Beeks Financial Cloud Group plc (BKS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, and welcome to the Beeks Financial Cloud Group plc Investor Presentation. [Operator Instructions] Before we begin, I'd like to submit the following poll. I'd now like to hand you over to Gordon McArthur, CEO. Good afternoon, sir.

Thanks, Ellie. Welcome, folks. Apologies, I mean, Fraser looks [ close ] again, we're stuck in the same hotel room that happened maybe last year the year before. So I'm going to run through the first few slides and then Fraser, going to hand over on the financials and probably try to spend a bit more on Q&A this time because we tend to run out of time. So I'm not going to give the kind of usual company overview. I think we've done a lot of these presentations, and we're kind of going to skip forward a couple of slides on to kind of start with some of the product stuff. I'm assuming most people are aware of the company or if there's people that are not, as I say, there's a bunch of IMC previous meetings out there if you want to go get background. So we'll kind of jump to Slide 4 and an overview of our product set. This changes a little bit each year as we bring online new products, and it kind of goes through the 4 main areas that we've got now. So for those of you that have followed us for a long time and have read the results, still the majority of our revenue is Private Cloud deals, right, as the bread and butter of the organization. And that is when we build a cloud environment in a financial services data center that can be bespoke for a client or can be some of our vanilla packages that are offered and advertised on the website. And these deals can be small but they can be also very large, right? We've done deals GBP 5 million, GBP 6 million in TCV, and we do deals every week that's maybe GBP 1,000, GBP 3,000 or GBP 4,000. And we've literally got hundreds of clients that use us for various Private Cloud deployments around the world. Some clients grow very large. Some come in and take infrastructure from us and it stays static for 8, 9, 10 years. So there's a lot of variation in how our different clients behave. But it's still mainly the domain of kind of mid-market, right? We -- the bigger banks and investment managers do not like shared environments. They tend to go for a Proximity Cloud environment. So Proximity Cloud, again, now about 4 years old, I think, is dedicated cabinets, dedicated environments for a single client, complete network install, whatever compute requirements they need. We can house various different server vendors in that Proximity Cloud and usually comes bundled with our analytics and we sell it on a per cabinet basis over a fixed time period kind of long-term contract, typically 4 to 5 years. And we -- when we look at that, we look at the TCV of each deal, right? So if it's a GBP 50,000 a month transaction for 5 years, it's a GBP 3 million TCV for us. We recognize some of that in advance and then the rest of it over the life cycle of the contract. So Proximity Cloud, single use, single client can run multiple workloads but the key thing here is for one organization to use for their own usage, whatever that may be. Then we've talked a lot about Exchange Cloud over the years. Exchange Cloud is derived from proximity Cloud. So same underlying technology stack but has a multi-home component to it as well. So we can fit -- we can deliver this to an exchange data center. We become the cloud for the exchange. That's a marketing strapline or one of the marketing straplines. And they can either sell that cabinet or multiple cabinets to one client or they can have multiple clients on the same infrastructure or the same cabinet in a very secure manner. So that has been very successful for us. We'll cover different commercial models as we go through. I think we're now on exchange [indiscernible]. So over the last couple of years, we've rolled out -- we're currently on implementation phase with both Toronto and nuam Exchange that we signed in October, probably first half, October-ish of last year, and we've got more exchanges in the pipeline. We started talking last year, we released last year a Market Edge Intelligence product, which sits on top of our analytics offering, not completely -- not solely integrated with our analytics offering. It doesn't have to have our analytics. We can -- there's other analytics packages out there, and we can that. But it's an AI and ML framework that will give intelligence and oversight into the market data that we consume into our analytics or any third-party software stack. So these are software deals. We are close to signing our first one with a major bank that has gone through a very extensive POC. And I think we were honest last time we presented, we hadn't consumed customer market data. So it was a bit of a journey of discovery with the first client on the POC to see what Edge Intelligence would out in the real world. And thankfully, it's been very, very positive on the client choosing a couple of sites in production at the moment, and we're in discussions with a lot of other banks. These deals will be large. I mean, GBP 5 million TCV is probably the low side but don't expect us to be doing 100 deals a year. There's maybe 2 or 3 that we'd be aiming for but they would be on the larger side, right? And that's a software sale. So from a margin and profitability point of view that Fraser will cover later, much more margin heavy than the historical infrastructure business. So they are the 4 main product areas as Private Cloud is still the mainstay of the revenue and Proximity and Exchange Cloud as the revenue shares come on and start to fill up will become a more meaningful part of our overall group revenue going forward. So covering first half, I mean, listen, we -- the headline numbers don't tell a great half, right? But it's the first time we've actually shown year-on-year decline. But the reality of it is -- and anyone that follows us and anyone that understands our world, we look at when we announced the contract wins and we announced -- we announced and signed more contracts this half than we did in the first half of last year. So I think we were GBP 1.9 million TCV signed in our half this year compared to GBP 10.5 million -- sorry, just under GBP 10 million last year, right? So we actually signed way more contracts but they were late in the term. And we are not -- for all the infrastructure stuff, we only recognize revenue wins. Like when we sign a contract, it's great but we actually then have to go and deploy the platform. And that can take 8 to 10 weeks, right, sometimes quicker, sometimes a little bit longer. So when we are signing deals in December, the first week of December, it's fairly obvious to anyone that understands our business that revenue is not booking in the first half, it's second half business. So -- so as I say, I get that the headline numbers didn't read great but actually, it wasn't a bad half. It was just we signed the deals too late to recognize them. So that means that they've rolled into this half, and we will be recognizing in the current half. A lot of them already have. And the last bits and pieces of, I think, the last contract are getting done now. So yes, as I say, I get the headline numbers didn't read great. But if you actually -- if the deals had been signed earlier and we recognize the GBP 4.5 million that was sitting there, we would actually had a normal level of 20%-ish growth year-on-year. So more a timing issue than anything underlying -- any underlying weakness in the business. But again, yes, we're disappointed that for the first time ever, we showed a period-on-period decline from the previous year. But as I say, more timing than anything else. And we had another couple of big wins in the period. So TMX. So TMX is the 6th biggest exchange in the world as our biggest revenue share exchange client by the size. That will be going live, we hope in around April time. They were just getting the final ticks in the box from the regulator and then we're looking to kick that off around April. nuam, who we announced in the period as well. So nuam is a consolidation of 3 South American exchanges, not actually live as an exchange yet but that is going live very soon. And we have high hopes for it. It might be a bit of a slow burner as people get used to it and onboard but very little international participation in the markets at the moment. So we hope that we've never -- all the exchanges we've gone into are very mature with clients already there. This is completely opposite, right? This is effectively a new exchange getting launched and people will have to deploy infrastructure. So we've got high hopes we got a high percentage of not only that domestic market but international market. So 2 good wins for us, right, and both on the revenue share basis. I think we flagged on Monday, the 2 revenue shares that are already out there are proceeding to profitability a little bit quicker than we had originally budgeted for. So Kraken the crypto exchange went fully live in October. That is now profitable on a month-to-month basis for us. So the way we work that out is, say, for ease of math, the project cost us GBP 1 million over the 5 years term of the life cycle of the infrastructure. We need to make GBP 20,000 a month for that contract to be effectively profitable over the 5-year period, right? So Kraken has moved into profitability. I'd originally budgeted 12 months from going live because that might seem a long time, right? But a lot of exchanges will not advertise or talk to clients until the platform is live. So once it gets turned on, we then need to start a sales exercise, right? And sometimes it can take months, some of the bigger banks can take years to move infrastructure over on our platform. So originally, we budgeted 12 months to get to that operational monthly breakeven. Kraken in 5 months, ASX we've had clients onboarded. So ASX was the first equities exchange that have gone down the revenue share model. And again, some clients onboarded they were about October, November time as well, and we've got a large client that will be onboarded in the next month or 2, that takes us to that monthly breakeven point again. So we're seeing 6 months to breakeven rather than 12 months, right, which is encouraging early signs. And then we've got TMX and nuam coming on board over the next couple of months, and we've got more exchanges in the pipeline. So yes, I think there was a lot of nervousness on the revenue share model, especially from the investment community but the early signs are good, and it's doing as we expected. The other good part of the period, we had our best ever ACMRR period, right? So we look at GBP 60,000 net increase on the ACMRR figure every month, and it was pretty much there or thereabouts, right? So a good period. So again, the underlying business is strong, right? So what swung the numbers was a couple of the bigger deals falling outside the period, right but the actual underlying everyday deal type has been very strong in the first 6 months, and we can see that continuing for the second half. So as these revenue share deals come on next year, they will contribute to the ACMRR. The good thing is we're trying to get away from this not reliance, that's the wrong word but like the number being swung by these big deals either coming in or not coming in, right? So we -- GBP 60,000 per month will not be the target for next year. That will be up on the back of the revenue share deals coming in. I'm not going to give a figure at the moment, but hopefully, most of our forecasted gap next year will be covered by ACMRR, not these big Proximity Cloud deals and classic Exchange Cloud deals that make or break the number. So yes, I think it just shows progression in revenue booked for the period, right? So this goes back to 2022, which feels like a long time ago, right? We are increasing how much we sign every year pretty much year-on-year, right? 2023 was a bit of an anomaly but it's a good slide just trying to show how that is growing year-on-year, and there are some of the exchanges that we signed in the period, right, and some of the contributions to it. And I go back to IPO days or pre-IPO days. The reason we IPO-ed was we had a funding requirement. But we were really in the Tier 1 market, right? And that was always -- that wasn't our client base. Our client base was the mid-market. And that was the reason for IPO was to put some strength in the balance sheet, have very visible numbers in the world. All of our competitors are mostly private equity owned, running huge debt piles that in the current climate, I would be very uncomfortable with. We didn't want to go down that route. We wanted to be -- have our balance sheet and our profitability in the public domain, so people could see, give us a level of credibility. And it's to really start attacking that Tier 1 customer base. We have built products for them but we've been very successful, right? And these guys do not move quickly. Some of these engagements are 4 to 5 years from initial conversation to first contract. That's the reality of signing a big bank. Some of them are quicker but some of them are 5-year pursuits, right? And we've been doing that since we IPO-ed, and we have been relatively successful. So we're now more than Tier 1 clients, both directly with us and via our partners and sometimes partners bring a big bank as part of their deployments, especially in the ISV software vendor space. So again, go back to 7 years, the business has gone from GBP 3 million to -- the forecast is around about GBP 40 million midpoint between the 2 forecast about GBP 40 million this year. So while we've not always been perfect and sometimes I take the acquisition that we can be a little bit aggressive in our forecast. We have set -- we have achieved some of the things we set out to on the back of the IPO. And this just shows our Exchange Cloud footprint, which is increasing. North America has been -- North and South America has been very successful. GSE, the original exchange, and we still have a very strong relationship with them and we're pursuing other strategic initiatives with them outside of Exchange Cloud. Kraken is matching engineers within Europe but I think one of the sources of frustration is the lack of uptake by the European exchanges, and we hope we are going to sign our first European exchange before our financial year-end, but we've been frustrated. And I don't -- I have no answers why because I'm sure someone is going to ask me why have the European exchanges been so slow to adopt what we're doing. And I don't have an answer. I would -- we've tried our home exchange multiple times but I'm giving up. I'm not breaking to that because I end up being grumpy [indiscernible]. So revenue share model, we just wanted to touch on this because, again, there was a lot of nervousness about it as we announced this last year. I think it caused some anxiety because the classic contract as we call it was asset amount of money per cabinet per month for a long-term period, and that's very predictable revenue. But it was slow to convert, and we thought by offering revenue share; a, we could take a bigger part of the wallet share; and b, we could shorten the sales cycles. And that's happened, right? We wouldn't have signed the 4 exchanges on revenue share if we didn't have that -- like we wouldn't sign these exchanges unless revenue share was there. So I've kind of covered where we are with the first 2. And there is no long-term commitment from the exchange but also from us, right? If it doesn't work, and we are not making money, we lift and shift that environment to somewhere else. So really, it's a year's worth of depreciation or 2 years' worth of depreciation of an asset. So commercial downside to us is fairly limited and the upside is significant, right? And we've tweaked how we position knowing the revenue share and what we get as opposed to what the exchanges get and that's an evolving thing. So yes, it's been successful, and we'll go into next year with 4 revenue share clients fully live. And we hope that -- because Exchange Cloud is a small part of our number at the moment, deliver because we've not done any of the classic contracts. We hope that it will start to tick up. And as I've said before in previous presentations, I look at Exchange Cloud as a 10- to 15-year annuity revenue stream with 5-year renewal periods. Once this is in an exchange and it provides and it's popular, it's very, very, very, very sticky. So I get the 6-, 12-month views of markets and PLC land, but I look at this as a 10- to 15-year road map with each exchange. And it brings us by selling Exchange Cloud, some of these exchanges are very big, right? They're very big IT deployments. So it gives us other opportunities with the exchanges. And I think we first did this slide last year and our first deal on the direct customer contact -- contracts was announced in November or December. So we signed a large South African bank who were a decent consumer of Colo 2.0, which is what GSE called Exchange Cloud. So they've been using that for a couple of years now, very happy with it and came to contract directly for the FX deployment in London. That contract is now signed and will be delivered -- being delivered as we speak. They're also looking at a New York deployment. But that came as -- they hadn't heard of us before. That came as a direct result of us working with a bank via an exchange and then contracting directly. We're already starting to see it with the ASX. There's some conversations with some of the banks that we're talking already about further APAC deployments. So Exchange Cloud is a bridgehead into an exchange but it also brings other opportunities, right? We are working on some networking opportunities with both the GSE and another exchange that's fairly well down the sales path. So again, it opens these type of opportunities up. So we get such a close relationship with these exchanges once they onboard clients. Their clients and our clients, our success is their success. We have so many touch points between our team and the exchanges team, these relationships become very close, and that helps us position ourselves for other opportunities within the exchange. All right. I'll hand over to Fraser.

Thanks, Gordon. Good afternoon, everyone. So I'll cover the financial content of the deck. So just before we go into the financials, I thought it's probably helpful for a bit of context in terms of the current period, just to talk through some of the margin swings. So again, I think for those that follow us, our sort of profit margins, particularly the gross margin level are pretty consistent. And if you look back over the last 3 or 4 years, they've kind of been there or thereabouts the sort of 40% gross margin level. And that's really in terms of how we price. So we take the cost of the infrastructure, we take the cost of the data center costs, we apply a margin and we price that to the customer. So it's been broadly consistent over the period. A bit of context in the first half, Gordon touched on it already. So when we deploy a Proximity or an Exchange Cloud contract on the classic fixed price model, we have to take about half of the revenue upfront. So what is booked in that period is around about half of the revenue of the contract value and the cost of the hardware. So it has quite a big sort of drop-through into gross profit. So as Gordon explained, the timing of when we deploy those deals has quite a big impact on not only the revenue but the profitability on that period. So if you look at the margin movement between the 2 periods, it's gone down 8%. But the kind of key thing to take away on that is it's not so much how we price the economics of the deals, it's more the timing of that. So most of that is timing in terms of when we deploy those deals. There is also a bit of upfront capacity investment where we take space in the data center contracts and then the revenue flows after that. And also some of these rev share models where we've got some upfront costs, but it's starting off a 0 revenue as opposed to a fixed price GBP 20,000 per month. So I thought it would be helpful just to give that context before we go into the rest of the income statement. So again, just looking at some of the key metrics. So period-on-period, it does show a decline because if you compare this period with the period last year, the upfront revenue recognition across Proximity and Exchange Cloud deals closed and delivered in the period, the difference was last year was about over GBP 3.3 million against GBP 0.5 million this year. So that's had an impact on the half. as Gordon says, the timing of those deals that were signed in December, they are going to be H2 weighted, right? So they will be recognized and deployed in the second half of the period. The positive thing that, again, Gordon has touched on already is the actual committed revenue. So that's our kind of key health check of the business. So that ACM -- our annualized committed monthly recurring revenue is up 15%, which again is a really good positive increase in the period. And then we've also moved to the revenue share model. So as we move forward, we've become less reliant on deals being delivered in the period. It goes back to the historic way that the business was recognized. The revenue was deployed monthly and it was recognized monthly. So again, a nice benefit from that as well. Touched on the gross margin already. So I won't explain that. So again, the other kind of investment in the period, and I think we said this at the end of last year, we budgeted about around about 12 people into the business. So that recruitment has happened. It happened in H1. Headcount will largely be unchanged in H2. So as we deploy those Proximity and Exchange Cloud deals and we kind of -- the administration cost of business tend to flatline, that's when we start going back to kind of normal profit margin that we have seen historically. And things like edge intelligence software sales will typically have a higher margin than the infrastructure sales. So there's positivity in that point as well. So yes, as Gordon says, looking at it period-on-period, it doesn't look great. However, there's a lot of timing playing into consideration in the period. We thought this would be helpful. So as I say, the committed revenue is just under GBP 33 million but Exchange Cloud and Proximity Cloud is still quite a low percentage of our recurring revenue. We've shown it 2 ways here. So Exchange Cloud, because we take half upfront on the fixed price deals, that remaining half is divided over the lifetime of the contract, right? If you take accounting and timing out of it where you don't have the upfront element, Exchange Cloud though is still only 4% of our business. And Kraken minimal impact on the period in terms of revenue. But with Kraken, the ASX, Toronto, nuam all coming on in the second half, we expect that to start being a much bigger percentage of the overall recurring revenue. So I thought that would be helpful just to show that there's a long way to go in terms of Exchange Cloud. And then just going into the cash flow. So a period of quite significant investment. So these Proximity Exchange cloud deals, we required to fund the CapEx upfront. So across the movement in payables and within PPD, there's about GBP 6 million of investment there. So that was deploying some of the proximity clouds at the end of last financial year and also the upfront investment in all the proximity Exchange cloud that we've talked about over the last sort of 30 minutes or so. So these get funded upfront. And then ultimately, that cash, that operating cash comes back over the next 4 to 5 years. So we've made quite an investment in the period. We also stockpiled some more infrastructure given some of the supply pressures on some of our compute. So we've got additional capacity. We've got enough to do another 4 or 5 exchange cloud with that current capacity. So H2 will not have the same level of investment as H1. We took down a bit of debt in the period. We're still a net cash business, which not all our peers can say that. But we used a bit of asset finance. We took down some additional debt of about GBP 3 million just to kind of maintain current cash levels but -- our balance sheet is still tidy in terms of our borrowing compared to our EBITDA. It's we're low levels of debt. So we'll continue to monitor that. Some customers pay in advance, which again will help cash flow, but we have GBP 10 million of accrued income. So that is all going to unwind. That's the upfront proximity, Exchange Cloud revenue recognition. And ultimately, that cash will start flowing through into the business over the next 3, 4 years of these contracts. So balance sheet remains strong and low levels of debt still as a business.

All right. Thanks, Fraser. So I think going into the second half, I think the reality of it was we've got about GBP 5 million bridge to get to forecast. And I can't remember if that's midpoint of forecast or whatever but to get there or thereabout. So that's the size of the gap when you look at where we are from a recurring revenue point of view and the revenue that we didn't book in the first half. So not [indiscernible] at all. So that's what we've got to deliver in the second half, and there's a pipeline that supports that, right? And it's like any -- if the pipeline closes, we'll be fine. If it doesn't, then we won't, right? So that's where we're at but we are monitoring closely and there's some deals that are closed that are fairly significant. But getting a bank to adhere to a June deadline because it's our year-end, it's not the year-end, right? So we try what we can. But is what it is. We use commercial levers where we can, but we are still relying on clients putting signatures and contracts. We're still only scratching the surface for all the stuff. There's -- we are now signing a lot of Tier 1s. But the way they act is they don't bring you on as a new supplier, and I've said this many times before. They give you a project to test you, right? And that project might take half a year to implement and then they'll test it and monitor it for a year and then you have a conversation about the next project that will tend to be bigger or more sites or whatever. And then you can finally start to talk big numbers, right? Banks can sign $100 million infrastructure contracts easily, especially the biggest ones that we're dealing with. And ultimately, that's where we want to and are striving to get to. But it doesn't happen overnight. And when you take into account, some of them are a 4-year pursuit to get a contract and then you've got to deliver, you've got to prove yourself, that's the game we are playing in, right? You can't -- trying to flex it to hit 6 months or half year or full year numbers, sometimes it doesn't work, right? But are we doing the right things? We have a lot of MSA discussions with banks at the moment, some closing off relatively short order, I think. So that's the size of the gap we've got. It's about GBP 5 million. We've got a pipeline that gets us there, and we need to go over and kind of execute it right and continue to not only focus on the big stuff but the run rate Private Cloud business is still our bread and butter, and we're still doing very well with that on a month-to-month basis. Yes, just to close off, historically, we've grown 20% to 30% every year. We still expect to do that this year despite the fact that the first year -- first half looks a little bit weak. But as we said, timing more than anything. We generate cash. We're going to focus on cash generation going forward and make sure that, that becomes better. We've got a lot of good partnerships, and we are winning a lot of conversations to move into contract stage with banks, brokers and exchanges. And we're [indiscernible] still. No, I'm not saying it's early days in financial services but there's still a lot to go. Most of our clients are still doing stuff themselves. And we have built an AI/ML product. We are not about to pretend that an AI company, right? And we have taken advantage of it -- or we have provided technology to help some of our customers in a real-world market problems. So we're in a good place. Still looking for a good full year and pipeline, again, is strong for next year. So we're not a bad place. So thanks, folks. We'll move on to Q&A.

Let me just have a look at the first question. Is there a chance in NASDAQ contract could be regained? I said last year, I'm not talking about NASDAQ again. No. Just how significant is your competitive advantage. Why is no one else doing this? It's significant, right? It's not just that we've built the technology, and it's tried and tested. And that is the most important thing in our world. Does it work? Does it fall down? Is it reliable? Is it secure? We have tried and tested it. This segment is not big enough for the hyperscalers to be that interested in it. The local exchange presence despite what they might say and hyperscalers have for years been talking about exchanges moving into the cloud. What they fail to mention is it's middle and back office is moving in the cloud. Front office, i.e., transactions trading will never move into the cloud despite what the hyperscalers have been saying for years. We've been saying it's not still never a meaningful exchange has put any matching engine of any note into the cloud. It will not happen. Why are our competitors not doing it? I mean our competitors don't really innovate, right? They do M&A. They build up big debt piles and service them. We don't do that. We build products and we continue to enhance products. I can't comment on why other people don't want to go down our route. They are more managed service providers and we see ourselves a bit of a cloud provider. Can you talk about your growth ambitions, just how big is the opportunity? I mean, if anyone follow us for a while, I think in terms of growth, we have big ambitions, right? I'm not going to give numbers because I already criticized for it. Gordon said 3 years ago, he's going to do this, like things change. And I would expect this to be GBP 100 million turnover business. At some point, it's not going to happen next year, right? But at some point, that would be -- we're only scratching the surface. As I say, 1 or 2 banks could sign contracts -- a bank can easily sign a contract worth GBP 15 million, GBP 20 million a year with us but it comes in stages. Is there a potential to increase your share of the economics and revenue share deal, which is... Yes. I'm not going to go into details because our competitors log on and this is kind of commercially sensitive but yes. The plan is the new revenue model of the Exchange Cloud leads to an accelerated conversion of your sales pipeline, yes. I mean I think we've proven it, right? We've signed more exchanges in the last year with revenue share than we did in the last 3 years in the classic contract. So I think it's been proven it's worked. So I don't know what else to say. Sorry, does the Middle East conflict affect you since the target primarily emerging markets? We are -- does it -- yes and no. We're in discussions with a number of the Middle Eastern exchanges. And obviously, we have came off at the moment, hopefully temporarily. But other than that, does it affect us? I mean, it affects me moving to Dubai but other than that, it affects me personally. But I don't think other than a few conversations temporarily hope to in the Middle Eastern exchanges that any other exposure than that. Investors worry about slowing underlying momentum here. Do you see this? No. I think we've talked about it. No. Is GBP 40 million sales still a number that you have in mind for the year? That's a forecast. We've not changed the forecast. So yes, that's still what we're looking to do as a minimum. What gives you comfort that you can find GBP 4 million or GBP 5 million of revenue is not secure? What gives us comfort that we can hit the target? I mean I see the pipeline. I got the clients. I'm doing the contracts. If we sign them, we'll do it. If we don't, we won't. Once peaks has reached a steady state, what do you think will be sustainable margins?

The question is once peaks reaches a steady state, what do you think the sustainable EBIT margin can be? Yes. I mean, I think the answer to that is there's a lot of runway still. We -- the infrastructure sales and margins, as I said earlier on, should be addressed to the kind of typical value. For us scaling and keeping good cost control, there's more scope in the margin. You layer on, as I said, some of the software deals, which is higher margin as well, there's definitely runway in terms of where we've been historically, which has been about this 15% to 16% operating profit margin. There's definitely more we can get to there. Exchange Cloud -- can you give us an indicator on how the Exchange Cloud revenue builds up from a standing start?