ABB India Limited (500002) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to ABB India Limited Q2 CY 2026 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded and any unauthorized recording of this call is strictly prohibited. The recording will be made available on the company's and service website subsequently. I now hand the conference over to Mr. T. K. Sridhar, Chief Financial Officer of ABB India Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you, Robin. Good evening, everyone, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Q2 2026 earnings call of ABB India Limited. So along with me is Mr. Sanjeev Sharma, the Managing Director of ABB India. And also we have Kiran Dutt with EL business along with Ganesh from ELDS Distribution Solutions. And then also we have G. Balaji from Automation. And Sanjeev Arora is not available as he is traveling. So we will have the call with all 5 of us in this particular time. Sanjeev, would like to start now?

Thank you, Sridhar, and good evening, everyone. We are very mindful of the fact that all of you have taken time on Friday evening to attend this call. We really are appreciated for this accommodation. And today, the way we'll run the call, there's a slight change, as you know, T.K. Sridhar for a long period of time. He has been CFO of the company and also has been managing Investor Relations. You have known him from that position. In the month of May, kind of accorded him these data as the MD Managing Director Designate, starting from 1st of January 2027. So now between now and end of the year, I am prepared transition. And the part of the transition, I would like to invite T.K. Sridhar to present my part or the management [indiscernible] part in this conference and also in November quarter so that you get used to it. And then in the meantime, we are also deciding on the new CFO for the company, which we will announce in due course. And so that the transition in January is seamless. So you will hear -- continue to hear the same in the coming quarters. Over to you, Sridhar.

Thank you, Sanjeev. And I think it's always a pleasure to work with you and all of the team members and such. So for the people on the call, I think I already had a reversal at the Board meeting. So I did both the MD and CFO presentation. So I think I [indiscernible] from there. And so as Sanjeev was alluding to, the CFO search is on, we should be complete in the next couple of months, and then we have the process of induction there. I should now to continue on the presentation. I think presentation is open, and I hope everyone is able to see that, right? So yes, I think let's go to the first slide. The slide from where we start, right? So this is -- that's an ABB at glass who have already familiar with this, there's only one point to note. Now the number of manufacturing locations has increased from 5 because we had Nelamangala, same location [indiscernible] so that's why the 6 locations, but the balance is in number of shop goods will increase as the businesses start to spread out in the emancipation as well. We go to business highlights. I think we just uploaded this presentation. I do not know how much time the being brought to look at the presentation, but I will like to take you through that. We start with a half year review. We are at 36% paid up on our orders, INR 8,600 crores roughly on the orders. and revenue, INR 6,743 crores, which is also 13% up on the half year, but for the quarter, it's definitely [indiscernible] backlog -- strong backlog, INR 11,900 crores of order backlog, which is there is no school moving or a nonmoving order, everything you will get materialized or a period of time as the dues with the customers. Operational EBITDA, INR 1.8, and we will look at it in the data detail as we go forward in the presentation on the profitability and earnings per share is 33.6% as what we stand today based on the half year level. And the cash position is strong at INR 7.2 billion. And I think you would have heard just now in the part of the presentation, we can declare an interim dividend of INR 90 per share which is part of the distribution, which includes the proceeds, which would go from the divestment of robotics plus and a 50 percentage payout ratio of what we do from the normal earnings. For Q2 [indiscernible] 2026, very important 3 percentage growth in orders. So that's year-on-year comparing last the last year same quarter and this year and 21 percentage on the revenue growth pack up by 8 percentage. Operational EBITDA, up 3 percentage and the cash position already spoke about at INR 7,200 crores and dividend of INR 90 crores in especially [indiscernible]. So all these things we [indiscernible], but also on the sustainability side, we take really pride doing this because it's the right thing to do. We had an 85% reduction in the baseline on the GHG emissions Scope 1 and 2. And also 99.7% is almost 100% of the base is diverted from Bank film. That's something which is there. And also, we got some recognitions during the quarter. India's most sustainable company, the capital groups also awarded by business today and we moved up to the latter of the rating by 300 basis points from non-vehicle change. So we still remain at a strong company. I hope -- so some for the last 8 quarters, how did we perform. So I think we have been growth momentum. In the last few quarters, we definitely see this a good uptick in the orders. So 50% is up for the quarter, and revenues as well, we are able to ramp up the revenues because we have a good order backlog, which is going to be converted in the next quarters to come, to be at up by 21 percentage and where did we get all these orders from, I think it is more from renewables, building and infrastructure, data centers, then the process automation and also on the bridges. So this is our slide where we see how we are positioned in the different markets and how do we see those markets as well. So as we are presenting 23 market segments, both from energy emerging industry is consisting of enable data sectors and electronics and infrastructure and passport, core industries as such. And I think all these industry or fundamentals remain intact. We have been saying that these industries are growing at different basis, but they are all important for us. even though core industry may have a slower growth, but whereas in the industries will have a faster growth but the base of core industries is pretty heavy. We generate equal amount of opportunities for us. So our spread between these 2 would be 15%, 25% and 60% or 50 percentage as what we see in terms of our order book or revenue, that's what we see. So I think, hopefully, I think there are a lot of levers as to how this [indiscernible] for this market growth. green energy, some and then the AI and the data protection pushed by the government and the CapEx, which infrastructure spend, where the government is focusing on that. And of course, the PLS team [indiscernible]. So ready to get orders come. I think this is something that's a new slide, which we added. So I think this is different from the [indiscernible] to do. So for electrification from indie electrification segment, from building intrastate market, we got a gas-insulated switch here. And then for the data centers, we going the units and from renewables, of course, on the SmartCore products, which was offered today. So on the motion side of it, we got traction on auxiliary in converters on the railways and motors, which we supply to pudendal industries and large AC motors to building an intrasegment. On the automation side, [indiscernible], where we give electrical -- an electrical and drives and power distribution for power plant and energy industry, electrical composite or [indiscernible]. So team over the call and this has been a practice that we have been following both points in time now. where we take the business, when we take the around different markets than a different segment as such. So in this quarter, we have water and wastewater premanagement system as one of the markets where we see there is definitely a growth for us. So the ABB play in this is [indiscernible] the midterm growth, which you look on this is roughly about 10 percentage CAGR over the next 5 years to come. So what do we do over here? We have motors and [indiscernible] we have PLCs, which we do is distribution systems for [indiscernible] an interesting area, but a market which will grow to, that's what we see with the play of 4% to 8%. Good. I think the growth of 5 percentage and the speed of growth, what we are seeing would not have it possible had we not taken the initiatives of connecting with the customers and in different tire to [indiscernible] our sales teams are fully engaged with the customers on ground. So different bands as suitable for different businesses tailored with the needs of the customers or season actually and what we call Monza, which we have been following. And it has been paying rich dividends. so far. Sustainability in factors, I think we did discuss this about this some time ago. So I think this is how we said that we improved 300 basis points to 67 and the [indiscernible] sector for some ESG performance. We believe that not only being the performing organization is important. We also need to be a good corporate citizen. So therefore, [indiscernible] in community development and engagement, which continues to remain strong, and we will only dwell upon it going forward. It's a very fascinate topic at the board level as well, where how we are engaged on the uneconomic development as well, and it's one of the [indiscernible] where we take pride in being associated with the overall development of [indiscernible]. We now go to financial highlights. This is something what I think I'm sure that you are waiting for. So orders up 50 percentage and then revenue is up 21 percentage, operational at 23% up with a 13 percentage more or less similar as what it was in the last quarter in time. And then profit after tax endpoint and sequentially also, we are a bit off, and we have been going across all the parameters that's what we see. And as far as the year is concerned, so we are at a place where the 2 things that we could perform better as we go forward because we get evergreens and we will be able to generate cash. So we will go deeply as we go. I think this is one slide, I think, which I had taken out in a couple of quarters before, but we've got this back slide up because I know that you'll have at the global press release, which talked about 82% of growth, and this is something which we want to defer between these 2. So -- and this is in dollars at an 84% rather than rate which we take because we have been maintaining [indiscernible] keep on beginning of the year. So I think the global persistent because you have India growing at some time. And also, we had other ABB companies outside India getting some orders from Indian customers, which right? So this was what -- which created a difference of giving up 2 percentage. But when you look at absolute India orders, so we are impacted [indiscernible] what we told this is basically any India had both on domestic as the land exports. So we're well into now a segment-wide information. So orders for electrification, the strongest growing segment we see for the quarter, 77 percentage up on orders and from data center orders again from greater centers, metals and mining in transient sectors. Revenues because we have a strong backlog, which is also today at INR [indiscernible] with a strong backlog for electrification segment. So I think we are growing at 31 percentage and profitability at 15 [indiscernible] we see. Yes, and this has been impacted basically material cost impact of up and metal prices harmony and also the product volatility that has impacted us. Motion, a stable growth. Quarter-on-quarter, I think you could see that 26% as growth coming in every quarter sequentially as well. And if you look at revenues, slightly lower because they have long gestation orders, some [indiscernible] segment which is better revenue-wise in the future quarters to come and profitability at a strong 12% that's what we see, despite the commodity increase and the revenue mix challenges because [indiscernible] Asia, they were not able to export. There was some pullback in the initial period of the quarter, which now what we believe. So that's something which they are looking at. And there other backlogs come at INR 4,900 crores. Automation. This is a place where we see that there is a bit of a size cycle on cyclical nature of orders. So we are -- at this point of time [indiscernible] 24 percentage growth comparatively. But more important is the -- it could have been still better. That's what we see. So the revenue is at INR 534 crores is 7 percentage up. But hopefully, I think going forward with orders to come and orders that the energy and the industry division business solutions will book. I didn't see this. But the good part is that out of the 7 to the growth of [indiscernible] at least 30 percentage of business. So that helps and to maintain the margin for [indiscernible]. So a deep dive in the P&L account. So [indiscernible] percentage roughly compared to 61% last quarter and 60% on the Q1 2025. So we will -- we have a bridge profit walk, which we will take you through. But this is just comes to say that [indiscernible] where we're impacted, but [indiscernible] slight definitely increase our expenses as well, which is more linked to the revenues, which we executed. So this is a profit work. I think apart from the charts, which are there on the top side of it, which is just a bit of a trend, which you look at EBITDA [indiscernible] more important is how do we look at the EBITDA bridge. But I think when you look at EBITDA, both [indiscernible] points in glass water and today, it is 12.6%. And what we got was a scale tennis 3.1 percentage. What we lost on making cost was 3 percentage roughly. And then we had other expenses and the employee expenses, which increased. And so that was 2.2 percentage while we gain comment because last quarter, at the same time, we had a really high ForEx impact, and that is not there in this particular quarter that probably we invest is [indiscernible] So I think the question could be is that so the scale benefits would technically be higher than the other than the expenses that you've seen compensating for other increases. So that is something which we would like to see going forward, but also the price increases to the market being and flow and so from the net product, it always takes a lag. It does not -- we are in the timing cannot be matched with the material cost increases, obviously, price increases you give to the market. So therefore, there is a lag which will come up. So hopefully, when the macro factors settle down and we're able to come to a stable level. So I think these 2 will match at some point of time. I think this is a normal trend, which we have seen specifically in [indiscernible] product business. So this is typically the problem what we have. So now coming to what is the material cost comprising of. Again, we go back to the basic material cost increase on account of our copper prices and the metal prices, which have which are hard and the ForEx mortality what has actually happened and also a bit of a mix change between slightly lower exports and a bit of more projects and low-margin orders, which got executed because it's important to keep the volume the factory loading in the volume up and running so that we are prepared to take the scale benefit going forward to a higher level. So overall, I think this is basically the profit bridge between what we delivered last quarter to this quarter. Next slide. I think this is a standard slide what we have been seeing, just to tell us what is the composition of how we are looking at the businesses. So I think if you look at it, Q2 '26 in terms of revenues, is 50% is up 35 percentage on [indiscernible] 15 percentage from automation. So this is broadly the set what we see. And in terms of geography, you could look at areas to 13 percentage in exports for the quarter compared to 17 percentage what we added in the previous quarter at the same time. So even though in the half year period, we are more of sustained. So this is just -- I know I'm 100% sure that you have all this information, but just to basically sensitize. This is a topic which we will have to continue to deal with in the next few quarters to come, right? So elevated commodity prices and continued [indiscernible] will be extended as what our resource state. So -- and I think we are preparing as to how to manage this to the situation for the businesses to handle. So the [indiscernible] broadcast this in a very strategic and very phased manner. So there's the last one. And on the outlook, the megatrend electrification automation reginalization will be the key mega trends, what we see along with good modernization and transition. So this is something what we think will be the area of focus for all of us to [indiscernible] market segments, what we have and the 15 business divisions that we have will all be in projecting on these particular things. So I think with these macro factors or the government CapEx, which is expected to pick up the private consumption, which is going to drive and a robust manufacturing base, what we have and at dealing human geographical and a geopolitical uncertainty as [indiscernible] monsoon is going to be the [indiscernible] to play out in the next 6 to 2 -- 2 to 3 quarters, that's what we see. So this is more a bit of a short-term outlook, what we see because today, if the [indiscernible] it's happening, I think the short term is more reliable or I think something which we could [indiscernible] This is the last slide. So I think with this, we sort of completed our presentation, right? So we now open it up for question and answers. So normally, [indiscernible]

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from the line of Umesh Raut with Nomura.

My first question is pertaining to strong ordering performance during the quarter. So if you can give us details about growth on base ordering side during the quarter. And second, also growth in terms of ordering from, say, emerging industries, infrastructure and transport and core industries in these 3 buckets.

So the first thing is about base orders on the what you call large orders. [indiscernible] Okay. That's fine. So you are talking about large orders or base orders. I think we want to move away from differentiating between these orders and large orders. I think we delight that large orders were very important when we had [indiscernible] division because large orders we define at [indiscernible] I mean, $15 million, which is roughly about, say, INR 900 -- 1,000 million, INR 100 crores of orders which in a business where we have almost 70 percentage or almost 80% is coming from products. I think these type of large orders is something which is well less. So I think to answer to your question, in this quarter is everything is base orders. So the next question was how did you perform in these different segments? I think data centers for this order in this quarter assume almost 15 to 17 percentage of our orders came from base orders, metals and mining was 15 percentage top of [indiscernible] then oil and gas was 9% and building in power, [indiscernible] segments.

Understood. My second question is pertaining to acquisition of Rotork by parent and probably synergy that India business make it from the areas like data center, water or say, power, especially because now Rotork's industrial flow control specialist. And thirdly, in a few of these end user markets you were addressable market can go up. So how do you think about this synergy playing out for India business?

So I think it is pretty early for us to comment on it because globally, if you look at the announcement as well as shareholders of Rotork has still not an approved this [indiscernible] approval. So we have no other information other than that which has been announced by the group. So we have nothing to comment at this point of time. And it will be too early for us to work and give you these details. So probably when we get more information or then the group advances on their particular pursuit of this, then we could sort of share with the investors for the details on this.

Understood. My last question is...

Sorry to interrupt, Umesh, we request you to please rejoin the queue if you have any further questions. Our next question is from the line of Renu with IIFL.

My 2 questions. First, if you start when you started the calendar year '26, the team was fairly conservative and cautious on the growth outlook. And then we had the Southwest Asia conflicts. Now looking at the numbers, 1Q and [indiscernible] very strongly on the institutional revenue side. So what has changed in terms of business uptick? Was it just slippages of revenues, which caught up in the second quarter? Or are you seeing a much better acceptance from the customer in terms of delivery? And also reflected in the numbers, the channel partner had seen a pretty good jump in the revenue mix this quarter. So was that also to be with any share of channel entrestocking-up involved because relatively soft of from any users and EPC companies? That's the first question. Second question here...

I thought those 2 questions.

No, that's [indiscernible] revenue growth outlook. Second question -- and the second question is looking at the order accretion, which is fairly well balanced in large and short cycle orders of the first half of the year. Where do we see the margin headwinds easing out and with operating leverage kicking in by end of the year, do we be worst for ABB in terms of the operating EBITDA is behind? And can you see margins coming back to lifting levels through end of the year or next year? .

So you also took the queue from Sanjeev okay. So I think Sanjeev also will see here are finding it difficult to talk because it's more my quick step. So now coming to the first question, which is a transition from what was the market in first quarter and second quarter. Yes, I think when the first quarter we closed because of the time it was what was the scare has been [indiscernible]. And if you remember the quarter 1 call, we did say that we did miss certain revenues because of the [indiscernible]. And that also had a slower on the Q2 revenue, which we had. So I mean, I cannot demise that particular fact, right? And whether it is only [indiscernible]. It's a mix of growth export on domestic revenues because export is one side of it, but domestic is also important because we get material to import from the other countries or feeder factories, which we then converted to finish products to apply locally as well. So I think -- so this is basically the situation. So it's a mix of both. And therefore, when you look at H1, so H1 revenues are 30% [indiscernible] would also be up very large percentage with sort of a stabilization which has happened. So now coming to your -- the next question of [indiscernible] question. If you can repeat -- on the margins. Okay. So on margin side of it, I think we have a strong backlog. It all depends. We quite active on 3 things as what I'm saying. Will the material cost will be metal prices and the for price man at today level, okay? Is today's level is sort of maintained because we know that this is what it is today and pricing. And we see that the mix and we don't have any decortions in terms of supply chain, right? Probably we get better leverage of the capacity -- of the operating leverage going forward in the next 2 quarters. But our [indiscernible] this comes back to the same slide where I was showing the different commodities and the prices research says that we still have certain headwinds on the particular side, and we have to carefully navigate this [indiscernible] as what we see. So today, I'm not comfortable to tell that what is at mid-teens of EBITDA margin shell do. First important is protect what we are today so that we are able to develop the revenues and the orders in a good manner and then start to grow from there. That's what we are looking at it on a short-term basis.

We will proceed to the next questioner, Parikshit Kandpal with HDFC Securities.

Congratulations on a decent quarter. First question is in the 3 segments, electric position motion and automation. So you earlier alluded on the commodity inflation and ForEx impact. I just wanted to understand on the passing on the pricing or the cost inflation. So where are we sitting challenges and where it is more easier to pass on inflation and what kind of price hike you have taken in this quarter?

So we have [indiscernible], we deal with electrification, which is the major part of our revenue. So I would invite [indiscernible] to give some through some light how are they managing the [indiscernible] for the customers. Kiran, would you like to go first?

Parikshit, thanks for your question. I think it's a very important question at this point of time. When you have this [indiscernible] business and also the kind of prices we are going through with respect to the commodity prices impact and also the ForEx impact. So I think these 2 are really hitting us hard. And you can also see from the slide that the margin electrification has dropped from what it was earlier as well. So it was very, very important for us to take some corrective actions. Of course, there's a bit of a lag in the corrective actions that we have taken and the impact of the price and cost which is impacting us. So that you can see in the graph itself. At the same time, what we have done is we have passed on 2 privates into the market. The certain price hike. This is a publicly available price, which is there. And this is really supporting us in terms of trying to compensate the EBIT which is coming into picture. When I look at the acceptance, yes, there has been a lot of challenges in the market with respect to the customers accepting the price. But I think a very careful and a very -- it's still handled in a very dedicated way from our side in terms of creating an awareness on what exactly is happening. Of course, most of the customers are aware of what's happening in the commodity price. But I think it's very important to very clearly explain to the customer what is in depth, the content of silver of copper, which is present in our products. I think it was very evident proven to the customers and customers for sure quite logical in accepting something as a product with very high reliability and sustainable performance. I think they are coming back to us and paying the price what we need. At the same time, I think digital market is extremely important and they understand the connectivity of devices which are required from our perspective. So they are coming back to us even more faster than what they were doing. And then if there is a price acceptance as well from their end.

Thank you, Kiran. Ganesh, do you have any comments to further add to what Kiran was alluding to? .

Ganesh has reconnected with us, sir. One moment, please.

So Ganesh, you -- were you to hear the question or do you want to lead on the question?

No. Can you please just repeat the...

No, I think the question was how are we dealing with the price increases to be passed on to the customers given that we have cost increases are coming from the raw input cost, which has gone up, right? So that's something which the investors [indiscernible] analysts want the clarity. We're managing the price additions to the market. So we heard current version, which is more on the product side. So now we could live into your peer version, which is more on the system side.

Yes, sure. Like even our distribution solutions business, 16% business comes from the product, which is a flow business, which we basically market to our partners. And there, we are able to pass on the revised price list with increased pricing, taking into the consideration of the commodity impact. But as you said, there is a system business and a majority of those business actually, when they bid, we bid through basically on the L1 basis. So it's all basically the tendering business where we ought to go for the reverse auction. And that time, sometimes we are not really able to pass on these prices because there is quite a lot of competitive prices, which we need to pull. But flow business, which is the major part of our business, where we already increased our prices and pass on commodity price increase in the market, and you will see that reflection which will be coming in the coming quarters.

So I think Parikshit, think just to reiterate what [indiscernible] and Ganesh told, there will always be a lag. If the prices stabilize, the input prices stabilized, so then you will have this particular lag catching up. But otherwise, this still will continue, right? So that's something which we think is important for us to realize in this market at this point of time.

Second question was on the geopolitics and also the maybe -- I mean [indiscernible] the order growth of inflow growth, which has been quite strong Y-o-Y. So is there any -- are you seeing any delays in decision making from the client side, given the higher level of commodity prices and geopolitics or more in a normalized situation, otherwise, order improve should have been more stronger. So just wanted to understand the color on the account and the demand side across the segment. barring the current situation we are in high inflationary environment and [indiscernible] I mean it's impact on growth of order imports.

So you'll have -- you'll hear -- you hear 2 versions, one from Balaji, who leads the automation division where it's more project-related orders from the customer core sectors. And from an export to core sectors while we have run who could dwell upon from the private side of it. So Balaji, you would like to start from the from our version as to how you see from the government infrastructure side of it? And how is the core sector being to this now?

So I would say that there has been certainly a certain amount of impact due to the reset prices for one, for sure, since we deal with the refining sector, which is one of the key sectors here. When we see on the CapEx side for those investments that have been already announced those projects are more moving ahead, though a bit sluggish, which is typically normal of the movement of public sector. However, when it comes to services, the company is really pulled back because of the increase in crude oil prices, and that's easing up now. So essential activities are carried out. So I would say that's a little bit of sluggishness definitely on the refining side. On the downstream other core industries, which had a direct relationship with the crude oil prices. We did see a little bit of a sluggish movement, but I would not say that we press the panic button. I would -- since the crude oil prices are settling even though the situation is quite volatile, we are still seeing a moment here. You would rather see that there could be some real movements in the upstream side. Maybe hopeful that certain projects will be shortly announced. The power sector definitely has seen a lot of investments while we're seeing a lot of growth in the renewable side, but consider the low initiative of renewables and the big and the prices that is coming up in terms of natural gas supply chain. We are seeing a good uptake in the conventional power generation systems as well.

Thank you. Thank you, Balaji. So Kiran, would you like to give a view on the private side?

Absolutely. Thanks, Sridhar, and thanks Parikshit. I think it's a good one to have this kind of talk. Let me just give you some perspectives as Balaji talked about on the core sector. Let me give you some perspective on some of the sectors, which we are into. And let's look at 1 or 2 sectors, maybe I would like to take a building first. On the building side, if you look at it, there are 2 types of buildings. One on the residential side under the commercial side. But what we found was the decisions on probably the residential side has been pretty sluggish, whereas the commercial side, commercial side has been pretty faster. And that's where it's actually supporting us in terms of growth, in terms of orders. on data centers. I think it's very much important for, I think, every client who is coming into India for data centers, I think they want things faster and that's where we have an advantage of able to supply faster from our side because we have the local facilities here, and that's what is supporting us in terms of growth in these sectors. Now to cater to data centers and buildings, you need to have partners who have the ready-made availability of these content of materials. And that's where the pickup from the distributors and the partner segment, or system integrators as well has been on a very high uptake during this particular quarter because decisions have been passed from both data centers well and the commercial buildings. So that's where it's the impact, and that's where we have been quite successful in terms of growth during this particular quarter.

[Operator Instructions] Our next question is from the line of Atul Tiwari with JPMorgan.

Yes. Sir, in this quarter, the parent company reported 81% order inflow growth and you have reported 50%. And historically, we have seen that there is some difference, but not as large a difference as in this quarter. And I think in previous quarters, you have presented slides also explaining the variation. So could you comment on where is this wide variation coming from in this quarter?

I think in this quarter as well, in my commentary, I explained that we have given a slide on this. If you look at the presentation, which has already been upload on the [indiscernible], it is a pre slide, which is talking about demand versus supply of how much of [indiscernible] India Limited book orders. So this is more coming from Indian customers placing orders on ABB group companies. For systems, which ABB cannot provide or their convenience per se, and that's basically where you have a gap. So that's the situation there what we have because of which we have percentage growth as shown by the group, betas we are talking about 50 percentage growth.

Okay. And sir, [indiscernible] how much is volume lead and how much is price led? Any comment on that?

We normally don't look at it from that volume and price line because we all ended in the offerings, what we do because we have a mix of products, projects and services. So it's not an untold.And if you look at it, it will be mostly volume, right, because price, of course, has a lag as what [indiscernible]. So I think it's mostly volume, and that's where we get the leverage for.

Our next question is from the line of Amit Mahawar with UBS.

I just had 2 quick questions, sir. First is on the -- is it right to say that the base orders? I know you've not differentiated on [indiscernible] but it's after a gap of almost 1.5 years that the base order growth is almost more than 20%, clearly, which has not been the case in the last half year. And bulk of this is value growth in pricing because when we talk to channel partners, there is a very strong impact on June quarter onwards of the pricing and volume is yet to play out. That's my first question, sir.