ZoomInfo Technologies Inc. (GTM) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Okay. Awesome. Hello, everyone, and thanks so much for coming to the UBS 2022 TMT Conference. My name is Taylor McGinnis, and I'm the lead analyst of this mid-cap application, SaaS communication space on our software team. And with me, we have ZoomInfo's CFO, Cameron Hyzer. So Cameron, thanks so much for joining us.

Thank you for having us.

Yes, of course. And then I'll ask a bunch of questions, but I'll leave about 5 to 10 minutes at the end. There's QR codes in front of everyone on these pieces of paper. So if you want to scan the QR code, submit your questions, I have an iPad up here, and I'll read them at the end. So perfect. Well, Cameron, sure, lots of people in the audience are very familiar with ZoomInfo, but maybe you can just take a second to give a brief description of the company and obviously talk about the evolution of the product.

Yes, absolutely. So at ZoomInfo, we're super focused on helping salespeople and increasingly more marketing and operations and talent acquisitions. Folks really do a better job every day. And we do that by offering them a platform that has high-quality data and insights about the companies and prospects that they're reaching out to as well as the people that work at those companies, and we think of as intent data that helps identify companies that are in market for your particular service. We were founded in 2007. So at the beginning, it was almost entirely a data platform, really focused on just the companies that you're selling to. And what we've been able to do over the last few years is really add on to that data platform to include application-level tools to help people automate their emotions, to help people with conversation intelligence and chat, to provide more operations capability to orchestrate and route data, and then also added a talent acquisition platform, it's called our TalentOS, that helps recruiters find people really from a passive search perspective, giving them data about people that they may want to reach out to, as well as a MarketingOS platform, which is really an ABM platform that helps marketers create an audience of kind of specific people that they want to be reaching out to and then driving emotions through that as well.

Perfect. And maybe I'll start just dive, again, with a big question that those that are close to the story I have, which is a couple of weeks or so ago, you laid out the potential for high-teens growth next year. Could you just maybe provide more color, right, on the type of macro that's potentially embedded in that? Is this a worst-case scenario? And then maybe you can talk about what that type of scenario assumes based on what you guys are seeing today in terms of activity in the pipeline, right, churn and things like that?

Yes. So I never like to think of anything as a worst-case scenario, but it certainly assumes that the macro environment gets worse than what we're seeing today and stays that way for the entire year. We like to think about sequential growth in terms of revenue, really annualized revenue growth as an indicator of the in-period activity that we're seeing. In Q3, we grew about 6.5%. We're guiding to something that's more like 4% in Q4. And certainly, if you kind of see that worsened environment through the entirety of the year, that's what the math gets you to is that high-teens discussion that we went through. Yes, I think if you peel that back in terms of net retention and new sales, that would assume that both of those degrade at some level to ultimately get there.

Yes. And then maybe diving into something that you said on last earnings call, you talked about the potential for dollar-based net expansion rate to return to the 105%, 108%, 109%, [indiscernible] 116%. I believe that comment was a full year comment, which if, it hasn't retraced to those levels as of 3Q, I believe then the math would assume that you'd have to see dollar-based net expansion rate in 4Q either be at best maybe around 100, right, or even maybe sub that? But maybe you can provide like -- I think there's a lot of different people doing a lot of different math around that and trying to see what does that assume? And then what would it take to get there, whether that be increase in churns, downsells? So maybe you can just help like with some of the logic and understanding the 4Q dynamics?

Yes. So certainly, we've done a bunch of analysis and looked at what we were expecting in the fourth quarter. What we've seen is that the scrutiny that's being placed on deals today is really impacting our account management team more than anything else. They're spending over 20% more time on just getting to really a similar outcome that they got to before in terms of straight renewals, and that's impacting their ability to go out and find other pockets in the organization where they've historically been able to sell incremental seats and incremental data. I think if you go through the math and look at, say, bookings throughout the year, you do see that our bookings are more weighted to Q4 and really to the end of Q3. So I think your kind of extrapolation is probably a little aggressive. But overall, certainly, our expectation is, is that the incremental scrutiny that's being placed on deals, we don't see that changing. It really elevated in September as we've kind of talked about before, and we're continuing to see kind of similar scrutiny as we move through Q4. And that continues for some time as companies are really grappling with what are their forward-looking prospects look like? Is there a recession coming? How hard would that landing potentially be? And as a result of that, thinking about how they are investing into software and what they're scrutinizing in terms of their existing spend. I think the thing that gives me a lot of comfort in terms of how we think about that is from a churn and downsell perspective, we're seeing some headwind against that, but it might just be a point or 2 difference based on what we saw in Q3. And so we're kind of largely getting to the same outcome at the end of the day. Just the capacity around our ability to go out and upsell into other parts of the organization has been constrained, and we're working through ways that we can hopefully help our team to regain some of that efficiency until the buying patterns normalize at some level.

Yes, I want to talk about the sales efficiency piece, but I guess before we do, could you maybe talk to -- you mentioned that a lot of the scrutiny, right, is more on this seat and the data expansion side, right? And I think you made a comment, I think, recently in the last couple of weeks talking about how of expansions, that's 80% of like the expansions that you guys will see? So can you may be like provide color to the group on how much of like the pricing model, right, is tied to that seat and data expansion? What that looks like? And in the case that you might see some of those like downsells, I think you've done a good job articulating the sensitivity there from a seat and data perspective?

Yes. So I think I've talked about this before, but as a kind of a refresher, our pricing model is such that there's a base platform fee that everyone pays and when we scale up based on data as well as seats that people are buying. And if I look at just the platform fee and the seat component, in terms of that scaling, they're both a little below 50% of our revenue. So most of our revenue comes from the platform fee, and then the seats that are scaling up, and -- but they're relatively balanced. So if you think about, on average, people are adding, I don't know, 5% more seats, that might be a 2% or 3% increase to revenue. And the same is true on the downside, if you're reducing your seats by 5%, it's probably a 2% to 3% reduction in the overall revenue. Now that is very different depending on the size of the company. So the platform fee is the same for everyone. So if you're a very large company that's spending $1 million with us, your platform fee might be $40,000 or $50,000, like that's a -- that means that you're mostly levered to seats. And at the end of the day, there are economies of scale in terms of the seats. So when you're both purchasing that incremental seat at the end is still worth less than it's kind of seat component, but it's more levered to seats. If you're a smaller company, and let's say you have a 25,000 platform fee and 25,000 in seats, if you're reducing seats by 5%, then it's far lower percentage of what your revenue difference would be. But overall, across the board, I think it was kind of relatively balanced between the two.

Got it. That's helpful. And then on the other piece to this is what you've talked about on some of the sales capacity hurdles, right? And so some of that just stemming from ZoomInfo has a very efficient sales model today, right? And as those renewals are taking a little bit longer, that's taking resources. I think you've said away from upsells and things like that. So could you maybe talk about like the steps that you guys have taken, right, to combat this? And is it possible that there might even have to be changes to your go-to-market motion given that it's predominantly an inside sales model today? So is there any changes on like the sales strategy, right? And then also to permit like an investment perspective, what you guys are doing there?

Sure. So really no changes in terms of the sales strategy. We are always looking to incrementally improve what we do. That's part of our kind of ethos as a company, but no wholesale changes. Some of the things that we've really focused on is, again, because the renewals themselves are starting to eat into discretionary time that salespeople can go in other places, we've actually carved out certain parts of our SDR function that we felt would be better served moving into a renewal motion to help take care of a lot of the kind of routine tasks that need to be done just to get a renewal done and to take that time off the place of a core AM that can then go focus on some of the higher-value activities that they could be doing to push upsells. So that's certainly something that we're leaning into and seeing some level of success there. We've also borrowed from some of our new sales motions. And we've done this to some extent on the account management side, but we've leaned in a lot harder in terms of looking at the data and propensity to upsell, what the potentiality of a potential customer would be and really been more prescriptive with our account managers on which people they should focus on, particularly in a world where the environment is changing relatively quickly. We actually view that we can take data and real-time data on what's happening and provide that information back to the AMs to help them prioritize better than they can necessarily decide that this customer, that customer is worth spending more time on. So those efficiency efforts are very much underway and something we've started really at the beginning of Q4 that we expect to help mitigate some of the efficiency challenges that we get from greater scrutiny, but I don't think it's going to be the silver bullet answer to get us back to where we want to get to in terms of efficiency, but it will certainly help. Over time, our expectation is that the environment will normalize. And like -- I don't know when that's going to happen, but at some point, I fully expect that the environment will normalize. And when that does happen, I expect the scrutiny on deals will get back to, again, a more normalized level. And when that happens, it will actually -- as we continue to build capacity within the sales team, I'd actually expect that to help efficiency as well.

Got it. And then the next question that we get a lot on this is related to the near-term margin trajectory, right? And so the question being that, hey, if this is a sales capacity hurdle, does that mean you have to invest in more sales resources? And then is there a risk that you won't see -- are these risks that we won't see any like margin upside next year, right, if growth really is impacted? So I guess, one, what's your response to that? And then two, are there other areas in the model where you guys are looking at potential leverage in the near term?

Yes. So we've always been committed to increasing margins as growth moderates. I think that's the way most software companies should operate. And our expectation is that we still will deliver operating leverage in the kind of short to medium term. I think the difference is exactly what you pointed out versus my kind of prior mental model is when we do have this external pressure on sales and marketing efficiency, we aren't going to realize the same level of operating leverage from sales and marketing than you otherwise would. And that's core place where we would realize leverage. So my expectation is instead of seeing a step function in terms of margins, we'll see a more gradual improvement over time. And that our margins do have some seasonality to them in Q1. There are less days to recognize revenue, and there are some seasonal increases in benefits, costs and other things that make Q1 a lower margin quarter. But on a seasonally adjusted basis, I think we expect to continue to see margins move up gradually. And then -- and I think a lot of that is going to come from the other areas of the business, whether that's cost of service or G&A, maybe to a lesser extent, R&D. Our expectation that for sales and marketing expenses as a percentage of revenues that we expect that to remain relatively constant or maybe even increase as we're continuing to build capacity to overcome the efficiency pressures that we're facing. But yes, as we said before, once we get to a normalized environment and who knows when that will happen, but our full expectation is that, at that point, we'll actually see that efficiency on the sales and marketing side improve, which should lead to re-acceleration of revenue growth and operating leverage from the sales and marketing line item as well.

Got it. Yes, so on that last point, I'd love to talk about more of like the near term -- or the medium-term margin potential. So I think you've talked about how you guys have been investing more in an enterprise sales model. So maybe you can give an update there, right? And to the extent of any of that was driven by some of the software push that you've been making? And I'm going to give you 2-parter. So the second part -- a lot of 2-parters. But the second part being that as you make that push, I think there's some questions that as you move from being more of a data business right to a software business, are the margins that you have today sustainable, right? And maybe that's both from a sales and marketing perspective, but also gross margin. So maybe you can address.

All right. So you'll have to keep me on track as we go through these.

Sure, a lot of you...

But I think to start with the enterprise motion, it is something that we've invested in a significant amount over the past probably 18 months, really kind of focused on bringing in people that are able to not just make an additional transactional sale, but to gather disparate parts of the organization together, drive consensus and have kind of everyone contribute budget into a bigger deal that ultimately is better for our customers and I think creates more consistency for us. So that's been a motion that we've been pretty excited about. I still think there's work to do in terms of improving that, but it's been going pretty well. And I think that's evidenced by a couple of the larger deals we've seen. Just in Q3, we had our largest upsell deal ever. It's multiple million dollar upsell versus a customer that was already at $1 million or close to that. And so I think we see a number of those opportunities where we continue to drive real growth and real value to our customers by adjusting the engagement model to meet them at an enterprise level as opposed to individual transactions along the way, and it's an area that we'll continue to lean into. Ultimately, from an efficiency perspective, yes, that's a heavier motion with kind of more expensive people, but it's also a lot more dollars at the end of the day. So from an efficiency perspective, as we've seen those people kind of mature and grow in the organization, I think they get to a similar efficiency level than just the transactional pieces along the way. It's just there's a little bit more ramp time in that, but certainly baked into what we've been doing historically. Part of that is driven by incremental software, particularly in the OperationsOS side, where customers are looking to incorporate data, not just into our platform and the motions they're running off our platform, but also integrate that with other motions that they're running throughout the organization. That's a big area where we see enterprises really kind of digging in. And Henry has talked about this a couple of times, but if you think about CRM systems in general in like large organizations, they implemented CRM. They put a lot of data in, and they started to build applications on top of that. They skip this whole level of really keeping that data clean and accurate over time. Your CRM system is one of the few places where you're not just tracking your own transactions and deals that are going on, but you have information about your customers, and that information is changing daily. Really no customer looks the same on December 31 as they did on January 31. You have people that are moving to different organizations, that are being promoted. You have companies that are acquiring companies. You have all sorts of changes that are going on. And that creates a disconnect between the data that you have in your system that you input it at one point and probably not fully accurate or complete when you input it, particularly if you're just relying on a salesperson to kind of put in information about their customers, but then it decays over time relatively rapidly. So having a system like ZoomInfo that can enrich that data and kind of cleanse it and keep it accurate over time is something that I think we see every modern go-to-market team wanting to implement on top of their system. And for the largest customers, that can be a big driver of incremental value to them and obviously, revenue for us. So I think that having the enrichment and operations capabilities as well as having Chorus as well as having Engage as well as having the ABM capabilities through the MarketingOS are all things that are driving more value for those larger customers. When I peel that back a little and think about software versus [indiscernible] larger customers and the margin profile overall, I do think about it in terms of just the natural line items of the income statement. And realistically, I think as we've developed more software and kind of drive more value with our customers, we found that the difference between us and a number of other software companies is, at some levels, more driven by who we are and in terms of our focus on efficiency, our leverage of our own system, et cetera, than necessarily it being a kind of data versus software thing. If I think about sales and marketing, in particular, we lean in super hard to using our own system to drive efficiency. And honestly, it should help us more than other folks because we're leveraging the system at a [indiscernible] in terms of real-time enrichment, prioritization, really kind of driving that next generation of kind of capabilities, much more so than anything else. And so if you think about sales and marketing, which is the largest kind of line item in terms of expense for us as well as many other software companies, that's not something that we see kind of changing significantly just because it's selling software. And one caveat to that, we are super focused in terms of everything we build or potentially acquire at it being easy to sell and fitting in with our kind of motion. So it's not like we're selling something that requires a 2-year implementation cycle and all of those things, everything that we kind of develop or sell is meant to be a fast sales cycle with a really obvious ROI for the customer and a quick time to value in terms of implementation. Realistically, we're selling value at the end of the day. So that is a fairly similar kind of efficiency either way. If I think about G&A, like there's no difference. If I think about the cost of service, in reality, there are some kind of different line items. But when we've acquired companies like Chorus, that had a much higher cost of service component to them, when we go in and we think about what's being wastefully spent there or where they just added things on in order to grow quickly as opposed to be thoughtful about how they're spending, we were able to bring their cost of service from something that was well over 20% to something that's much closer in line with ours within a year. So again, more focus on efficiency less that it's software versus data, something like that. I think the one place where there is probably more of a structural difference is in the R&D line item. Realistically, when we -- before we really were developing significant incremental software, R&D was kind of mid to high single digits in terms of a percentage of revenue. As we've invested into our own development efforts and obviously brought on other companies as well, that's now up in the kind of low teens. And I think if you think about it from a weighted average perspective, and it's not 100% software versus data, but I'm just going to start that way. If you think about 75% is really of our revenue or 70% of our revenue is really company and contact data and the other 30% is advanced functionality, which is largely more software-specific. And you say, okay, take a 6%, 7%, 8% kind of percentage of revenue, which I think is in line with what you've seen in a lot of other data companies against 70%, then you take something that's more like 20% for the 30%, you get to the level that we're at today. And I think as we continue to grow software, we'll be able to become more in line with some of the other more scaled software companies, which is really high teens, maybe even mid- to high teens investment into R&D. So as that becomes a bigger portion, the percentage of revenue for that portion will come down a little, and I think we're pretty comfortable in the low teens investment level and should be able to see that continue for a really long time.

Yes, that was really, really helpful. Maybe then talking about like the upsell potential, right, or the cross-sell potential that you have in a lot of these areas. So you talked about that advanced functionalities, 30% of the business. You have a lot of new areas with Chorus and accounts-based marketing, right? So could you maybe just talk about, one, I guess, what are the opportunities that maybe are small today, but that get you really excited where you say, "Hey, in the medium term, these could be more material like drivers of the business stand-alone?" And then two, as we think about dollar-based expansion rate and where that could go, forgetting at the levels and obviously, the macro headwind that we're seeing today, what are your thoughts there?

Yes. So when we think about each of the kind of different components of advanced functionality, there's real opportunity kind of across the board. I talked before about the OperationsOS and where as many of our larger customers are seeing real value from integrating in high-quality data into all of their motions and orchestrating data across the different things that they're doing. From a MarketingOS perspective, like super early. We rolled that out in March, and it's already displacing some point solutions that you see in the market out there. It's already enterprise-grade. We see real large companies leaning in. And it's interesting what account-based marketing and the MarketingOS really allows you to do is be more surgical with your marketing spend. You're developing a business persona-based audience which, in reality, there's no place that you can really do that today with data outside of your own CRM aside from LinkedIn. If you want to go target directors of facilities on the West Coast for companies with over 1,000 employees in certain industries, the only place you're going to do that is in LinkedIn. And it's a great business that continues to do well, but they're only selling LinkedIn inventory, right? They're selling those folks. What we allow you to do is create that audience and then run it through all of your other motions, whether that's online advertising, other social venues, you can push it through an e-mail marketing campaign, you can push it up to your own SDRs. And so yes, I think that's something that we're really excited about. And not only is that great for marketing, but it also helps to align marketing with the sales team that's already using ZoomInfo to run a lot of their motions. And I think that's been a target of a lot of marketing and sales teams is to become more coordinated between the two of them, and we're offering a really nice bridge to help them do that. I think about Chorus and Engage, really interesting capabilities to help your sales team be more effective and efficient, whether that's on the training side, whether it's templatizing your motions or standardizing how you do things, so that then you can run analytics to improve those as you continue. So really, all of those, I think we see is becoming kind of bigger contributors. I often like to think about -- I've walked through this example with a few people, but if you're, call it, 25 to 50-seat implementation, you might be spending like $50,000 on our advanced platform just to get company and contact data. If you add on Intent and Chorus and Engage and kind of fully within the SalesOS side, that could be a 6-figure deal. Marketing could be another 6-figure deal. Operations could be another 6-figure deal. So if you think about advanced functionality, could actually, in that particular customer, would be 5:1 in terms of the revenue that we would be generating. So there's certainly opportunity for the advanced functionality become a much bigger percentage and over time, maybe even more than half of the revenue that we're generating.

Perfect. And I just want to give a reminder, if you have a question today, use the QR code in front of you because I'll be getting to that in a couple of minutes. Cameron, you also mentioned in that the opportunity for consolidation, right? And I'd love to hear what you're seeing both on the sales intelligence side, right? And if you are starting as the macro weakens -- if you're starting to see customers come to you guys about consolidation on the sales intelligence side? And then two, if you're even starting to see that with Chorus and some of these other areas as well?

Yes. So I think we've been kind of talking with customers about consolidation for a little while. It's a pretty obvious thing to do if you have 5 or 6 different vendors that your salespeople are using to help drive their motions. That's a lot to manage. It's a lot to train people on. It's a lot to make sure that those are coordinated and you're not seeing things fall through the cracks. And so it's a relatively obvious thing that, a, we bundle that together. We can save you money on that and provide you a better experience overall. But it is a somewhat complex sales discussion. Because just to start out with, I don't know any company that has 5 different vendors that all expire at the same time. So you need to navigate that. You need to navigate change management. You need to navigate other things. So in the first half of the year, I think we had a lot of discussions with people, but there wasn't a ton of action. What we're starting to see now in the second half of the year is more action around people actually pulling the trigger to take out other applications that they may be using, and whether that's other intent data, whether that's other kind of company data, whether that's conversation intelligence or sales automation, ABM platforms, all of those things are really starting to see a little bit more momentum. In terms of customers going to that consolidation story in order to drive more value and frankly simplify their motion so that they can execute on a better going forward. But it's because of the complexity in the kind of sales discussion, I don't see that as just being like a tidal wave where everyone does it all at once. But we'll continue to pick those off over time. And yes, really help our customers, ultimately, do better with their sales motions?

Yes. And then thinking about the sales intelligence opportunity, not just with new verticals, right, or more of like these emerging verticals for you guys, but also to you, just like within your existing customer base, I think you guys have expressed, like comfort that you're still underpenetrated there, right? And there's lots of room to go. So can you just give a little bit more color there, share any -- if there's any interesting customer anecdotes you have that kind of capture, I guess, that opportunity? And is it really that, hey, underpenetrated and that maybe you guys land for most of the sales department, what's the marketing department, right? That's the opportunity or maybe it's different sales divisions, like how -- maybe you could just like...

Yes, I mean I think in almost every deal we do, we land with a part of the sales department. So it's almost always, there's a VP level person or director-level person, that might have, I don't know, 10 to 20 to 50 to 100 people within their team. That they're making that purchase decision for their team overall. And when you're a small company, that may be the entire sales team. But in larger companies, that's inevitably part of the sales organization. And in all of those opportunities, there's potential to expand into other places. We did have one deal. So we landed our largest deal ever. In Q3, it was a $1 million ACV deal where it was discussed at the highest levels it was over 1,000 seats upfront. They were largely having the conversation of, "Look, we can just forgo our next 10 hires." If you think about you're paying these people $150,000, $200,000 a year, more than pay is for the $1 million price tag for ZoomInfo. And if we can make our 1,000-person team more than 1% better, then it automatically pays for itself relative to what they were going to do. But that sort of high-level kind of full, call it, wall-to-wall discussion as by far the exception. It's not the norm. So in almost all of our customers, their opportunities, even in many of our -- 1,000 seat kind of deployments, there are opportunities to continue to grow just in terms of getting to other parts of the organization, whether that's other divisions, whether it's mid-market versus enterprise, whether it's geographies, that's a significant opportunity for us. And then as we bring on more and more functionality, that's where we're even more likely penetrated within all of those groups. So having a fully integrated experience is something that we've really invested in this year. So that when you're using the SalesOS, you kind of have embedded functionality for sales automation. You have your templates in there already. You can kind of click to e-mail directly from the system. You have your Chorus conversations embedded within the system so that you have one pane that you're using across the board, and that creates even more smooth upsell opportunities for us with those customers where they don't have that functionality today.

Yes. And let's talk about the value that you bring to those new logos because I think what was very interesting across the front office space, you had a lot of front [ office software ] companies that talk to about, hey, expansion rates coming in. But new logos generally were very healthy, and I know that they were for you guys. So can you talk a little bit about that? What are you seeing on the new logo front given that a lot of your growth comes from new logos today, right? As we look into next year, any high-level thoughts you can share there, too?

Yes. So we do consider to see strength on the new logo side. I think it's still impacted by the kind of greater macro environment, but not near to the extent that the existing customers are. And I attribute a bunch of that, and I think this was true of a lot of front-office software folks is that -- from a new sales perspective, we're generally not selling into an IT budget. We're generally selling to the sales leader themselves. And they're making a trade-off, right? They have a certain amount of budget and dollars that they need to hit in terms of delivery. If you can -- like the -- or kind of largest land we've ever done, you convince yourself that you're taking heads out of your budget in order to pay for this and make your team more effective, then that's not an IT decision, that's just an operational decision for you as a company. And so that's still the sales process we go through. Even at a smaller scale, it might be -- I'm not going to replace someone who leaves or I'm going to forego one head, that easily pays for a base-level subscription that might be $50,000 or whatever it is. If the rest of my team becomes more efficient and makes up for that, then that's a good outcome for me. And so that discussion is the typical new sales discussion that even -- and especially if the world is getting harder for people to sell into, having high-quality data and insights to drive those discussions and to prioritize where you folks are spending time, it's always going to get you a benefit. On the existing customer side, I think it's a little bit different where -- I'm one of them, so maybe I'm part of the problem. But there are a lot of CFOs or procurement teams that are saying, "Okay, everyone's bought a lot of software. We need to dig in and understand where we're really getting the value for that and where we're not. On the front office side again, if you're buying this of your own like budget without really kind of going to the CFO to ask for incremental dollars, maybe they haven't looked at it before, and they're kind of digging in for the first time in terms of scrutiny, which I think that's what's slowing us down a little and putting pressure on our efficiency. And realistically, I think we're getting to largely the same outcome with respect to the kind of churn and downsell, maybe a point or 2 impact in this year so far, but it's not kind of -- it's not any more than you would have expected. But there is an incremental scrutiny that's coming. And so I think that, that dynamic is a little different, particularly in today's buying environment.

Got it. And then we have one from the group, which is just how has the competitive landscape evolved over the last 2 years?

Yes. So certainly, for us, we've gotten into a lot more space. So I think we've gotten into areas that we didn't compete in before, and there are a number of niche kind of competitors in those spaces. So I think we have a broader array of competitors that are out there, but there's really still no one that provides the entire platform that we do and is able to deliver value, both on the kind of company data perspective, the contact data perspective, the intent data perspective, and then all the other applications that we deliver around that. I think that most of our competitors are relatively niche players. Many of them are private that are competing in like one area. So you might have a company that's only providing sales automation. You might have another person that's only providing intent. You might have another person that's only providing ABM-type platforms. So there are a number of those competitors that provide kind of niche solutions, but no one that has the overall platform. And I think in -- when I look at the kind of environment for those private companies, it's going to be tough. You look at a lot of them, they're either reducing their resources in terms of people, they're talking a lot more about their paths to profitability, they're going to have to rationalize their kind of cost structure in order to deliver that. And so while we haven't seen a lot of significant reductions in their activity, you also don't see any more of them than we used to. And I think that a tough environment enables the cream to rise to the top. And I think we're excited about that opportunity for us.

Perfect. We have 10 seconds left, but I'll give you another one, taking all those seconds, and that's just on privacy. I think in a remote world, right, when you have a lot people that are working from home, right, maybe people are using their mobile phones, right, to a greater extent? Is that, I guess, [indiscernible] the data collection at all, right, where maybe people are starting to use like mobile phones, right, different e-mail -- like different e-mails, right, in order to be communicated with? And then I think there's several privacy laws going into effect in the U.S., right, California, Colorado and others. So just curious, is there anything to be aware of on that front as we go into next year?

So in my 2 seconds...

Yes.

I think we invest a lot and are very kind of excited about our privacy stance. A big part of that is we have a mechanism and capability that's like far above any of the regulations that are out there. So by delivering notice and choice to everyone within our database, delivering tools to all of our enterprise customers where they can tune how they want to kind of deal with privacy, and frankly, just by being upfront and transparent about everything that we do, I think we feel really comfortable in that we're far and above many of those regulations that are coming into place. Honestly, many of those regulations, I believe Colorado as an example, like they fully carve out business contact information and kind of they carve that out as not being private at all. So if you're in Colorado and you go to a data collector and you say, "I don't want to be in your database, like they're fully within their rights to say, no, it's not private." We obviously don't do that. We fully respect everyone's rights at the level that's above all of the regulations. So I think that gives us a good platform to operate with. And frankly, for our largest customers, who are focused on privacy, it creates a real moat where they aren't going to go to some small data company that doesn't have the same vigor and compliance policies and processes in place because if they're worried about how they would be foreseeable from a regulatory perspective and a reputational perspective, if they weren't using the kind of highest quality systems that are out there.

Yes, it's really interesting. Awesome. Well, Cameron, thank you so much for your time. This was great. And thank you all in the audience for attending as well, too.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Okay.