there are a number of additional therapies, and we all compete amongst ourselves to get a share of these 45,000 patients with pulmonary arterial hypertension, also known as the Group 1, WHO Group 1. Now if you move over to the, let's say, the 1, 2 o'clock position, you'll see a line that's attached to some text that says 30,000 patients with PH-ILD. This is that patient population that we studied in our INCREASE study. This is the disease indication that we expect to be approved in April of this year, the PDUFA date is at the beginning of April of this year. This population has no approved medicine. So ours would be the first approved medicine for 30,000 patients to be able to access. So about 2/3 as much patients as we now battle among 10 different therapies for, we will have entirely available just for Tyvaso and its -- and later in the year, hopefully, its dry powder inhaler to tackle. So I mean, this is a textbook example of a transformative event for United Therapeutics. An approval in April for PH-ILD will provide us more products per drug than we've ever had in -- or anybody has ever had in the entire history of pulmonary hypertension. Now let's go down to the, say, 4, 5 o'clock position there. 100,000 PH-COPD. That's the number of patients that have this type of pulmonary hypertension associated with COPD, as I just described, we are studying that with our PERFECT study. Very similar to the PH-ILD story, there's no approved medicine for these patients, none. Ours would be the first and the only approved therapy in this patient population with a successful ride -- result in our PERFECT study. So now between the study that we've already completed and the study that's in Phase III here, we are at a substantial multiple of all of the business that we are handling currently. Finally, you get around to the back end of the clock dial here, 7, 8, 9, 10 o'clock space. You have this pulmonary fibrosis population. Where there are, in fact, 2 drugs already approved, nintedanib and pirfenidone, but both of those drugs are drugs that only slow the rate of decline in those patients' forced vital capacity. They don't improve it. They just slowed the rate of decline compared to placebo. We believe from the secondary endpoints that we measured in our INCREASE study, the one that's due to be approved based on its primary endpoint in April that based on the secondary endpoints that we all hit in that INCREASE study that we will be able to have a disease-modifying effect on idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis. Again, the first and only drug in that population and we tested that on top of the existing background drugs. So we would expect the existing background drugs to continue to be used. They, in fact, will be used in the TETON study that we're carrying out. And if we can confirm the results that we saw in the secondary endpoints of the INCREASE study as primary endpoints in the TETON study that we would have the first disease-modifying therapy for idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis. This dashboard right here really gives you a snapshot of the future potential of United Therapeutics in the 2020s. Next slide, please. Should be Slide 7. Here, you see a little graphic depiction of why we are so excited about Tyvaso in pulmonary fibrosis. At United Therapeutics, we love helping with symptoms of disease, but what really revs us up more than anything, is to be able to actually modify or even cure a disease. And here in this chart, you could see that we were able to, in fact, improve the forced vital capacity of the patients with -- who had pulmonary fibrosis as well as pulmonary hypertension by treating them with Tyvaso, whereas the 2 existing drugs for pulmonary fibrosis, nintedanib and pirfenidone, they slowed the rate of decline compared to placebo, the dash line, but they didn't improve things. And unfortunately, those patients still have a very poor prognosis. Well, we will now do this study. This was a hypothesis-generating study for us for IPF. We will now confirm those results in a registration study, the TETON study, and if we can match this same type of result in the TETON study, then we would have a disease-modifying treatment for pulmonary fibrosis. Next slide, please. In addition to all of the exciting work that we have going on with Phase III studies and in adjacent indications, pulmonary hypertension, pulmonary fibrosis, pulmonary fibrosis in interstitial lung disease and as well pulmonary fibrosis without -- with pulmonary -- without pulmonary hypertension, and pulmonary hypertension with COPD, pulmonary hypertension without COPD. So all of these exciting developments that we have going on in the next few years in pulmonary hypertension and Phase III trials, we have a lot of other exciting results going on in the area that we call drug-device combinations. So our -- one of our flagship products is called Remodulin, and it's been a great product, generates north of $0.5 billion a year in revenue. But unfortunately, 30% to 40% of the patients who need this product, this parenteral product, which it is the product that patients need, when all the other products fail because it's the most difficult one to endure being a 24-hour a day, 7-day a week, 365-day a year parenteral product. Nevertheless, 30% to 40% of the patients refuse it because of the serious concerns around the devices that need to be used to deliver this product. Now in general, I would say that there's no easy way to deliver a 365-day a year parenteral product. However, the concerns with the devices that exist today are troubling. The devices that are used for delivering the product intravenously have a very high risk of life-threatening septicemia, requiring hospitalization. One has to take great care to have completely aseptic areas for mixing and filling the drug reservoirs. Patients are not allowed to take showers or go swimming or go in the ocean. A lot of troubling aspects with the drug delivery system. Because of that, there is also a subcutaneous drug delivery system, but that has its own trials and tribulations. It is a very old drug delivery pump, has a high rate of failures associated with it. It's big and bulky. It's an advertisement that one is walking around with a medical -- have serious medicalized condition, causes a lot of site pain upon insertion into the skin. So all of these problems with these drug-devices has led to us not being able to help 30% to 40% of the patients who would otherwise be helped. This would almost double the company's revenues based on the Remodulin franchise alone, and perhaps even more because many patients stay less effective, earlier therapies because they're just not ready to go on to these therapies as soon as they should go on to them. So what we have done is undertaken a concerted effort to develop multiple next-generation devices to gain approval as drug-device combination products to help us capture this additional untapped market. Two of these, we expect to be launched during this year, 2021. One of them in the upper left-hand corner is called the implantable system for Remodulin. This is a product that would be implanted into the patients' abdomen so there would be no need for a Hickman catheter that came out of the patients' skin. No need for all of the serious concerns with septicemia and aseptic filling of the drug which surround the intravenous product today. Number two, the lower left-hand corner, Remunity. This is a product which will be launched imminently. And it is a product which is much easier and much less failure-prone than the current subcutaneous product. It's a product that will allow patients to have a much greater sense of mind. I think many a patient seeing the subcutaneous pump and saying, no, I'm not going there. They see this Remunity pump. They're going to have a much more positive indication. I've myself looked at it many times in the boxes. It looks as beautifully, elegantly presented as with a brand-new iPod or iPhone right out of Silicon Valley, just really beautifully designed product. In the interest of time, I won't talk about the other additional products, but these are some more special purpose drug-device combination products that would be coming out in, say, like the 2023 time frame. With unique features, able to mop up more of these 30% to 40% patients who are right now kind of refusing parenteral therapy. And let me finally mention that the lower left-hand corner product, Remunity, will also -- in that same 2023, 2024 time frame -- be filled with a pain-free form of Remodulin that would eliminate really the last cause why some of these patients don't want to go on to parenteral products. So a really exciting array of next-generation devices on top of all the Phase III trials that we have going on. Next slide, operator? Sorry, not operator, convener, whomever. This slide, Slide #9, is called key benefits of an expanded Orenitram label. Another of the products that posted double-digit growth rates is our Orenitram product. This is a pill form of treprostinil that has demonstrated a very constant pharmacokinetic profile across 24 hours with TID dosing. Recently, this product has been demonstrated to reduce disease progression, 61%; to have a 37% reduction of death versus placebo at study closure; and to have a much better pharmacoeconomic profile than its only other competitive product, which is the twice-daily selexipag product, also showing a reduction in disease progression, morbidity mortality. So now we have a product which is as good as the previous market leader, but pharmacoeconomically, much more sensible. And as a result, on these new legs, this product is definitely gaining on selexipag and I expect to continue to see strong double-digit revenue growth for the Orenitram product. Next slide, Slide 10. Of the -- I mentioned several Phase III studies that we're doing at the beginning of my presentation. The largest, and in many regards, the most exciting one is the study of ralinepag for pulmonary hypertension. Several analysts have referred to this as a best-in-class treatment for pulmonary hypertension. You -- it's a pill. You take it once a day. And there's some really exciting data showing its superiority over that selexipag product that I mentioned previously is a #1 competitor for Orenitram. Ralinepag is in the same class as selexipag, but has some functional G-protein activation properties that really show superiority compared to the other products in this area, and, in fact, makes it very much more like a true prostacyclin than just a prostacyclin agonist. On top of that, the PK profile of ralinepag, shown here on the left side of the slide in blue, is clearly superior to that of selexipag and clearly supports once-daily dosing. Our 2 studies for approval of ralinepag are both underway. We expect them both to be about 50% enrolled by the end of this year, fully enrolled next year, results the following year. And we have agreements with the FDA that there are kind of 3 paths to approval here. Either of the 2 studies could achieve a 0.01 and be approved on their own, or the 2 studies combined, each with 0.05 could be approved together. The reason that's a little bit salient is the 2 studies are very different in nature. One of them is going for a novel endpoint based on respiration parameters, forced expiratory volume. And that study is nice because it has a definite endpoint. We check their FEV at the beginning, and at the end of the study; and at the end of the study, that's it. So we can conclude that study a little bit more quickly. And if we do a 0.01 on that study, then we can file for approval just on that. The second study, called the outcome study, that is a traditional morbidity/mortality endpoint study, very much like we did for Orenitram and like Actelion did for selexipag. That study has a -- you don't know exactly when it's going to end because you have to wait until you have the statistically significant number of differences in morbidity/mortality endpoints between ralinepag on top of background therapy, compared to placebo on top of background therapy. But nevertheless, based on our experience with these things, I feel pretty confident that that study would read out not later than '24, allowing us to hopefully launch that product in '25, if it was not already launched based on the outcome of the FEV study, which could complete itself a little bit sooner. So again, just 2 of our multiple, very exciting Phase III studies. In the early pipeline phase, we have quite a lot of things in early pipeline: preclinical, Phase I, Phase II. During this presentation, the time is kind of limited. So I focused on the on the commercial launch and the pending approval on the Phase III stuff. But I would like to mention that in the area of preclinical activity, we've got some very exciting organ manufacturing activity going on, where we are developing genetically modified kidneys and hearts based on the pigs that have been modified by us to have 10 unique genes that make their organs compatible, as compatible with the human immune system as would the unrelated human organ donations. As well, we are developing 3D bioprinted lung lobes that would be cellularized with the patients -- with cells from -- derived from a patient's own DNA so that those lung lobes would not be subject to rejection at all. And the patients with those lung transplants would not require any immunosuppression. In addition, we've got other exciting activity in Phase I and Phase II, including one of our regenerative medicine products, exosomes, for the treatment of pulmonary -- of bronchopulmonary dysplasia. Another study with a similar version of that agent for myocarditis. We also have a once-daily formulation of Orenitram, and, as I mentioned before, a painless form of Remodulin. So quite a bit of activity in the Phase I, Phase II and preclinical area in addition to all of the Phase III and near-approval stuff I talked about at the beginning. If we can move to Slide 12, let's bring everything -- snap everything right back to 2021. What are the catalysts? I think there are 4 main catalysts for this year. Commercial launch of Remunity is imminent. Next up in April would be the PDUFA date for the INCREASE study that would allow us to launch into this 30,000 patient virgin market, and we've, in fact, created a dedicated sales force to do that -- just that. Next up, more like in the third quarter would be the time frame for commercial launch of the implantable system for Remodulin, once and for all, eliminating both the site pain and the septicemic risks associated with the delivery systems for Remodulin that have impeded so many patients from going on to parenteral therapy. And then finally, toward the back end of the year, an anticipated launch of our dry powder inhaler for Tyvaso, also known as TreT, and known in terms of its drug-device combination, the Dreamboat inhaler. So 4 very exciting catalysts for our business. I believe each of these catalysts in their own way are going to continue contributing to the double-digit revenue growth that we've seen over the past couple of quarters. And moving on to Slide 13. So I think the take-home message for United Therapeutics is returning to revenue growth. If you take a look at this bar chart, I think that in 2017, we provided everybody kind of a heads-up that 2 types of exclusivity were going to be lost. Exclusivity on one of our oral products, Adcirca, for which we did not expect there to be any alternative to generic product, and we provided heads-up that there would be a drop in revenue due to that loss of exclusivity. At the same time frame, we also lost exclusivity on Remodulin. And we also provided the market a heads-up, but a very different heads-up. For Remodulin, we said we do not expect there to be a generic cliff or even a generic slope because of numerous unique features associated with Remodulin. We expect those revenues to be stable and then to continue growing. And so you can see exactly what we forecast in 2007 (sic – 2017), 2018, coming true here in 2019 and at least with the benefit of consensus, 2020, that there are the 2 years of revenue dropping due to that loss of exclusivity on Adcirca. But the revenue then stabilizes. There is no further drop of revenue associated with the Remodulin franchise. Those revenues have stabilized. And now we expect be driven by Remodulin with all of those new devices I showed you, driven by Tyvaso, with all of those new indications I showed you, and driven by Orenitram with that new -- all of those new label claims I showed you. We expect a continuation of double-digit growth that we had early in the company's lifetime. I've just shown here this figure, 10%. There's -- it's not guidance. I think actually, we should be able to do better than 10%. But it just is a -- it's a metric to show you that the direction and the general slope at which I believe things will go in the next few years. So thanks, everybody, for your attention during this Zoom lecture, and I'm happy now to not have to enter into a jam-packed, crowded JPMorgan hallway and battle my way to the breakout room. But instead, to welcome my Co-Executives, Mike Benkowitz, our President and Chief Operating Officer; James Edgemond, our Chief Financial Officer; and Dewey Steadman, our Chief Questioning Officer, to join me in the breakout room here under Jess's guidance.

Jessica Fye

analyst
#4

Great. Well, maybe with the limited time we have for questions, you announced the purchase of this PRV to use with Tyvaso DPI. And I think it costs about $100 million. But one question we get a lot from investors is about the capital allocation strategy of the company. So obviously, you saw value in this voucher, but what other types of assets do you see value in? How might you kind of deploy the company's capital going forward?

Martine Rothblatt

executive
#5

Yes. Thanks so much for the question, Jess. Generally, I'd love to hear James's take on capital allocation. He's our Chief Financial Officer. He has done an awesome job of that to date.

James Edgemond

executive
#6

Great. Thanks, Martine. Thanks, Jess. And there's 2 questions embedded, I think, in there. One is capital allocation. And our capital allocation strategy continues to be investing in our internal research and development activities. And the second one is business development activities. And the third is share repurchase. And those are the opportunities that we see going forward. As an example, Martine talked about and we've talked about the TETON studies. So when looking internally at our R&D programs, we feel investing in these programs creates a lot of value long term as we continually look for the highest and best use of our financial resources. The second question is really around business development opportunities, and we look for these every day. There is a group of people internally to UT that continue to scour the landscape looking for opportunities that are complementary to what we do. But if we also look at things in rare pulmonary disease or cardiovascular as well, but at the end of the day, it goes back to what Martine has said earlier. We look for opportunities where we think we can provide great value and there's little competition. So we're looking for those opportunities where we think we can invest and continue to drive the growth forward in the long term. So thank you very much, and back to you.

Jessica Fye

analyst
#7

Great. And maybe we can switch to Tyvaso with the upcoming addition of the PH-ILD indication. Given the unmet need in that setting, can you kind of frame for us how to think about a potential inflection in Tyvaso revenues? Is this something where we could see rapid uptake? Is there going to be a more gradual education process for physicians to kind of get the data out of them? How should we think about this affecting Tyvaso sales?

Martine Rothblatt

executive
#8

Thanks so much for the question, Jess. I'm going to ask Mike if he could address it. He's been running the launch program, and he built up a whole new dedicated sales force for it. It's tremendously exciting. And Mike, if you could share with her and everybody else in the virtual room here, some of our excitement about the launch rate for them.

Michael Benkowitz

executive
#9

Sure. Happy to do it. Yes, I think everybody here at United Therapeutics is incredibly excited about the opportunity in ILD, and, honestly, has been working really hard since last summer to prepare and get ourselves ready for this launch, which we hope and expect will be in April. So to your question, Jess, I mean there is an education that has needed to happen and will continue to need to happen, but we started that process with our medical team last summer in terms of reaching out to these physicians. In a lot of cases, these are new physicians, new prescribers that we have not historically called on. There's only about a 20% to 25% overlap between the doctors that treat our PAH patients and those that treat ILD. So it's a new prescriber base. And so we've had to get out and start to meet these doctors, introduce them to United Therapeutics, talk to them about pulmonary hypertension associated with ILD, share the increased data. And so in that cadre of physicians, they certainly share our excitement and enthusiasm, and it just made us more, I think, more focused and confident that we're going to have a really successful launch and be able to do -- bring a therapy that's really going to help these patients. So that education process has been ongoing, like I said last summer. It will need to continue on into the future. Not so much around the disease, although there's an element of that, but I think a lot of it is also around how do you diagnose, how do you prescribe, how do you initiate therapy on Tyvaso? So those are things that are going to be new to these physicians. They're not accustomed to having -- to have their patient do a right heart cath. And so just -- and again, not really a barrier to us, but it's just a process of going through and educating. So we're doing that. And like I said, really excited about it in terms of a launch trajectory. I mean, I think rapid versus graduals in a lot of ways, it's in the eye of the holder. If you look at how things move in PAH, we often feel like they move at sort of a glacial pace. So we don't expect that. We do expect something to be much more rapid in the ILD space for another reason that there's no other treatment option for these patients. And so if you just kind of think about it, numbers-wise, we have -- we've got a market opportunity of roughly 30,000. We think that's conservative. We currently have, ballpark, 3,000 patients on Tyvaso in PAH in a very competitive space. So we would expect that if we're sitting here, 15 to 18 months from now that we're -- we've got at least as many patients on -- in PH-ILD on Tyvaso, if not more than what you would have on the PAH side, and then just continuing to take off from there.

Jessica Fye

analyst
#10

Okay. Great. Well, we're out of time, so we'll have to end it there. But thanks, guys.

Martine Rothblatt

executive
#11

Our pleasure.

James Edgemond

executive
#12

Thank you.

Michael Benkowitz

executive
#13

Thank you. Bye.

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