Atome Plc (ATOM) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, and welcome to the ATOME Energy PLC Investor presentation. [Operator Instructions] The company may not be in a position to answer every question it receives during the meeting itself. However, the company will review all questions submitted today and publish responses where it is appropriate to do so. Before we begin, I'd like to submit the following poll. And I'd now like to hand over to Olivier Mussat, the CEO. Good afternoon, sir.

Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you very much for allowing ATOME to present the latest update. From what I understand, there's quite a few people who are joining today. So we will go forward with the presentation. And some of you who have been here for a while may have noticed the updated logo, I guess, of ATOME being representative of -- our significant move towards the fertilizer sector. Clearly, this is not the only thing that ATOME will be doing. But on the near term, it is very clear to us that the easiest way to develop green ammonia project is to be extremely focused on the fertilizer side. I will now move on to the next sections, which are the usual disclaimers as a public company and for some of the new shareholders that we have. So who is ATOME? So we are essentially the first and only pure-play developer listed on the London Stock Exchange focus on the development of green hydrogen and green ammonia. And our first project is absolutely going towards green fertilizers. So now we have 3 operating entities. So with Paraguay, which was the original, which originated at home. Iceland with the greenfield team and in Central America with -- in partnership with the Cavendish team, which leads us to a pipeline of projects of around 600 megawatts. So our first project, and I will discuss it a little bit about it, is that the Villeta project. So 120-megawatt announce with the startup date in 2025 is the largest green ammonia project announced to date as far as being able to operate so rapidly in the Latin American continent. Some of you may remember, so 120 megawatts enables us to produce up to 100,000 tonnes of green ammonia as a liquid and once you go into the further process of calcium ammonium nitrate, it allows you to basically produce up to 250,000 tonnes of calcium ammonium nitrate, with FID decision now is expected by September, October of this year. So our products, obviously, is 100% green, 100% using renewable power. In the case of Paraguay, it's obviously hydroelectric power. And to give you an idea of impact, I mean, it's great to produce a product and [ a green ] product, but the consequence of having a green product allows you to abate over 350,000 tonnes of carbon. In the market for Latin America, for example, if you are going to be producing -- when there's a yearly demand of nearly 20 million tonnes per year of CAN, that's a significant amount of displacement that which you can do in the new economy. So what's the business? How do we produce green hydrogen, green ammonia. So going back to basics, to be able to produce green hydrogen -- what you have is you are pretty much electrolyzing water. What does that mean is you are using an electrolyzer, which is pretty much a giant electrical [ hammer ], which takes pure water, so H2O separates the H on one side, hydrogen, and the O the other side, oxygen. So with hydrogen, you can do a few things. Obviously, everybody has heard about using hydrogen from the mobility side with hydrogen vehicles, whether it's Toyota, Hyundai, you can now buy hydrogen vehicles in your dealership. But actually, with hydrogen, you can also make ammonia, you treat it as a base chemical and that's the way it has been done for decades now. And through the Haber-Bosch process, you take a hydrogen, you add nitrogen and it becomes ammonia. And ammonia, the largest use of ammonia today is in the fertilizer sector. And ammonia, you can have it in different forms, whether it's calcium ammonium nitrate, ammonium sulfates and urea and so on. And so what you can then do is depending on the choice that you are going to make you can go further downstream. And in our particular case, per Villeta, make calcium ammonium nitrate. And I will go a little bit later in the presentation on explaining CAN. Ammonia also can be used as a fuel in the marine sector, which is the focus of our partnership with Green Fuel in Iceland. The way we are developing our projects is really our own IP, but we don't take technology risk whatsoever. We are actually in a very much technologically agnostic. And the fact that we are using baseload hydroelectric power allows us to be technologically agnostic and use alkaline technology, which has been in operation for nearly a century now. You have heard a number of other technologies, whether it's PEM or SOEC which are the newer kids on the block. PEM doesn't really offer any incremental benefit on the efficiency of transforming electrons into molecules but it is better suited when you have to deal with wind and solar power, which by essence, is quite intermittent. The other technology called SOEC, solid oxide, is a very promising technology because it has a higher efficiency to transform electrons electricity into molecules, which will generate better returns, but it is still pretty young as we take. So our view is we want to be as simple as possible, as focused as possible by buying our power from existing partners for hydroelectric power in Paraguay from ANDE, which has the second largest hydroelectric dam in the world and use the hydrogen created to make ammonia and then attack and sell our products into the market on a fast-track basis because whilst the economy is moving extremely fast, we strongly believe that if you can get first to market, you will be able to generate the highest returns and the highest interest. Also, we are not waiting for the hydrogen market to be created or the growth of hydrogen trucks or the growth of the hydrogen economy in the long term. We are selling into a market, which exists today, which needs the products today. So this gives you a view of where we are today. As I mentioned earlier of the different partnerships on the project, in the first project in Paraguay, 120-megawatt Phase 1 in Villeta. We're also maturing another project in Paraguay, which we call Phase 2 Yguazu, which will be 300 megawatts, so 2.5 size of the Villeta project. And we already obviously have a long-term power purchase agreement with ANDE. We already have our owners engineer working with us for nearly 2 years now with AECOM. And on the financing side, we are working with Natixis, the French investment bank, with the Inter-American Development Bank, which is the equivalent of World Bank for Latin America. We have our front end engineering and design contractors, which are Urbas and Casale, which are very important into putting the project together, doing all of the engineering and being able to be ready to go towards the EPC, so engineering and procurement, over to the construction. The choice of Urbas and Casale was a very logical choice. Urbas with its team has developed a number of projects and initiatives in hydrogen over the past 5 years in Spain, but also had developed a number of power projects in Latin America. So the ability and the expertise to have developed power projects in Latin America was absolutely key. And added with Casale. Casale is one of the oldest fertilizer chemical company in the world. They have built a number of ammonia and calcium ammonium nitrate plants across the globe. So for us, they are a perfect partner with a track record of delivery efficiently and are very well recognized within the sector. And we are now nearing the end of the work on the environment and social impact assessment, where we've been very happy with the work done using IFC and World Bank performance standards by [ JJP ] and we have partnership with Nexant on the market study because, obviously, we believe in the market, and you can see on what is written on the price. But when you go to see to lenders and investors at the asset level because our view is to finance all of our projects at the asset level as in infrastructure, energy infrastructure products. You need to be able to evidence in front of your lenders that what you are seeing is true and able to show that you can deliver on time as expected into the market. So a little highlight on the progress made since the IPO. So we actually -- we are still a relatively young company in an extremely fast-moving sector. And we listed ATOME in December 2021. And since then, we've arguably been one of the fastest-growing companies in the entire sector. And here, you would have seen all of the steps that we have done over between -- in 2022 and now in the first half of 2023, clearly, although we want to grow fast, we have to be very focused on delivery because our ability to deliver the Villeta on the original fast-track basis will enable us to do more. You see, obviously, our shareholder list over here on the right. Original, we were incubated within molecular energy and spun out of molecular, which is why they [ own 25% ]. Peter Levine, our Chairman, owns 22% of which, like me, 3.9%, we have bought our shares at the IPO and then followed our money at every single capital raise. And we are welcoming this week Baker Hughes as a new significant investor and I will go on the next page to explain the thesis behind the transaction. And you see the other shareholders that we have between [ traffic rush orders ] in for hydrogen. So Baker Hughes was quite a fundamental and an important step in our growth. We have been discussing with Baker Hughes for quite a number of months now as we have started front-end engineering and design for our projects. So there are a limited number of global engineering companies who can deliver hydrogen compressors. And Baker Hughes is actually one of them. So Baker Hughes may be better known for its work in the oil and gas side, but they have increasingly been working on the wider energy sector, and some of the energy compressors and hydrogen compressors are second to none. Obviously, it's a $28 billion company. It's a great partner to have. And for us, it's a great recognition that what we are doing is being recognized by the industry and the industry wants to follow us as they want also to take leadership because whoever can deliver the first project will then have a significant advantage to win following contracts. We put on this slide some examples of the work that Baker Hughes has done in the hydrogen space. They announced just a couple of weeks ago, a cooperation with ADNOC, the Abu Dhabi National Oil Company, towards advancing hydrogen, but also, they are one of the original participant into the Hy24 private equity fund, which was -- which raised EUR 2 billion and is the largest PE fund focused towards hydrogen projects. So in exchange of the investment that have the right of first offer on our projects to be able to supply compressors, which obviously, on one hand, enables us to have a very active dialogue with Baker Hughes to make sure that we are rightsizing the project and rightsizing all of the equipment, including the compressors, which is a significant part of any project, but also because, again, it's a write-off on stuff for it ensures that we have a competitive pricing at every single point in time. So a quick resume on our team. I mentioned Peter earlier. And obviously, Peter being the founder of the company, has a significant track record of delivering projects and companies across the energy space. He is best known for his successful creation and exit of Imperial Energy for over $2 billion back in 2009. But very importantly, he was also chairman of a number of steel and engineering companies. We have to be extremely realistic that -- no matter what people say, when you look -- when you work in hydrogen and in ammonia, it's -- some people think it's tech, and it's absolutely not tech. It's is a chemical game. It's a margins game. So the focus on cost is absolutely clear and the focus on delivery and [ timing ] is absolutely clear. So -- and Peter provides us with that guidance to continue pushing into the right direction. So in my experience, I started as an engineer in the power sector, we've been offset of GE, then moved into the oil and gas engineering side with Schlumberger but for the past 15 years, I've been on the financing side of the equation, investing across debt and equity across the sectors. And it is when I was over the past 9 years at BIFC that working and investing in former companies of Peter that's when hydrogen strategy was really pushed and deviced. And the idea is really for us to have a benefit of the U.K. listing to be able to accelerate our projects and then provide and put together the financing to invest at the asset level because really, this is where we have a widest amount of financing available. So purely having an [ ILC ] listing gives you a lot of leverage to ensure that you can get the best term when you will be financing the assets. We also wouldn't be here without a great team on the ground, whether it was in Paraguay, in Iceland or in Central America and Costa Rica. And James Spalding is -- as President of ATOME Paraguay is absolutely key as well. His experience is second to none. He used to be the head of the Itaipu dam which provides us with the electricity. He was also the minister and representative on the Board of the World Bank in the IDB. And his last public work was actually working on the decarbonization strategy of Paraguay. And this is really when the opportunity to use Paraguay's excess power to help decarbonize the country further, but also create a new industry within Paraguay, which will add value, not only in the country but in the region, became really real and he is able to help us deliver it. Obviously, we need the other side of the expertise, which is our long-term -- longstanding hydrogen expertise, which is where Mary-Rose comes in. For over 50 years, she was the Head of the International Energy Agency's hydrogen unit. And so she has long-standing experience into helping us guide with the right people, with the right industries and of course, questioning a lot of the technology because there's a lot of things being said, but you really have to get under the good share to see where is the reality and who has been delivering and who has not. And the most recent hire into the team has been Terje Bakken because we have done the engineering of the project. We are putting the financing together. And it's only at the point where we really understood where the power comes from, where we're going to build the projects, where are we going next? Well, now we have to work very hard on the uptake side. And Terje is -- he used to be VP -- Senior VP of ammonia and fertilizers at Yara, one of the largest company -- fertilizer companies in the world and also had the same one within EuroChem. So actually, Terje and I just came back from the International Fertilizer Week, which was held in Prague this week. It is the largest global conference on fertilizers, where we met, let say, everybody who we need to speak to, to ensure that we can look for the best possible marketing agreement to offtake the ammonia and the calcium ammomnium nitrate, CAN, from Villeta. And this -- now will go very briefly into the sector and just show you how fast this sector has been moving. And we are really moving from a tech-focused sector to a delivery side. And in this, you see in the press, what has happened since the beginning of the year, everybody or most people have heard about the Inflation Reduction Act in the U.S., which is pushing extremely hard and extremely fast, the new technologies of decarbonization of hydrogen, of renewable power into the U.S., how even BMW is also -- has just unveiled this week a new hydrogen car. And what has been 2, I mean, 3 fundamental events over the past 1.5 month, so number one, the International Maritime Organization has really stepped up to the plate as far as pushing the regulation to enable using [ well a pretty ] much key fuel with ammonia front-end center into the shipping sector as the best way to ensure 0 carbon shipping. We have also seen the food groups, OCI, OCP, the fertilizer manufacturers starting to now actively look for and purchase green fertilizers as they have the -- as they want to create more independence towards the oil and gas value chain, which [indiscernible] is obviously highly carbonated into the production of fertilizers, but also candidate to a lot of issues as we have recently seen between Russia and Ukraine, where the flow of fertilizer just stopped. And finally, one of the first large project -- green ammonia project, has now reached final investment decision, and that was developed in Saudi Arabia with NEOM, ACWA and Air Products, which have raised $8.5 billion to finance their project, which will be in operation over the next 5 years. So it's obviously, it's a much bigger project than what they are doing -- we are doing, sorry. But it will be delivered quite a little later than us. But it gives us full confidence that we are going exactly the right direction in the market, which is maturing extremely fast. So as for a quick reminder on what is green hydrogen. I mentioned earlier what -- how do you make hydrogen, but also the different markets that hydrogen can go for. And it really has the big advantage that electrification would only take us so far. There's a very good reason why even in London, we have electric buses and we have hydrogen buses. It's because you need the molecules. You need to have energy and molecules to give you that flexibility and have 0 carbon hydrogen molecules. And more and more now that hydrogen, as we discussed earlier, ammonia is by far the largest market at scale to use that hydrogen and then soon enough, it will be followed between transport, power generation and also the ability to use green ammonia to transport hydrogen over long distances. But our focus, as I mentioned, has really been a very pragmatic focus, which is -- in today's world, if I'm going to be producing hydrogen, I need to find a market. That market is ammonia and green ammonia. And what is the biggest market in green ammonia, again, it is the fertilizer, right? And it is quite important to continue focusing on that because this is an industry, which has been relatively quiet over the last years, but it's just as big as the oil and gas industry. But ammonia alone, we're looking at about 180 million tonnes a year. It's a globally traded commodity, but 95% of it comes from hydrocarbon from natural gas, from coal. So the importance to go and obviously decarbonize these fertilizers because for about 1 ton of ammonia coming from natural gas, it will generate around 2 tons of carbon. That's the very clear impetus on climate. The other side is the industry is also very realistic that the amount of funding to be up and the ability to develop new oil and gas projects or new coal project is fast coming down. And as we have seen, with a price of gas going significantly higher over the past 2 years and the availability of natural gas has become an issue, you need to find alternatives if you want to be able to feed a world, which is growing by about 1 billion people every single 10 years, which is where green hydrogen and green ammonia plays an absolute key role. On this slide, we show a little graph on the right coming from the International Fertilizers Association. And it shows you how -- the speed at which the fertilizer use is growing because we only have a limited amount of land globally to feed a growing number of people. So you see in 2021, 2022 the demand has come down. And it has come down sharply because of 2 things, right? Number one, clearly, as the price of fertilizers went up, people were less able to buy fertilizers and farmers were [ biting ] a pinch. And of course, there's the element of COVID attached to it. But that demand is rebounding extremely quickly. The -- as we were mentioning, of course, as you look ammonia across the world, across the stream, and what are we looking at? The thing is that ammonia-based fertilizer pretty much feed half of the world today. There's a lot of talk around organic fertilizers, but the reality is if you want to do things at scale and growing, the ammonia-based fertilizers are absolutely the key to do things. But as I mentioned earlier, it is also the highest carbon emitting fertilizer sector that we can have. So the ability to do green solves that problem. You are -- obviously we are looking also at the demand, which is extremely growing. As I mentioned earlier, if you want to feed a growing world rapidly, the ammonia-based fertilizers and nitrate fertilizers are there. And within all of the products that we can make with ammonia calcium and ammonium nitrate is actually the fastest growing one. Today, the largest ammonia-based fertilizers that is being used is urea. It's because it's flexible. It's very well understood. It's been used for decades. But -- the problem with urea, it has the highest carbon content of all fertilizers because to do urea, you pretty much mix nitrates, use ammonia, and then you add CO2 into it to be able to disperse into the field and basically the CO2 is the medium. Calcium ammonium nitrate, pretty much what we use is we use calcium that we mix with the ammonium nitrate solution. So it's a 0 carbon fertilizer, which has better properties than urea. And it's -- and the advantage that it has is that it is also a lot more flexible and a lot easier to transport globally. So when we were looking at -- when we were doing the production and putting the design of the plant of Villeta, one of the first meeting that we had when Terje joined us, was that, well, I completely understand what you are doing with ammonia and really understand the whole thesis, but we are actually -- the fertilizer world will put a huge premium if we could produce calcium ammonium nitrate. And because this is an end product that they can use right away very quickly, and because this is pretty much we sell it in very large bags, it becomes a powder and it's an inert powder. There are 0 handling or safety issues, a very limited one attached to handling CAN. And this is also the cheapest on the logistics. So whilst clearly the regional market off Mercosur, which is Paraguay, Argentina, Brazil, which is our market is very large already. Now, we're talking over 1 million tonnes per year of demand. You can actually very easily ship it into Europe, which is other 10 million tonnes per year of demand and growing extremely fast. So as far as scaling up the project, as I mentioned, Villeta, we are going full speed ahead in order to reach FID by September, October. And from then on, it will take about 28 months to complete rebuilding our facility to complete the commissioning and to have the start-up and to be in production starting up production in '25 and delivering very quickly. And as we have -- we actually started clearing the land to prepare for the -- sorry for piling the land, for preparing the land because obviously, this is -- there's going to be a lot of equipment being put as we start ordering by the end of this year. And in parallel of obviously delivering Villeta, you would expect that by the end of June, we will have the investment memorandum ready to send to the lenders and asset level investors via Natixis and IDB's work. And we will also have very advanced -- we will advance -- sorry, our discussions with the off takers to choose our marketing partner over the next couple of months. So that is the type of announcements you can expect from the Villeta projects. I mentioned Yguazu, also in Paraguay. That's the second largest space. We are obviously in advanced discussions, and we continue to discuss with ANDE. We are very happy with the way things have been going. It's a real partnership that we have with ANDE. I think it's -- we are seeing them deliver in Paraguay, increasing the capacity of the grid in order to enable large projects like ours and use domestic electricity for the benefit of the country and create more jobs. And of course, the last point that we have is the much smaller mobility project that we have. We're talking a megawatt of electrolyzers and this particular one is in partnership, obviously, with CPH2, which we are continuing to mature, and we will be deploying by the end of this year. When it comes to Iceland and Costa Rica, compared to our original time line, Iceland has gone a little slower than expected. As I mentioned a number of times, we -- the country has not been immune from the energy crisis in Europe, but we announced a couple of weeks ago, that both HS Orka and ON had signed up to a total of 60 megawatts of power capacity available from '26 onwards. And we had -- in partnership with Cavendish setup the National Ammonia Corporation where we are pushing ahead to mature our first project, which we hope we'll be able to announce in the next couple of months. And we've been looking at other geographies, and we've learned quite a few interesting things. Obviously, the main thing is we are confirmed that we are one of the lowest cost project globally. And that's great. But as I say, we have to deliver, and we're absolutely focused on delivery because this is what will bring the most value to shareholders once we are able to prove to the market, to the industrial partners, to the off takers that ATOME was right earlier than anybody else, and we'll be able to deliver more value than anybody else. So with that said, I think I will move to the Q&A.

Olivier, thank you very much for the presentation. [Operator Instructions] But just while Olivier takes a few moments to review those questions that have been submitted today, I'd like to remind you the recording of this presentation along with the copy of the slides and published Q&A can be accessed via your investor dashboard. Olivier, as you can see, we received a number of questions throughout today's presentation. And if I could just ask you to read out those questions and give responses where it's appropriate to do so. I'll pick up from you at the end.

Thank you very much. We -- I think I'll start with a presubmitted question, which was -- has the company taken a few on available electrolyzers and specifically for current projects. So are we looking at alkaline, PEM, solid oxide? So as I mentioned earlier, our focus is really to be low technology for large projects. We will not take any technology whatsoever. So alkaline is the one that we are choosing. We've actually spent and we did a little bit of an RFP/beauty contest as part of the front-end engineering and design. And whilst we had -- we didn't want to entertain offers from -- on PEM, a number of suppliers did offer it as a possibility, and it confirmed 2 things to us, which is, obviously, we did not need PEM, although they have very -- the track record for PEM is growing extremely fast. As I say, the efficiency, advantage is not relevant to us in our baseload hydroelectric power. And also the fact that the track record at very large scale wasn't long enough for us. But our view is simplicity in everything we do, which is why we went to CAN as an end product for Villeta. It is the easiest product to place. It's the easiest to add product green premium. And with alkaline, electrolysis is the same as well today. If you can use alkaline electrolysis, you use alkaline electrolysis because you have a track record, you are able to see and audit the operations of other large-scale projects on alkaline. Am I just missing PEM? Or as we see, absolutely not. I think for our future projects, we will absolutely look at sourcing if needed. At this point in time, as I mentioned, I think SOEC seems to have the highest potential because it will be the one which gives the most value, if it is 20% more efficient to change electrons into molecules of hydrogen, it means that you will have 20% more money on the back end for you. On the mobility project, as we discussed last year, and we have been working with CPH2, obviously, this is a much smaller scale. And for us, we see that mobility gives us a great optionality for the future. And we saw that the partnership with CPH2 in working into a small-scale mobility project made a lot of sense. Obviously, we have -- with both our companies with the offshore [ words ]. So it made a lot of sense for us to mature project, which is a little bit of a demo project at this particular stage, but has a lot of potential to grow in the future at a very low capital exposure. I will move on to the next question, which is -- is Hy24 future potential investor into the company since Baker Hughes is about to become a shareholder? So Baker Hughes is a shareholder on both and we have had good discussions with Hy24. I mean this is -- but like we have had good discussions with absolutely everybody. So we can hope that Hy24 would like to come into our projects. It's -- I think for us, we will -- we want to have the right partners, but also we want to make sure that these partners have the right partners on the technical side that they can add something, not just their money. And that they have also the same vision as us. So this will be the work over the summer to decide who we want to work with in our first project. And as we talk to the market, I certainly hope that Hy24 will be very active in this discussion. It's a great fund made by the number of very, very competent people and we will see as negotiations continue and as we try to find the best partners to enhance the value of the project, but of course, as the shareholders, as I mentioned, the entire management came in at the same time as anybody else. So we are all extremely motivated to make sure that we find the right partners and the partners, which gives us the most value. Then a question for Mark. When do we expect to close the financing on Villeta? Do finance partners accept ATOME to raise additional equity as part of the project finance? And so as I mentioned earlier, we certainly hope to be in a position to close the financing at FID, so September, October. And this is why we hired Natixis, ON, IDB, right? The whole game in there, and that's the whole infrastructure financing game is to be able to optimize asset level financing, investors coming into the assets. If you look at the old oil and gas model, of maturing projects, which look too risky for the majors. And then when you mature it, when you get some to FID, you do a farm-out at the asset level, so that you minimize the equity that we at ATOME would have to put in to the project, but obviously keep the lion's share. The other side of being a listed company also gives us more leverage to be able to ensure that we get the most value at the asset level. Because there may be cases where raising a bit of money at the PLC would make a lot of sense. Our view also with the PLC has also -- was always that you get most diluted during the period we are in, which is the pre-FID period. This is where money tends to be the most expensive. And some of the funds, some of the large funds would actually charge even more. So being able to do what we do through the listing, through our very supportive shareholders, enables us to raise and to create a lot more, let's say, to raise our profile and to give us a lot more leverage vis-a-vis the asset investor levels. Then I look at the question from Sam W. Two questions, relationship between BH, Bakers Hughes, and access to hydrogen compressors. Does it cover Iceland and Costa Rica in addition to Paraguay. And is the production of CAN, the long-term plan in Costa Rica? So it's a corporate relationship that we have with Baker Hughes. And it's not -- as I mentioned, it's not an obligation to work and to take Baker Hughes compressors if they don't fit the particular project. What it really is you have to see it as a partnership. And the other side is the production of CAN, the long-term plan for Costa Rica or Central America. Each country is different. They -- and each country needs different types of fertilizers. So we always look for what is the best thing for each project. While CAN is the best thing for Villeta in Paraguay, and CAN may not be the best product for Yguazu, for example. So that gets matured as you mature a project as you talk to the market and the CAN that shows the choice that we made to go towards CAN was in discussion with Terje, but of course, all of the offtakers. We don't take decision in isolation. We always want to put and to sell what the market wants. We don't want to push something that the market is not really to take, and it is both a question of a regional market, but of course, the global market. And then I have another question. How competitive is your green product? Are you already seeing interest in green fertilizer from the agri and food companies? Well, as I mentioned earlier, we just came back from the IFA conference, and it was one of the very large themes of the conference. And what we are seeing is this is growing extremely rapidly. And this is pushed both by the fertilizer companies, but especially the food companies. You may have seen in Europe now, every single food product is going to get an environmental rating, whether it's A, B, C, D. And we have seen already evidence that, for example, there has been a drastic slowdown in the sale of meat in Germany, for example, when people saw the carbon footprint of meat. So the food industry knows that it's coming and if they want to be able to keep, let's say, the social license to continue to operate, what happened to the oil and gas sector 10 years ago is starting to happen into the fertilizer sector. So -- and the sector also understands that, yes, there is a little bit of a premium, but the cost of fertilizer whether it's in sugar or cocoa or potatoes is not high compared to the cost of the end product. So it means going green fast is actually a lot easier than what people are saying. And are we seeing some premium today? Yes, we are. It kind of depends, but there's also one big thing that we have to keep in mind is the carbon border mechanisms, which are now being created. And this is where we will be in a great position because if we were to take ammonia alone, if we assume that the C bands that which will be starting to be enforced from 2026 onwards work is true, well, the reality is, as I mentioned earlier, 1 ton of ammonia is 2 tons of carbon -- 2 tons of carbon would cost about $200 a tonne, right? So that gives you a physical, I mean a logistical and commercial advantage to produce green versus gray imports, which will be highly taxed. Another question, do you intend to supply the local market? Or could you look further to Europe? Well, as I mentioned, we have indeed looked at the entire market. And our focus in every country we work with, it's a partnership with the host country, which is why we have teams on the ground, which are real partners like the team of Cavendish, like the team of Green Fuel, who understands the local side, it's not -- we don't do things just for exports, right? This is not the way to develop projects. These are -- these are facilities which will be here for the next 40 years, right? This is not 10 year and then you move on and you have a declining asset. These projects, once they are running, they will be running at 97%, 98% capacity flat for 40 years. So you need to look at it as a local partnership where your first project, your first market is the local market. And very quickly, you look at the regional side and when you look at the international side. The domestic and regional market of Mercosur is a great market because it's a market which has to import everything. So logistically, we already are and can be cheaper than any import, including the gray hydrocarbon-based imports. So that's fantastic. But when you have markets like Europe and even like Asia, which increasingly need more and more fertilizers and need more green fertilizer with higher taxes, it is absolutely crucial that we are able to export and being able to see it in Villeta makes it extremely easy for us to go all the way to Europe where there is already a green premium market that exists. It's still quite niche, but it's growing extremely fast, and we have had some incoming from some offtakers. Another question I see from Mike. Has ATOME considered any partnerships with other companies or industries in Paraguay to accelerate infrastructure build and costs? So as we talk, obviously, to the entire market, and we try to find the right partners for us across the level, right? So whether it's in Paraguay alone, yes. Obviously, the team between GM and most of the market of -- where most of the engineering firms. Clearly, it is not just about having international companies coming in and then leaving. It's about local content. We have -- we are also on the electromechanical study that we did. For example, that was done with the local companies -- so indeed, we -- as I said, we don't work in isolation. We don't fly in and fly out. It's all about making sure also we find the right people on the ground because it just makes sense on the long term, but it makes business sense, right? It is much cheaper to use very good qualified local labor than flying somebody from Houston or London or anywhere else. And another question from Mike. Will 300 megawatts for Yguazu projects also come from Itaipu. Or is it a new project? So no, it's -- and it's one thing I could have highlighted earlier that obviously, I forgot to say it now that Itaipu is the second largest hydroelectric dam in the world. It's 14 gigawatts and this is jointly owned between Brazil and Paraguay. So which means 7 gigawatts to Brazil, 7 gigawatts to Paraguay. But out of that 7 gigawatts net to Paraguay, Paraguay actually only use about 2 to 3 gigawatts and exports and has been exporting for the past 40 years that power into Brazil at a pre-agreed price, which is obviously pretty low. So it's all about using that excess power, which currently is exported and to use it for domestic purposes and upgrade it into a higher-end product for the country. And Paraguay has 3 hydroelectric plants. It's 100% green grid. So we are looking at leveraging these domestic electrons. Clearly, you're not going to do gigawatt projects in Paraguay. That is not the intention and that would also would not be right with ANDE as that they need to build the rest of the capacity for the country, but we are working completely within what is possible with about us having to ask ANDE to incur any new investments and leveraging exactly the best -- the best power available today globally, at one of the best prices globally. And I have one last question from David. Globally, a lot of the larger projects that have MOUs or agreements don't seem to be spending money, are some of these green hydrogens going to be delayed? So yes, we do see that historically, or at least for the past 2 years, the hydrogen and ammonia world has been the land of MOUs, a lot of announcements, a lot of noise in the price, which sounds great, which looks great for people to take pictures. But not a lot of reality behind even with the large investors. And actually, the way we started the company, was the realization that a number of very large companies we're studying and looking, but very few people were putting their money with the markets, including the very large companies. So the IRA in the U.S. has accelerated things significantly. And so we are seeing the U.S. taking a real leadership in moving forward, and this is the region where you will see a lot of the positive movement, but it will be the usual industry. Let's say, the CF industries in collaboration with Exxon and but otherwise, Europe has been delayed because even though you have announcements and you have a lot of strategies, which are supposedly relatable, from the moment you make your application for subsidy until the moment you actually have the money in the bank, it can take up to 3 years, right? So as the developer, it takes a lot of time. If you look at the U.K. example, if I were to do a new wind farm, to connect it to a hydrogen and hydrogen to ammonia project, the permitting takes for almost 10 years. The other side is a lot of projects are looking for perfection because their cost of power is so high that no matter how much the amount of subsidies that you have, if you are paying $150 a megawatt hour for your power, it makes zero sense to start up an electrolyzer, right? So it does make sense if you are below $50, but at the current prices and at the expected prices because, yes, the gas power -- the gas price is very low today, but is expected to go back up in the winter, should a cold season materialize. Again, it makes no economy of no sense. So a lot of these projects have been delayed whilst a lot of capacity has been built into manufacturing of electrolyzers, for example, which for us puts us into a great position because we are in a position, thanks to our advantageous position in the country between having baseload power from ANDE and the competitive cost, which is a regulated cost in the country enables us to move fast, faster and gives us an arbitrage that you have a number of projects which have been on hold and you have a number of EPC, procurement, engineering companies, electrolyzer manufacturers, who had to build capacity, but don't have an outlet of sale, which is, obviously, for us, it puts us into a very strong advantage to deliver at a lower cost than what everybody else has been looking at and deliver faster than what any other competition is looking at, which is why the industrial and fertilizer sector is taking us very seriously. And this is also why Baker Hughes came in as an investor because they have seen every single project in the world and really know where do we sit in that merit order and how quickly ATOME has been moving compared to the entire competition. So I think I'm done with all over Q&A.

Olivier, yes, I think you actually managed to address every question from investors. And of course, the company will review all questions submitted today and will publish those on the investor meet company platform. But perhaps just before redirect investors to provide you their feedback, which is very important to yourself, could I just ask you for a few closing comments?

So I think the closing comment I will make is first of all, to thank our shareholders. We've been, I think, very encouraged by the support that we have had so far. And obviously, this is all both new shareholders and old shareholders. We have -- we are moving -- ATOME is moving fast, and we will continue to move fast, but always in a very methodical way. So expect us to continue to develop projects the same way you develop very boring infrastructure projects, which are step by step. And we don't want to do too much. We do what is necessary to be credible. And so that the market can see that we are trying our best to deliver on time, on budget. And I think I'll leave a little bit of a marketing blurb now that we're going to do CAN and as we talk to the fertilizer market, they say, can you deliver CAN and our answer is yes, we can. Thank you.

Olivier, thank you very much for updating investors today. Could I please ask investors not to close the session as you now be automatically redirect to provide your feedback in order to the management team better understand your views and expectations. This let me take a few months to complete. [ Some ] will be greatly valued by the company. On behalf of the management of ATOME Energy PLC, I would like to thank you for attending today's presentation, and good afternoon to you all.