ENGAGE XR Holdings plc (EXR) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the VR Education Holdings Plc Investor Presentation. [Operator Instructions] The company may not be in a position to answer every question you received during the meeting itself. However, the company will review all questions submitted today and publish responses where it's appropriate to do so. This will be available via Investor Meet Company dashboard. I'd also like to remind you that this presentation is being recorded. Before we begin, we'd like to submit the following poll. I would now like to hand you over to Dave Whelan, CEO; and Seamus Larrissey, CFO of VR Education Holdings Plc.

Good afternoon. Good afternoon, everybody. Welcome to today's get-to-know company presentation. My name is David, and I am joined here by our CFO, Seamus. So we're going to go through this short presentation today. It's going to outline some of the origins of the company and we'll also be talking about some of the more recent news. I expect some of you have seen the RNS today that we've released ENGAGE in the Chinese market, which is a very, very big deal for the company. So just a bit of an overview of the company. We are an Irish-based company. Hence, you can hear the really strong Irish accent coming from myself. We're not a very old company at all. We're going about 5 years. We've been on AIM 2.5 years. We've a staff currently at 51 and we are expanding. Very recently at the end of last year, we had 30 staff. And there's 2 main elements to the business. So on one side, we have our Showcase Experiences. These are entertainment-type games, where these are showcase products. And some of our more famous products would be the Apollo 11 experience and Titanic VR and Shuttle Commander, which actually we just released recently on the Oculus Quest. These are experiences which are one-off purchases where users would purchase a piece of content for $10 or $20 and they get to keep it for good. But really, the larger, much larger part of the company is the ENGAGE platform. And what ENGAGE is, it's a communications platform, but its origins were really in education and corporate training where it was a virtual reality classroom. So when you put on a VR headset and hand controllers, there's a virtual version of you inside a virtual classroom. And you can do everything you can do in the virtual classroom, you can do in a real classroom. So you can stand up and give a PowerPoint presentation. You can draw on our virtual whiteboards and you can shake hands with people from across the world. And you can have up to 70 people -- 70 virtual people in the room with you at the same time. And what was quite unique about the platform is that it is also a content creation tool. So when you're inside ENGAGE, it can record everything that you do and say. It can also record all your avatar's movement and any objects that you [ build ] in the environment. So very, very quickly, you could build up a suite of content for your users. However, with COVID 19, we've actually seen a huge demand in our services because many institutions and many corporations are now allowing all the workers to work from home and they're needing better communication tools, and they're really coming up against this with video-based communications where the conversation that we're having now is very typical of what would happen in these big corporations, where if you have maybe 20 or 30 people and they're on a video-based call like Microsoft Teams or Zoom, very hard to do any collaboration work where the person who's presenting has full control of what's happening on screen. You can't interact with anybody else in the room. Whereas within the ENGAGE platform, if -- because we have spatial audio, if you want to lean over to the person next to you and whisper in their ear without disturbing anybody else, you can do that. The same as you would in a real meeting room. If somebody is down presenting on the screen and say, an exhibit location, you can stand up, walk with different exhibits and have a chat with sales personnel or getting a lot of events traction. So that was a brief outline of the company. So the ENGAGE platform, again, it's virtual reality and training development and education. However, we're seeing very, very big demand now for team collaboration and also conferences and events. So we're just going to play this short trailer. So if you roll that, guys. [Presentation]

Okay. So I'm going to pass over to Seamus, our CFO.

So just a quick way of how we commercialize ENGAGE and how we get tethered into the marketplace. We've tread the main routes into the markets. We have direct sales, which are sales that come through either our company website or through our business developers, who are based in America and in Europe. We have our resellers, of which HTC are one within the Greater Chinese region they have exclusivity. And we also have a number of other resellers across Europe, America and other areas of Asia. And then finally, we have content and distribution providers who we've partnered with who will create high-quality content and will sell it through the platform, where we would enter into a revenue share agreement. So how that translates into revenue is that we have customers who come and take software licenses to use the ENGAGE platform. We have recently since COVID-19 had a lot of interest in event-specific licenses, where large corporations have come to us to run virtual events and we have offered tailored services to support them through this. And then we have the revenue share agreements with content and distribution providers and also end users who want to come and commercialize on the ENGAGE platform, where we'll enter into a revenue share agreement with them. Dave, you just flicked on there. You can see on the next slide, you can see that we have -- since our commercial launch of ENGAGE at the back end of 2018, we've signed up some high-profile clients to work and use the platform. On the training and development side, Facebook have taken licenses to use the platform, also SNCF, who operates the French rail network, are using it for training and development and for team collaboration. HTC, which is obviously very well known, and the relationship with us is very well known, have used it for event hosting, which Dave will come to it later and also use it for team collaboration. Within the education and learning space, some major players within that space are using it. We've been working with Oxford University for a number of years. And also in the last 9 to 12 months, we've started working with Stanford University, the University of Arizona and also Colorado State University, some major players in the American market. On the conference and event hosting, which has been something that has presented itself this year, which we haven't originally envisaged ENGAGE for, we are soon to host a major event for the United Nations, which is coming up, this event. We've successfully hosted events with Ericsson, Vodafone, European Commission, Yahoo! and HTC over the last few months, and is testament to the quality of the ENGAGE platform, the nature of the clients that are coming to use it for events and to use it for the original purpose of training and development and team collaboration. Now I'll just hand back to Dave, who's going to run through some of the more detailed features of the platform.

Thanks, Seamus. So within the ENGAGE platform, I did state on the first slide that you can have up to 70 people in the same room at the same time from all over the world. And each person is represented by an avatar, which is a digital person. That person looks exactly like the real-life person because you can take a selfie of your face, a photograph of your face, upload it to ENGAGE, and then our AI system will actually build the avatar based on that image and it will look very much like you when you're inside the platform. Inside ENGAGE, we have virtual screens. These are Chromium-based. So anything that will run on the Chrome browser will run inside the ENGAGE platform. So you can connect it to your OneDrive, Google Docs and SharePoint, any of these cloud-based platforms with the documents that they have in their repositories, they can be shared on our virtual screens. You can also screencast your screen, just as I'm doing now for this presentation. So any application that you might be running on your PC can run inside ENGAGE as well on the virtual screens and they can be shared. You can build and share content. So not only is ENGAGE a communications tool, it's also a very, very powerful content tool, where if you're giving a class or a presentation or running an event, you can record everything you do and say inside the platform. You can also record all the members who are actually logged into the session at the same time, and we play that over again as a spatial recording and we call that system Projected Presence. And it's not like watching a recording of a video, where it's just a standard, you're looking straight up and you never change the angle. You can actually walk in a spatial recording. So you can get up out of your seat, walk around, go to a different seat. If somebody was whispering up the back, you can actually get up during a recording, sit down next to that person. You can hear what they are saying. And the file format that we use is quite unique to the ENGAGE platform. So if we were recording this presentation, and I assume we are recording this presentation on video, if this was an hour-long piece of content, you're looking at about 1 to 2 gigabytes of data to have any type of quality video stream. Inside ENGAGE, an hour-long piece of content is less than 100 megabytes because we're not transmitting video. What we're transmitting is positional data of 3D objects in a virtual space because all the graphics are rendered on the platform itself. And all we're recording is MP3 data of device communications. So it's a very, very small format. So even people have very low bandwidth Internet connections in some of the developing countries and in some places in China as well would have these limitations. ENGAGE is very, very suited. So what we say to people, if you can run an audio straight call, you can actually run ENGAGE very, very nicely on your headset on your Internet connection. We also have over 1,200 3D objects. So the great thing about ENGAGE is you don't need any prior programming skills. You don't need any animation skills. It's literally drag and drop. So you have a virtual iPad when you're inside. If you want to select an object like an aircraft engine, you can drop that in the environments. And you also have a selection of locations within the platform. There's a web app associated with ENGAGE as well. So you can log in, it's very similar to GoToMeeting. You can schedule any meeting that you want or events in our web app. You can also link files in our web app as well. So when you get into VR, you're not looking around for a keyboard, everything is there in a very useful and easy manner. And we also have our Projected Presence system. So I did say that 70 people can be in a room at any one time, but some of the events that we're hosting would have many thousands of people. And the way we run those events is you have a small set location, and you might have 70 avatars in the room with you, but the presenters themselves, the virtual avatars of the presenters, they're duplicated and cloned into multiple rooms at the same time. So in reality, somebody who's giving a presentation to a room of 70 people, they can be cloned a million times, and they can be presenting to 70 million people at the same time, just theoretically no limit to the amount of people that can actually attend these events. So we did allude to HTC earlier. So back in March, so the first 3 months of this year were very topsy-turvy for many, many companies. People didn't really know what was going on with COVID coming. Is this going to be a 2- to 4-week thing? Or is it going to be longer? What are we going to do with our staff? And it really hit China hard just before Christmas of last year. Now HTC, each year, they would have a developer conference called the VIVE Ecosystem Conference, where they would invite a couple of thousand developers to a physical location, show them all the new technology that HTC are working on, talk about what's going on the road map and they try to get developers really enthusiastic about using HTC products. Now that conference this year was supposed to be held in China. And obviously, that was canceled, and HTC came to us in February and said, look, our conference has been canceled. Can you guys help? And it's supposed to be -- is going to be held in March. So in a 4-week turnaround, we transformed ENGAGE to run events. We put in custom locations, and you actually see one of the locations there just on the video being played. It was a very, very successful event. So we had over 1,000 people logged in virtual reality and concurrently, and we have 1.1 million people watching the live stream. And we had speakers from China Telecom, we had speakers from Qualcomm, we had speakers from NVIDIA. They're all really, really impressed with the platform. And HTC were so impressed, and straight after the conference, they said, "Look, we want to invest in the company. You have a really good platform. It's a very, very mature platform, and how do we get involved?" And we started the discussions in earnest, and it was a really, really good event, and we were delighted to host HTC. Following on from that event, we've actually had other events. So each time we hold events, it always seems to spur more and more people coming to us. And again, with a lot of these conferences in America and in Europe, they were all supposed to be held in the summer period. But they were all obviously canceled. And then a lot of these event organizers have been scrambling, looking for platforms to hold events. A lot of events have gone on video-based platforms like Zoom and Teams. And again, they call it a virtual event. But in reality, it's not a great user experience. And the user experience that people get at these events is exactly the same experience you're getting now, where you're just sitting and listening to a presentation. That's pretty much it. And you might be able to add a few questions on a form and might get asked. That's pretty much what people call virtual events today and it's not a great user experience. The reason people go to events, physical events, is for networking and for those hallway conversations where you could go talk to a sales rep or you might meet somebody in the hallway, you strike up a conversation. And that's where business is done. It's not just watching the keynote talks and that's really what's lacking. I remember when we went to the Bett conference a couple of years ago, very big conference in London, full of educators and educational companies. But really, a lot of the business that we've done was actually just talking to people. Inside ENGAGE, we can offer that service. And the way we offer it is with spatial audios. We have exhibition halls, virtual exhibition halls, where people can go, walk around the area, talk to the sales reps, have those hallway conversations and that's just something that video-based platforms can't provide. And this is one of the core reasons why we're so busy at the moment. And a lot of the events that were supposed to be held in the summer months are now only coming in the final month of this year because obviously, there's some preparation months. Holding a virtual event, we say to people, is like holding a real event. If you need a location, the location needs to be built, it needs to be designed. If you want people in there and monitoring like that's an actual real person, running people around. So it's not like just producing video. There is a lot involved. But we can also charge a lot of money for these events as well. And we are incrementally increasing how much we charge for these events as we do more and more of them because we're actually seeing more and more demand and we're trying to see exactly what the market would bear. So another use case is -- just going back to the education and training aspects of ENGAGE. The United States Air Force is using ENGAGE at the moment for remote distance learning. So in education, especially in America and not so much in the United Kingdom, education is becoming the pursuit of the rich and wealthy. If you want to send your kids to a university in America, a good university for 4 years, you're looking at about a $250,000 student debt at the end of that education. Really, that's pricing out middle-income and lower income families. So what happens quite often is that a lot of parents or a lot of students, they will join the military, the U.S. military to get a good education. But what happens there is you have people dotted all over the country, all these cadets that will never get to see each other and they have been using video-based platforms for many, many years. But again, they really do see the struggles where when you have 30 or 40 students, all are trying to collaborate on a platform, half the students will turn off the camera. The other half will turn off their microphone. They'll all be on their phone. They're not engaged. They're not getting good results. Whereas a platform like ENGAGE offers that real classroom experience where people do make peer-structured groups, peer support-structured groups. They feel like they're in a real class collaborating. And even the educators themselves, they can get all that non-verbal communication because their movements are being tracked in the headsets. Not only that. Actually, ENGAGE this year, and I'll talk about it in a little bit, we are now available on mobile phones and tablets. So you're not limited just by having the headset on you, you can actually now trade out on a mobile phone and tablet. Then Seamus did mention them earlier, we are working with Oxford University and Stanford University. We're actually [indiscernible] that video. And they are using it for medical training. So one of their -- probably biggest revenue generators of any university will be the medical training program. However, they are finding it very difficult to justify a lot of these costs over video-based platforms and text-based assessments. However, when you're using virtual reality, giving them full simulations and they're also feeling like they're in a real classroom, again, really justifies some of those costs. The example shown on the video here is Oxford University, where you have to resuscitate a baby with very limited equipment. And if you don't save the baby within 4 minutes, the baby will die. Quite often, when the office used to be open, any visitors that used to come, come into the office, I would put them in this simulation because it really stresses them out. But that's exactly what you're trying to get from this type of simulation. It's supposed to give you a real-world experience. And so we are a cross platform. So we work on the majority of VR headsets, even though HTC now, our 20% stakeholder in the company, will always be platform-agnostic. So -- and we work on all the Windows Mixed Reality headsets. We're working on all the headsets from Steam and HTC. And we work on the Facebook headsets as well. And there's a lot of Chinese headsets coming out. Just recently, last week, Facebook announced their new headset, the Quest 2, It's GBP 299. I don't know why they don't say GBP 300. Really, really good device, very strong device. It's going to be one of the bestsellers for Christmas. And they've sold so many of those devices. So far, we're actually seeing a big uptake in our showcase experiences on that device. And really, we feel we're on the kind of the cliff edge of wider adoption of VR. And there's a few different reasons why we feel that way and we'll talk about that later on. And again, this is ENGAGE. We do also run on standard desktop displays and we also run on mobile phones. This is the mobile phone version. You can see here on the right. Still a pretty good experience. People, kids who maybe have played Fortnite on their phone, they would be -- they pick up the mobile phone version often very, very easily and be able to move around. And the mobile phone version is, by far, one of the most popular versions for downloads, especially for events because not everybody has VR headsets. We'll also be out on Apple iOS and iPhones before the end of the year. So I now want to pass back over to Seamus now.

Thanks, Dave. So just for any of you who didn't hear our interim results presentation, I just want to bring through some quick operational highlights from the first half of the year and then some quick financial highlights from the same period. So as Dave already mentioned, we held a hugely successful HTC by the Ecosystem Conference in March 2020, which followed on to a EUR 3 million investment from HTC, and the strategic partnership where we entered into a distribution agreement with them, where they have exclusive rights to resell ENGAGE within the Greater China region and also nonexclusive rights to resell across the world. As part to that deal we entered into, there's a revenue share agreement whereby we take percentage of each euro or a dollar that HTC brings to the table. That percentage wasn't made public as part of the deal, so we can't disclose that today. Over the first 6 months of the year and continuing into the current period, there's been significant increase in demand for ENGAGE as a communications tool and for event hosting. Separately, we entered into partnership agreements with content providers, which I had mentioned on in an earlier slide. We entered into one with U.S.-based VictoryXR, who are a world leader in VR and augmented reality content creation for schools and education. What they do is they offer biology. Some of the things they offer is like a biology lesson, whereby you get to dissect an animal as part of the class, which is obviously a far more humane and easier for a school to obtain rather than having live animals. And we also entered into an MOU agreement with U.K.-based virtual college who are an industry-leading digital learning solutions provider. And we're hoping to provide better technology, enhanced learning solutions to them in the U.K. and also in the Middle East where they have a strong presence. If you just jump on to the next slide there, Dave? Thanks. Financially, we've seen some -- we've seen significant increase in revenue in the first half of the year. Our revenue grew to EUR 681,000, which is up 37% on the prior year. More importantly for the group, ENGAGE revenue accelerated throughout the period. And currently, at the end of H1, comprised 33% of total group revenue. And post period end, that has gone beyond the 50% market and in some instances has actually exceeded all other revenue streams. In line with management expectations, our EBITDA result was unchanged at a loss of EUR 0.9 million. As mentioned already, we entered into the commercial agreement with HTC and had a successful fund raise of EUR 3 million, which significantly underpinned the external confidence in the group. Our net cash position at the 30th of June was EUR 3.2 million and when the interment results were announced, was EUR BP 2.9 million. ENGAGE revenue post period end up to the end of September, comprised 68% of total revenue for that period. I'll just hand back to Dave now who's going to run through the market opportunity.

Yes. So COVID-19 has really has been a game changer. I know we've been on AIM a couple of years, but we're starting only now to get some traction and become interesting, I think, in many investors' eyes. And it has been because of COVID-19. So if you look at Zoom, anybody who's going to be using Zoom is already on Zoom today. They've had 5 years of user number growth in the space of 5 weeks when COVID locked down most of the world, and I think they're going to have a difficult time in the coming years to really grow the user base there because everybody who's going to use a video-based platform is already doing so. A lot of the people coming to us are large institutions, and we see events as a gateway. So what typically happens with us is that a company will come to us and say, "We were supposed to hold this event physically, can you guys help us out?" And we will work with that company, and we'll charge them a fee for doing the events. But then as they're using the ENGAGE platform for the events, and what we're doing is we're actually upselling them. Then I'm going, okay, you're using this for an event. But actually, it's a very, very useful tool for a -- a communications tool between your employees and your company. And what happens then typically is, after an event, they'll sign off maybe a couple of their departments to start using the ENGAGE platform. It could be a couple of hundreds end user accounts. And they use the platform for typically, maybe a couple of month, and then we're trying to sign them up into bigger agreements. That's kind of how our sales cycle is. That's the direct sales cycle. With HTC coming on board and with the agreement that we have in place, literally, this morning, we announced that ENGAGE is now available in the Greater China region. This is a major, major milestone for the company, especially a small company in Ireland. For any company to sell into the Chinese market, you have to deal with a registered Chinese company or companies who are already embedded in that market. And although HTC are a Taiwanese company, they have a lot of close ties with the Chinese government and the Chinese market over many, many years of producing handsets in China and Taiwan. And because they are a telecom company well, they work very closely with government agencies like China Telecom, as an example. So we expect big things to come over coming months now that we're available. And I think the great thing about ENGAGE as well is it's a communication bridge between China and the rest of the world. So when we have the HTC event, as an example, the -- half the users were actually based in China and the rest were dotted at all over the world. We actually got past the great Chinese firewall. And we connect people together naturally without using a VPN, and that's something that is quite unusual and it's something that my technicians are constantly looking at. But I think we're in a very, very strong position, and we're in a very happy medium place being in Ireland because a lot of companies in China -- well, all companies in China, they can't use American-made communications software, such as BlueJeans from Facebook or Microsoft Teams and vice versa, because there's a lot of companies in America that just won't use Zoom communications because they might have security concerns, whereas we're here sitting in Europe, and we are GDPR compliance. There's no hang ups about using our platform. And we are going for a full official security ISO certification at the moment as well, which will be a really nice tick box and approach for our marketing and our sales team going forward. If we go to the next page. So another thing that's really pushing us forward besides COVID-19 is 5G. So the telecommunications companies we're dealing with, we've had conversations at length with these telecommunications companies is they're really struggling to upsell customers onto 5G accounts. By and large, enterprise, and even and general public, are very, very happy with their 4G subscriptions. They can stream videos onto their phones. They can check their email. There's no real need to have a 5G gigabit connection on your phone. It doesn't make a huge amount of difference. However, it makes a massive difference if you have a VR/AR headset where you can render the graphics, these very AAA quality graphics on a server at a remote location and then serve them onto the headset directly instead of processing on the headset itself. What that enables headset manufacturers today is make the headset smaller and lighter. It will make the batteries last longer as well, and it will give people better, more realistic simulations. And even if you look at video-based 360 video or virtual reality video companies like MelodyVR, as an example, they stream 360 video, which is very, very high bandwidth. So even a 3-minute video could be 4 or 5 gigabytes. And having that streamed over 4G is just not feasible. You need a really good WiFi connection. However, the telecoms companies really see the benefit of pushing VR and AR headsets. And Deutsche Telekom are coming out with their own branded headset very, very soon. Besides that, you will be walking into telephone shops in the very, very near future. And when you sign up for a 5G account, they'll give you the very nice brand-new phone, but they'll also give you a very nice shiny VR/AR headset to consume lots more data. And thus we -- where we're going to see the massive ramp-up in VR. Mark Zuckerberg has also said his plan is to have 1 billion people in VR over the next 3 years. And even if you hit half that target, this is going to be a very, very lucrative business for everybody involved. Now this graph, actually, this page is quite old. So before COVID-19, this is a graph from last year. You can see there was a massive uptake in software sales, and this was the release of stand-alone VR devices. So I've mentioned the Oculus Quest a couple of times. HTC, their own version, Vive Focus, and then there's a Chinese company called Pico. These are stand-alone VR devices where you no longer need a desktop PC. So when we released ENGAGE back in December 2018, you would have needed a PC, a powerful PC, and you would have needed a VR headset that was tethered to a computer to have a good experience. That's a really hard sell for anybody for any business. It's very cumbersome to get in and out of, even if the experience is good. When stand-alone devices came out, you don't need a PC, very easy setup, very inexpensive as well. You just literally take it out the bag or take it off your desk and put it on your head and you're ready to go. A lot of people then start jumping on board on VR. We were getting more and more queries coming in at the tail end of last year. And the trend in that graph is actually -- it's even expanded now with the Quest 2 coming out, very, very good device. They're going to be like oldest and coming up to Christmas, but we expect to see millions of those devices in people's hands over the next 1 to 1.5 years. So yes, now we're at the appendices. I'm actually happy to take any questions. I don't know what the format would be.

That's fantastic. David, and Seamus, thank you very much indeed for that. [Operator Instructions] I'd like to remind you the recording of this presentation, along with a copy of the slides and the published q&A can be accessed via investor dashboard on the Investor Meet Company platform. And lastly, before I hand you back to David and Seamus, I would like to remind you feedback is important to the company. Immediately after the presentation has ended, you'll be redirected for the opportunity to provide feedback so the company can better understand your views and expectations. And David, and Seamus, you've had a couple of presubmitted questions. Perhaps we could just start off with those, if that's okay.

Yes. Fine.

And I guess, this kind of ties into your update and announcement out this morning. The first question we've had is, in a recent trading update, you stated the ENGAGE platform will be launched in China. Please can you provide further update, including when this is happening -- actually, today's announcement, the target audience, competitive landscape and how this may impact revenue.

Yes. So we launched in China as 1:00 a.m. last night, and it was very successful. HTC ran an event, a global event yesterday. So you'll actually see some news about it on our Twitter feed, and obviously the RNS went out today. Our competitors are Zoom and Microsoft teams, this is what we're going after. Before COVID hit, I would have said, okay, look, we're educational focused and training focused. No longer. We're a communications platform, first and foremost. And we want to be the next-generation communications platform. People -- I think many, many people, including myself, I do very much get video fatigue going after call after call after call. And I think that there's certainly something in going to a physical location and meeting somebody. I don't think we're going to be doing that any time soon, as I think the next best thing would be the ENGAGE platform with people with headsets and getting that interaction. So hopefully, that's answered that question. There's another part of that question as well, I think.

Yes, there's another question we've got. We understand there has been a surge in demand for the ENGAGE platform. Are you able to be more specific and provide any figures, particularly the number of companies signed up on the enterprise option?

So just in relation to that, we can only discuss what's already out in the public domain. What we can say is there's been a huge spike in the increase in the number of inbound requests and the number of signed up enterprise users. And as Dave and myself mentioned earlier, we've gone from our key users of the -- on the platform, so the likes of the Facebooks and the American Air Force, Stanford university, people like that. So we've signed up some really high-quality users. We haven't put that out in the public domain as yet in terms of the number of enterprise clients we have or in terms of the total value of those other than what's in the interim results to the end of June.

That's great. Thank you very much, indeed. I know, firstly, we haven't had a huge amount of time to look at the questions that have just been submitted as we've gone through the live presentation. But perhaps I could ask you just to start at the top and read out those questions you can from investors. And just to remind investors, all those questions submitted today will be reviewed by the company and answers delivered on the Investor Meet Company platform.

What I can do while Seamus -- while you are reading through those questions just give you some time is maybe I can give you kind of an overview of my vision of what's going to happen with the platform in the future from an educational sense and some of the interesting things that we're going to be integrating into the platform. So within education, and again, it is going back to the education routes a smaller bit. We were looking at it in a way that, okay, we want to open up access to great institutions globally. And with students today with the younger generation, everything is on demand with the younger generation. So when they're watching TV, they don't watch TV, what they do is they watch TikTok or YouTube or Netflix. Straight away, the film is there instantly for them. Even when the younger generation orders something online, it needs to be with them within 24 hours like Amazon, as an example. They're a very, very impatient bunch. And I think education is going to go the same way and training where currently, today, when you go to a school or you go to college, you normally go to school or college in a location close to you. And the educators that you have access to are the ones that are actually in that school. You don't have access to anybody else. Myself, and my own background, I'm dyslexic. I never went to university or college, and it's not because I'm stupid, far from it, but when I was going to school, I responded better to some educators than others, and it was not I had bad educators. It was just that some of the educators were more visual features. Now I think education is going to go on demand as well, where we'll have specialist universities doing specialist subjects. And I think very soon in the future, what will happen is that you will have students who will tailor their education, their needs. They will do virtual physics in MIT in the morning and virtual English literature in virtual Oxford University in the afternoon. They'd pick and choose their educators based on their needs. And I think a platform like ENGAGE can really free up educators as well instead of as the teacher saying the same thing over and over again in a class and presenting the same thing over and over again, they can pre-record it using our recording system, our Projected Presence recording system and ENGAGE and tell the students, okay, do lessons 1, 2 and 3. And if you give them more time, more free time to do one-on-one with their students that might be struggling or the students that want to excel a bit more. So it opens up a lot of opportunities and then integrating AI into the system in the future as well is certainly a plan with us, where if you're watching a recorded presentation from one of the world's best lecturers, you can ask that recording a question and using voice recognition and AI. If the question -- the answer is in the database, that avatar can then give back the answer to the student directly. That's something that we will be actively looking at in the future. But all of these features that we've been developing in the background and working on over the past 4 or 5 years, these are all these acne fuels that a lot of the industries, a lot of the partners that are coming to us now, a lot of the bigger institutions and businesses, they're all looking for these same features where they want to train up their staff or they want to do kind of HR elements. And our platform lends out very, very nicely to that. And the event stuff has us really coming out of the blue when just we were as surprised as anybody, the demand that we've had for it. So it's been a very, very productive past 6 months, especially.

Thanks, Dave. So just reading down through the questions. There's a little bit of overlap on some of them. So I suppose the first one, Dave, that's come up is one for you. Who are our main competitors? And how do we differentiate from those competitors?

It depends on which industry you're looking at. So like Zoom, it will be our main competitor on events. Zoom, Microsoft Teams, and for collaboration -- into our team collaboration in companies as well. They would be our main competitors, currently. Then on the education side of things, MOOC platforms such as Coursera and EdX. And they have a great repository of content. ENGAGE as a content tool is perfectly suited to cater to that exact same market. And once we have more and more educators and get to a critical mass on the platform, I believe that, that side of the business will grow. So it depends on which area. The thing about ENGAGE, and it can be difficult, but it's also rewarding is that is such an open platform that can do so many different things what you focus on. And as a company, we focus on where we're going to make money. Currently, where we're making money is events and then conferences in virtual locations. That's where the money is right now, and that's what we're chasing after.