Central Bank of India (CENTRALBK) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Central Bank of India Q4 FY '23 Earnings Conference Call, hosted by Antique Stock Broking Limited [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Raju [ Burnwal ] from Antique Stock Broking Limited. Thank you, and over to you.

Thank you, Riyan. Good afternoon, everyone. On behalf of Antique Stock Broking Limited, I welcome you all to the Central Bank of India Q4 FY '23 Earnings Conference Call. And I thank the management for providing this opportunity to host the call. So from the senior management side, today, we have with us Mr. M.V. Rao, MD and CEO; Mr. Vivek Wahi, Executive Director; Mr. Rajeev Puri, Executive Director; Mr. M.V. Murali Krishna, Executive Director; and Mr. Mukul Dandige, Chief Financial Officer. So now without further delay, I hand over the call to MD sir for his opening remarks, post which we will have a Q&A session. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Yes. Thank you. A very good afternoon to all of you. And first of all, thank you for investing your time. And let me assure you -- let me assure you that ROT, your return on time will be very appreciable. And before giving you the highlights, let me take you back a year in 2021, '22 results day, where we have given you the guidance that business growth will be 8% to 10%. We have achieved 8.39%, and deposit growth will be 5% to 7%. We have achieved 4.85%. That is 4% lower than the estimate. And advances growth, we have given 13% to 15%, and we have achieved 14.79%. CASA will be more than 50%. Now we are at 50.39%. And corporate credit book balancing with RAM and corporate, 65%, 35%. So we are at 66.46 RAM and 33.63 on the corporate. NIM more than 3%. This time, we are 3.64%, gross NPA below 8%, we are at 8.44%. Net NPA below 2%, we are at 1.77, PCR more than 92%, we are at 92.48%, slippage ratio 2 to 2.25, we're at 1.9 months, credit cost, 1 to 1.25, it is at 0.83. Return on assets, 0.40 to 0.45, we're at 0.43 and cost-to-income ratio of 53% to 55%, we are at 56.35%. So among all these certain parameters, 100% we have surpassed the guidance what we have given in 10 parameters. In 3 parameters, we have achieved almost 96%. One more thing that I would like to share, we are very happy that this is an excellent year for the bank's highest ever recorded net profit. Because in 2010, we have recorded INR 1,059, after 2010, this is the figure in 2023, where we have recorded INR 1,582 crores of net profit. Having said this, let me come to the business model. This year also, we are not going to change much on the business model. We will continue to focus on the credit book with the balancing of RAM and credit with 65% and 35%, with plus or minus 5%. And co-lending stream, which has picked up well, that will continue to be one more stream where we will be posting to improve upon on our asset side. On our liability, our CASA will be striving to be above 50%. We will continue to do that. And one more thing I would like to say that we have not resorted to any issuance of the CD. So in this new financial year also, we may not require any CDs to rise as our liquidity is ample. Our LCR stands at 285%. And coming to the investment book with a reasonable return, our principle is to protect the book from the volatilities that we will continue to do so. And then as far as the organization structure is concerned, now all the new structures, what we had tweaked in between are doing well and acceleration will be done on those -- leverage will be done on those structures. And coming to the products, lot many new products we have introduced and which is received well. And one of the most important and very good product that has gone well in the market is the Grah Laxmi, where we have given the lowest ROA for the women beneficiaries for their housing. So already, we have booked INR 6,300 crores in that book. And coming to the people, we will continue to invest in our manpower to upgrade and upskill their knowledge and also skill levels. So coming to the highlights. Regarding total business, it stands at INR 5.77 lakh crore with 8.39% growth, total deposits at INR 3.59 lakh crores, that is 4.8% growth. Gross advances stands at INR 2.17 lakh crore, which is 14.79% growth, CASA INR 1.80 lakh, that is 50.06. RAM at INR 1.44 lakh crores, net NPA is below 2%, that is 1.77%. And operating profit for the quarter, it stands at INR 2,108 crore. For the year, it is INR 6,884 crore. So net profit for the quarter, it is INR 571 crores. And for the year, it is INR 1,582 crore. As far as the NIM for this quarter, it stands at 4.24%, for the entire year, it is 3.64. ROA for the quarter 0.61%, for the whole year, it stands at 0.44%. ROE, it is 2.27% for this quarter and 6.42% for the whole year. So for other financial performance, I request my CFO, Mr. Mukul, to apprise you with the details of the financial performance. Yes, Mukul.

Thank you, sir. If you see our total interest income has grown in -- on the Q-o-Q and Y-o-Y basis. On a Y-o-Y basis, the total interest income has grown by 12.02%, and it has reached a level of INR 25,542 crores. The total interest expenses have increased only by 4.06% and stood at INR 13,855 crores. And the net interest income stood at INR 11,687 crores which is Y-o-Y growth of robust 23.19%. If we see the operating profit, it stood at INR 6,884 crores, registering a growth of 19.89% and the provisions increased by 27.70%. However, if we -- I mean factor the contingency provisions that we have built up, the provision amount would be lesser than what we had done in the last year. And net profit improved by 51.39% to INR 1,582 crores during this financial year. Same goes with the fee-based income where the bank was able to record 25.40% upside on the overall fee-based income from INR 1,425 crores to INR 1,787 crores, mainly because of the -- I mean, the recovery in return of accounts that we received this has been possible. As far as the expenses go, total interest expenses, I told increased by 4.06%. The interest paid on deposits increased by 4.20%. The operating expenses moved up to INR 8,887 crores with a growth of 32.38%, and other operating expenses showed a growth of 17.84%. The staff cost increased by -- I mean, increased by 42.7%. However, that -- I mean, that includes some one-off items that was there that padding we have done. And the provisions, as I said, total provisions for NPAs increased by 44.01%. However, there was a contingency provisions that we have built up, I mean, into the system. So if we remove those contingency provisions, the provisions -- the credit cost would be substantially lower. We have also built up some provisions on standard assets where we foresee some -- maybe some issues in some of the accounts. The income tax provision increased from INR 672 crores to INR 1,063 crores, a growth of 58.18%. Thus, the total provisions increased by 27.7%. As far as the capital adequacy goes, we -- capital adequacy improved to 14.12%, and the provision coverage ratio increased to 92.3%. So these are basically the other financial highlights of the bank.

Yes. This is from our side. Probably you must have gone through the entire presentation uploaded in the website. And if anything has to be clarified, now you can make it open to all the participants.

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from the line of Ashok Ajmera from Ajcon Global Services Limited.

Congratulations and compliments to you for the fantastic performance of this quarter. Overall, also for the year, also the performance is excellent. But in this quarter, you have exceeded the -- some of the expected numbers, so compliments for that, sir. Having said that, sir, our -- I mean, of course, the legacy, we have a very high gross NPA we used to have, brought it down below 10% and now 8.44%. But it's still the gross NPA front, which is almost I think INR 18,386 crores. What is your view going forward, looking at NARCL and other asset sale to other ARC or any plan? And what is the target of bringing in the whole year, the gross NPA because net NPA is very much under control, and that will also can be brought in by increasing the provisions. So that is in your hand. But for the gross NPA, what is our planning, number one. Number two, we have done very well on the credit front also. So going forward, whether this -- the credit growth, which is achieved almost about 15%, 14.79% wherever we are heading for the financial year now '23, '24. And similarly, on the recovery front, we have done very well. But slippages have -- also in this quarter, have gone up, I think, from INR 636 crores to INR 1,085 crores. Then we have been talking about contingency provisions. So what is the total buffer provision buildup for COVID as well as the overall offer, which we have in our books. So this is on -- broadly on advanced credit and recovery side and the gross NPA side. If you please give some light on this. Then I can come for my second question just now.

See, as far as reducing the gross NPA, we are relying on transferring certain accounts to the NARCL. Even if that is not going to materialize in the first half year, we have a plan to reduce to the extent that gross NPA will come down below 5.5%. That is the plan we have. Even NARCL, if we don't materialize also we have the plans so that if it become below 5.5%, that is for the gross NPA. Because it is very much in our hands how we are going to deal with that because the entire 100% provisions are made. That is one part. And coming to the second question, provisions where buffer is built up. There is an excellent one excellent question because this gives the actual big picture of the future of how a strong balance sheet is built up. If you see the total NPA provision that is made in March 23 is INR 3,534 crore. It has a contingent provision to the extent of INR 1,533 crores. This, you can call it in any way you can take it, whether we made it for the COVID or non-COVID, but this is the provision we made it to make our balance sheet future proof. So that is a major chunk that is there in that. And regarding standard assets also, there is a INR 575 crores from certain accounts where we feel that it is required to be done because we have enough resources to buffer the provisions. That's why we did it in the standard also to the extent of INR 575 crores. Both put together, it is almost INR 2,100 crores that we have strengthened this balance sheet through this provision portfolio. Any other questions that was asked?

Yes, sir, there was a credit and recovery and on the credit front, what is our now target for the future, we have achieved a good credit front.

The advance of growth at this time guidance we are giving 12% to 14%. That guidance, we will continue to hold it. Earlier also, we promised 13% to 15%, and we have ended up with 14.79%. Now this time a range of 12% to 14%, we have given, and we will be achieving that. And overall, our credit book will be balanced with the RAM and corporate in the ratio of 65%, 35%, with plus or minus 5%. That's always a -- where we are giving that leeway. That is on the credit side. And the recovery. Recovery will continue to be a trust area for us. And now more focus will be shifted on to the recovery in the return of accounts, leeway recovery that has happened in the previous year, a big amount we could able to realize in written-off accounts that will be going to add to our bottom line. In this year also, our focus will be a recovery on the written-off accounts.

Okay. Sir, my next question is on the treasury operations. I mean, irrespective of all the problems and the rate hike and everything, you have done well on the treasury front also. But if you just look at the segment wise profit. I mean there is a lot of variation. Treasury is okay. But in retail, there against the loss of INR 552 crores in this quarter, it has gone to INR 1,267 crores. Similarly, for wholesale, as against the profit of INR 514 crores, it has gone to INR 1,423 crores. So is there any reshuffling between the credit and wholesale portfolio or the -- because of the provisioning, it has been affected with the figures.

The contingency that we have built up mostly now it is in retail that we have done the additional provision. So that is why retail segment is showing a loss. Whereas in corporate, 2 things. One, lesser provision required. Secondly, the recovery in write-off has happened mostly in the corporate accounts.

Yes, yes. All right, sir. So on treasury funds, sir, any like now the rates are -- I mean, the RBI has also taken a fall. So looking at some of the lag effect is still going to be there. So where do -- what do we see going forward the treasury profit, M2M as well as the trading profit.

Seems very why. As far as MTM is concerned, with the recent tons of RBI, we do not really foresee any rising yields or any MTM risk in the ensuing quarter. Rather, we are expecting that in Q4, there would be -- there should some rate cut should start. So we are hoping to get a good amount of profits by way of reduction yields getting suffered say 675 level. In fact, this is a good time for treasury to build some duration. So we are looking in that direction.

All right, sir. And my last question in this round is on the capital raise. You got the approval of INR 2,500 crores. What are our plans now. Though the share price is always again recovered but it's still on the equity dilution, I mean, by way of issuing the fresh equity, do you think that it is the right time even at this price also, where I think we are near to maybe book value or a little bit about that. You are really interested to go for FPO.

The first and foremost thing is that we intend to go with the entire 2 bond issue. So with that last time, we had often the board approval for raising up to INR 1,500 crores. Now because the rates moved in an unfavorable situation -- unfavorable way the last few days of March, we did not go to the market. As it is if you see, we are comfortably, I mean, capitalized at 14.12%. So within this INR 1,500 crores or INR 2,000 crores of Tier 2 capital, we should be somewhere in the range of 15.6% to 15.75%. Thereafter, we'll I mean, take a call on -- in which way we want to raise the further capital if required.

Our next question comes from the line of Sushil Choksey from Indus Equity Advisors.

Congratulations to management and team Centralites. Sir, my first question is you've given a credit guidance of 12% to 14%, and you've also highlighted between corporate book and retail book. First is, you've also focused on gross NPA and net NPA numbers reduction. Where do you see margins on a stable node for the next whole year, sir?

Choksey, NIM, we are very much sure that our NIM will be in excess of 3.5%, should not be any issue because we have a very good more than 50% CASA base. So that continues to be our focus area. And with the interest rates at a competitively elevated level, our margins would continue to be better.

Okay. Now any great initiative not to -- we have got the best sustainable CASA in banking industry over the last 5 years, 6-year period. Any new trends which can emerge for increasing the number towards 54%, 55% over a period of 2, 3 years?

See, apart from our traditional stronghold, we are venturing into the new areas where we are eyeing for low-cost deposits, that right at this moment, I do not want to divulge because it is in a nascent stage. But in this financial year, it will take the full shape and we are going to reap the benefits. But our guidance will continue that our CASA will be more than 50%.

Sir, based on the CASA and the strength which you have built over a period of last couple of years and the team has done a lot of effort, how do you see our retail business growing, including the women housing scheme and many, many other products that we can launch or maybe gold loan or any other kind of products or development which would lead to retail forte, which Centralites would be known for.

Yes. In this, we will continue to hold our position as far as the retail is concerned, wherever any changes that are required in the products, we are going to make it, and it will be a market competitive product that we will bring. And whatever the growth that we are envisaging on the retail side that we are confident of achieving. There is no issue because of the franchise, what we have and another stream what we have opened up through co-lending, both are doing well, and it will continue to do perform well now.

Sir, why is our income tax effective rate so high in this year? And what is the likely rate we should assume for next year?

See, for income tax, there are so many things because we had brought forward losses of the previous year. Now that our -- I mean, the business losses -- I mean, we have started making profits. So our business losses have started to go down. And that is why probably the effective tax rate is appearing higher because earlier, if you see due to the creation of DT and other things, the effective tax rate was comparatively lesser -- going forward, effective tax rate, we can assume in the range of 26%, 27%.

Sir, my next question is we are leading the pack, specifically in public sector where the numbers are shared in co-lending. The initiative has worked well. The Ministry and RBI is also encouraging that. Can you highlight some points on the outstanding book? Any new products which we have launched in co-lending or what can be done over a period of next 1 or 2 years where retail engine would work along with the co-lending book and the retail products well?

On the core lending side, we have created a separate vertical where GM is heading. That is totally focusing on the co-lending partnership, collaboration, all these things that particular vertical is focusing. So coming to the co-lending already, we have tie up with 14 or 15 NBFCs for different products. And now this year, we will be focusing more on the niche products where we see that good margins are available and safety is also insured. Such type of products we will be focusing where any NBFC is having strength in that niche we will ready to collaborate with them. This is how our plan will be for the co-lending.

Sir, is it right that the number of advances, currently, we have almost INR 5,500 crores, INR 6,000 crores of advances under co-lending.

Yes.

Yes. INR 6,303 crore, precisely.

How much, sir?

INR 6,303 crore.

Congratulations on the numbers. Sir, Central Bank, human resource. You've taken a lot of initiatives in the last 24 months. Anything further, which we are doing to strengthen the bank's position?

Bank's position now, already our consultants and our entire dedicated team is on work on the transformation. It is transformation. It is not just on the digital front or also on the delivery channels. So a lot of work is being done now. And probably in this financial year, by third quarter, we will be realizing certain benefits out of this transformation project. So that is totally creating a bank within the bank the concept to what I told you earlier, that entirely digital bank will be catering to the needs of our digital native and also catering to the people who are tech-savvy.

So what is the budget on digital this year?

This year, it is almost INR 1,200 crores.

Okay. Sir, my last question in the current round. Mr. Wahi highlighted on treasury, sir, congratulations on a stable number from treasury. And you, I think, gave an insight that you may see 6.75 on 10-year bonds by the year-end. Am I -- did I hear right, sir? And what's your view on the treasury profit?

Yes, because we expect a rate cut in Q4. So definitely, yields are going to soften. And it can be even lower than 675. As a result, AFS book will be profit as well as a part of some MTM book can also be in a big profit. So overall, this year, will be good for treasuries of all public-sector banks.

Congratulations. Best wishes for years to come.

[Operator Instructions] Our next question comes from the line of Jyoti Singh from Arihant Capital Markets Limited.

Sir, congratulations on the good set of numbers. My question is on the demand side, how is the demand seen in the corporate segment? And how are the inquiries in corporate and the growth is coming from CapEx related or still working capital-led demand? And has been there and also sectors which are seeing good demand within corporates?

Madam, let me tell you the way we have planned the growth in our credit book, that is 35% is on the corporate side. Now we have reached the stage where we are in a position to pick up the assets of our own choice. So our choice will always be towards the capital-led assets. So in that front, if you see my CRW, that is credit risk-weighted assets on this one, it is 63%. So main contributor is from the corporate side. So our focus on the corporate side will be on the lower risk-weighted assets, trading off with our lower rate of interest because we have that pricing forward due to the CASA. Having said this, whatever the gap that's eminent because of the repayment or the targets what we have set in, we were very, very choosy in picking up the triple-layer rated companies. So it's not that I will be waiting for any new company to come and ask our -- in our working capital requirements, there may be more for the industry. My position is entirely different if you compare with the other players in the industry as far as the corporate finance is concerned. And as far as the demand that is what is coming in just as inquiries, yes, there is from the infra side, there is a little bit demand that is coming, but we are -- that's what we say we are very choosy what type of assets we have to build up in our book. Focus will be on the credit risk weight. So all the new infra, definitely, their risk weight will not be 20% or 30%. So that is the second priority for us to pick up such type of assets.

Okay. And my next question is on the home loan traction side portfolio. Like how is the traction over the home loan portfolio? And like a rate transmission in that portfolio, like how much rate hike you have been able to pass on and demand scenario over tail?

Just 1 minute, Madam. What is the rate we have passed on in the housing loan?

Yes.

One point my housing loan portfolio is INR 38,790 crores, that is almost INR 39,000 crore. And as far as the growth is concerned, it is almost 23% -- Y-o-Y growth is 28%. So as far as your specific question of passing on the rates 1.75, we have passed down, though there is an increase of 2.5.

Okay. And sir, a demand scenario over there?

Yes. That's why we have grown almost 28%.

Okay. And what are the expectations going forward, sir, on that?

It will continue to be there. Demand will continue nothing -- we are not seeing any flatness in the demand as far as the housing loan product in our bank is concerned.

Our next question comes from the line of Sohail Halai from Antique Stock Broking Limited.

Sir, a couple of questions. One, in terms of -- you said that you have made contingent provision. Can you actually quantify that contingent provision made during the quarter and during the year?

Yes.

During the year, I can tell you, INR 1,530 crores roughly, we have built up. On a quarter-on-quarter basis, it will vary. However, I mean, you can easily take around INR 350 crores to INR 400 crores is built up over this quarter also.

Okay. Okay. So this actually pertains to in terms of -- you also said that probably you are looking at some amount of corporate stress, if I'm not wrong -- or some of the mid-corporates?

It is likely possible to have mismatches in that cash flow, maybe because of various regions. And also, we have to have a safe parking place for our amounts for parking. So we thought it is better to park in these segments so that at least people -- investors, analysts will appreciate the strength of our balance sheet.

Sure, sure. So, I was just looking at the SMA-2 numbers, SMA numbers as well that you actually shared. So in terms of above INR 5 crores, I see a very low number that is still. So probably in terms of -- are you in seeing that probably in terms of there is no corporate star and you are talking more about from the SMA segment point of view?

As such corporate book, we are not seeing any such type of stress in general. That's why the SMA numbers are also very low on the corporate, that is above INR 5 crores. It is miniscule that SMA 2, you have SMA-1, okay, that will get -- that's why our slippage ratio when you see quarter-to-quarter, it is substantially coming down.

Right, right. And sir, a couple of comments in terms of the pricing of the corporate, we have probably in terms of one of the low cost of points and very adequate liquidity. The bond market was actually relatively low, but now how are you pricing the loans and whether that benefit is visible in the margins, sir?

See, our pricing always -- we take all the factors into, even how money market and how the -- these things are -- amounts are being raised in the money market. Accordingly, we will price. And our price, definitely, we will make the corporates feel comfortable in taking with us because of the lower rate that we always trade off.

Okay. And sir, final outlook in terms of the ROAs. So we exit the ROA at 0.6%, and for the full year, it's closer to 0.4% and 0.45%. So probably, in terms of your expectation, what is the kind of an ROA that we can expect in FY '24 and beyond. So any broad range?

Yes, yes. For the '23, '24, we have given the guidance of 0.75%, more than 0.75%, that is our guidance.

And in this guidance, sir, are you building in that next year too, you will continue to create some kind of a contingency buffer in your balance sheet? Or this is excluding that?

That -- we will decide only in Q3 because the way we've gone regarding our operating profit based on that, we will decide in what -- where we have to move. See, if things move well, the way we have planned, probably by Q2 next financial year, we may not find ways to pass anywhere entire amount we have to show.

And sir, final question from my side. From the margin perspective, you had given a guidance of around 3% margin, you are ending up at somewhere around 4.25%. For next year, you have given a range of 3.25% to 3.5% where you mentioned that 3.5% is something that probably in terms of you are looking at, but is this number very conservative given the liquidity that we still have on the balance sheet? Or is it factoring in that possible rate cuts that would lead to margin compression. So if you could just...

On both the front, you are right. Because ample liquidity is there. And also, we are thinking -- we are also expecting some rate cuts. And at the same time, earlier I told you we are going to trade off between the rate of interest and the quality of the asset. And then -- that's why we are not giving beyond that. But this is a floor whatever we have mentioned in the guidance.

And sir, your focus is probably more in terms of the quality of assets. So probably in terms of excluding the contingent provisions, the credit cost you are running at around 40, 50 basis points, can one assume that number to be basically in terms of a steady state or a sustainable number? Because I think in your presentation, again, you have mentioned less than one, but with focus on strong asset quality or strong corporate, can the corridor be much lower in FY '24?

Exactly. It will be below 1 because whatever the factors you have mentioned, yes, because of that only, we are projecting it will be less than 1.

[Operator Instructions] Our next question comes from the line of Akash Jain from Ajcon Global Services Limited.

Congratulations on a very good set of numbers. My question pertains to the subdued growth in the fee-based income, your outlook on it? And second one is on [indiscernible] NPL regulation front?

First one is fee-based.

Fee-based income. If you see -- overall fee-based income, we have registered a Y-o-Y growth of 25.40%.

On Q-on-Q basis, it looks subdued. So I just wanted to understand, if corporate-related work is going down or what is happening on that front? Because our credit book is going strongly, but fee-based income is subdued on Q-on-Q basis.

So actual -- if you see our overall fee-based income has gone up from INR 1,425 crore to INR 1,787 crore. If you see quarter-on-quarter, you are saying December, we were INR 464 and INR 463 crore. So those numbers may appear as, I mean, comparable. But other factors, I mean, in fee-based income, I do have PSLC sale other receipts my recovery in write-off all these areas are there. So if you consider all these, I mean, factors, the overall growth is substantial. And we do not foresee any, I mean, reduction in these -- in fee-based income or any of other service charges and other miscellaneous income.

And also on the pension pipeline and underutilized limit as on day.

We don't have any major numbers under this category.

Because of our focus on the capital conservation, we ensured that whatever the line we have given people have picked up. Wherever it is not used, we have canceled their limits, so that to save the capital on that. So we do not have undrawn, except in term loans where partial drawdown that happens as per the stages. That will continue to be there.

Okay. And your outlook for on the standard restructured advances, any slippages that we are expecting going forward as in the opening remarks, you have mentioned that we are providing for -- provision for standard assets. So any stress we are forcing in a restructured book also?

Not much, not much. In the restructured book, it is quite stable now.

And any problems in the MSME book?

Problem in?

MSME book?

MSME book, I don't say it is 24 carat. It continues to be under 18 carat only, but we have enough grip on the collections. And also wherever any stress is there, we are really going into the issue. If some help is required that we are providing. Otherwise, we are leaving the account to become NPA.

Yes. And secondly, sir, on the cost-to-income ratio. So in the most optimistic scenario, what can be the cost-to-income ratio going forward in next 2 years' time.

See, in the immediate -- I mean, this current financial year, we estimate that the cost-to-income ratio will be in the range of around 53% to 55%. Going forward next financial year, it will come down below 50%.

See. And sir, my final question is on NCLT resolution, your outlook on the same?

NCLT resolution, we are also receiving end only. If it happens it's okay. If it is not happening also, we have given you the guidance that we will be bringing down the gross NPA, the way we are planning.

So sir, as you said, it would be around 5.5%. So will there be any write-off -- significant write-offs.

That is also one of the options that is there.

[Operator Instructions] Our next question comes from the line of Ashok Ajmera from Ajcon Global Services Limited.

Sir, I have some small micro questions. We talked about PSLC sale and we are getting a very handsome amount on that. So is it our going to be the normal feature, like such a big amount can we consider continuously for the next year?

No, no. now definition of priority sector is being enhanced. So going forward, we don't expect much income from sale of PSLC.

So will any other income will replace this or there will be a fall?

Yes, yes, there will be a basket of streams are there that we will explore because now a days new stream, what we are exploring almost it is coming to is providing some services to the cooperative banks through our treasury.

Okay. All right, sir. Now sir, this -- now PLI, your performance based, now it is becoming now earlier, it used to be very small last time. But now because of the accrual basis adoption, it has gone to INR 14 crores, I think. And the way the bank is performing, how much do you approximately project this PLI for the 23, '24?

Wages that will increase only to the extent of 10% to 11%. If I provided INR 104 crores this year, I may do it INR 115 crores next year.

Okay. And sir, some couple of small questions on like prudential framework resolution and stress assets, total outstanding of INR 1,602 crores additional provision you have done up of INR 251 crores, total provision now is INR 1,117 crores. So about INR 600 crores, INR 500 crores of gap is still there between outstanding and this. Do you think there is any need for this remaining amount to be provided or we get -- we expect to get much more higher than the provision, I mean, the gap which we have.

We expect reversal there, actually. But there is one avenue of parking the amounts we are parking.

Sir, similarly, on the implementation resolution plan of 10 accounts, they are also I think between export and outstanding about INR 450 crores, this outstanding is now INR 434.9 crore, so there how much are we provided for?

This is you are talking about RBI List 1.

Yes. Yes. That is 100%, I believe, isn't it?

Yes, it is 100%. The remaining amount is only our...

1 and 2 are 100%, yes.

Yes. So it is 100%.

All right, sir. So one last thing on -- again, I'm sorry for repetition. Sir, this, our bank has -- it's a Pan-India bank and a bank which is -- I mean, which is a household name, Central Bank of India. But looking at our base -- overall business base, it is comparatively still smaller than many of the peer public sector banks. So there's a loud thinking that why can't we also think beyond the boundaries of just this 14%, 15% or can we not do something like Bank of Maharashtra, which has gone to 29% and now also they're projecting about 22.5%, 23%. And because of that, all the other numbers have become very, very attractive. I'm not exactly comparing the bank to bank. But is there any thought that we can go a little beyond this normal range?

Let me tell you, [Foreign Language] whatever the perception we have comparison must be comparable ones. But having said this, let me tell you my customer base is INR 8.1 crores, active customer basis INR 5.89 crores. And to leverage my customer base for the higher business, what I require at this moment is the transformation on the technology front. Because of the legacy issues, we could not embark on the transformational journey. But for the past 1.5 years, a lot of work we are doing and probably that's what I am sharing with you, from third quarter onwards, our technology initiatives will start yielding the results. Once I am strong on the technology, then I will go and connect with my whole customers and bring back the business as what we lost earlier. So we are not focusing on the end numbers. We are only focusing more on the efforts what we are going to do with the leveraged technology, what we have already started. So this is a nutshell what I'm saying as a cut. But...

No, definitely, sir, you have done under sir, in the last 2 years, you've really done -- all of you -- all the fronts. And even on the technology when you are creating a bank within the bank and the kind of infrastructure which you are building, definitely will bring great results, and we have full faith in the bank. I'm just saying that, yes, we can leverage on this entire big customer base [indiscernible].

[Operator Instructions]

I think we have come to an end.

Yes. So management members, there are no further questions. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing remarks.

Yes. As far as the closing remarks all the road map, what we have given, the way we have delivered our commitments for the previous year, this year also, whatever the guidance we have given, we'll continue to deliver. And going forward, definitely, you will see this bank as a force in the industry. Thank you.

Thank you. On behalf of Antique Stock Broking Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.