Equity Group Holdings Plc (EQTY) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, everyone. Good morning. Good to see you all here, and we want to thank God for today. I want to kick off our full year 2024 financial results announcement. But allow me to kindly invite [indiscernible] to kick us off with [indiscernible] prayer.

Thank you very much. Good morning. God is good and all the time, shall we pray? Oh, our heavenly father in the name of Jesus, we want to thank you so much for the gift of life and health. Thank you for this day that you have made that we may come Lord and receive our results for the year 2024. We want to thank you, Lord, for the successes. We thank you, Lord, for every opportunity you gave us, thank you, even for what we missed. And as we come Lord, we want to play for your blessings, we play for your recovery. We want to commit this meeting before your holy presence. We thank you for all of us who are here and even those that are following us. Lord shall join us together in 1 spirit. We pray for renewed strength. Lord, at the end of it all, may your name be glorified. Start with us, go with us to the very end for this, we pray to Christ, our Lord.

Let us appreciate [indiscernible]. Thank you. I want to kindly request as before, we invite our Group CEO and MD, Dr. James Mwangi to take us through the results to be up standing for the Equity Anthem. [Presentation]

Thank you very much, Alex. And a very warm welcome for the state, shareholders and investors attending this morning's investors briefing for the year that December 1, 2024. As you might be aware, we have taken a little bit of time to come to the investors and shareholders with this briefing because we really needed to seek to understand the results so that we could help shareholders, investors, analysts and media and understand the context and the results we're about to present. We know our investors have taken a long-term view. They're investing in an asset. So it's not about numbers. It's understanding their investment. That's the most important thing. So today, I have been very selective. I will speak to a few slides that will help investors appreciate the investment, understand the investment, where we are and the context within which the results are coming out, but you cannot understand your position without your understanding where you are coming from. So we have put this into perspective. And then we will add by looking where are we going. So that is the past, the present and the future, and we look to contextualize so that investors can have a better grip, better understanding. We all know investors don't invest in the past thing, they invest into the future. That's what investments are all about. It is the cash grow, is returned, is the growth of the investment. So [indiscernible] joined me as we go. That is our history. As you can see, a very smooth recovery from 2005, very gentle, but come 2020, we start seeing significant lack of smoothness as well as. It is not really as smooth as it was for, that is, customer deposits. So we need to look and pay a little bit of attention from 2023, 2024, a huge stagnation. It's not a stagnation, maybe not from a customer's point of view. That might the issue of the reporting currency. You'll see Kenya shilling strengthened from 160 to 130, and that significantly, it is reflected or impact the reporting number. So we'll guide you what the actual number would be in constant currency. If you look at the next slide on loans, again, look at the same what one would want, what is happening in the last 2 years, 2023, 2024. We've seen -- and again, we have just said and we will see later that we have a mix of currencies, a basket of currencies. And if the reporting currency, strengthen and viewed, that will be seen today is decline in loan book, but it's not a decline in loan book. It's because of change in currencies, vis-a-vis the currencies of the subsidiaries. The reporting currency is Kenya shilling, but more than 50% of the loan book is not in Kenya shilling. So when the Kenya shilling appreciate with that level from 160 than you see. And if you look, that is the loan portfolio. If you go to the next slide, you look at total assets, you see the same, so that is reporting needs to be some mathematical currency impact that we thought we could be able to explain. And the next slide, Alex, as you can see, profitability is from 2021 seems to be stagnating. If we go to the next slide, if you look at shareholders' part, there we seem to be in control. The curve is still as smooth as it has always been because that's something within our control, [indiscernible]. So for the first time, we see Equity, which has maintained a tenfold growth from 1991 all the way to 2016 or thereabout starts not to have uniform, you see total funding remains almost constant. Loan book remains constant, total assets reflect decline, and that is what we thought we could be able -- profitability is constant. But again, we ask ourselves what does this reflect? And we see also in our ability to focus the impact on focusing. If we go to the next side, you see this is the cause of what we were seeing. Kenya, the host of our head office has been going through very significant shocks since 2016. But look at the shocks we are dealing with in 2025 and 2020 -- sorry, 2024 and 2023. We are dealing with the interest cutting shock from 2016, it initially parliamentary legal capping, then it became an administrative capping, and it was resolved with a compressed risk-based pricing that the market is not able to understand, it's too complex for the market and I'm sure the -- of course, COVID, the health pandemic at the end of 2022, but its impact is still with us, the disruption, the breakdown. So you could see, if you add that, so they're not the Russia-Ukraine conflict and its impact on energy and food inflation. The Israel-Gaza-Palestine conflict, the global economic shocks, a mix of all those, the interest rate inflation, currency volatility or exchanges, the escalated geopolitics that has manifested itself now into trade wars. We started to stabilize technology. I'm sure you know the war of technology, who controls technology. Now it has gone beyond technology to trade, call it trade tariffs or whichever name you call. These are the shocks and we have not had a perfect storm where you have simultaneously about 6 shocks putting at the same time. That is what is causing that it's affecting the bank, and it's not able to smoothen its performance because if it's 1 shock, like we have seen, it doesn't mean before 2016, there were no shocks. 2007, 2008, we had local shocks of the conflict, post-election conflict, we had the global financial crisis, but you are dealing with 1 or 2 shocks. The bank has the capability to manage those shocks. But the volatility in the marketplace, with these kind of shocks then makes it significantly difficult to predict. And most of these shocks then work counter to each other. So you're in a very volatile environment. It's what you could -- a pilot who would say "I am flying through this jet." Exactly. It's headwinds. It's really turbulence and some economists would say we are navigating the eye of a storm. This is when you then see -- and the question here is then differentiated capability in decision-making. But it's very difficult for anybody now to manage the external environment. So what do you do as management? You [indiscernible] you have control of the internal environment. If external environment is difficult, the pilot will always say put on, not only the outer equipment, but how to combine that with the human capability to navigate the eye of the storm and that's how you find the pilot tells you, yes, back your belts, we are going through turbulence. So the movement the world is going through a very difficult turbulence and we have seen what is causing the turbulence. So that issue is the impact we have seen in our performance is because of this turbulence, but turbulence don't last. However, we have recognized. We thought this turbulence we had but shock is building up the shock. So what have we come to conclude is that the [ local ] environment is becoming a permanent state, and we must know how to manage business in a volatile environment, in a very, very volatile environment. And essentially, the environment is -- a pilot cannot change the weather on the route they are changing -- they are passing through, but they can ensure their plane has the capacity and the resilience and if we have had a word repeated resilience, the African Recovery and Resilience Plan, it's all about how do we work in [indiscernible] to ensure Equity Group, your investment is resilient enough to be able to perform in a turbulent environment. And that leads us with the results of the last 10 years of significant turbulence, we decided that here, we can't remove the threats but we can remove the weaknesses within the organization that [indiscernible] exploit and make it difficult for organizations. So what we have been doing is thinking inwardly of removing weaknesses, strengthening our strength or building heavily on our strength so that whatever green shoots are in the challenging environment, we can see them, we can be able to expand and exploit them. So broadly, that is where we are. So if we move to the next slide, 2 slides more, Alex. Yes, so broadly, what we have said is, why don't we transform equity group. We may not transform the environment but we can transform equity to make it very resilient to evaluate in a turbulent environment. And broadly, the first thing is to look at your strategy and the strategy of Equity has focus on building resilience. And that is why it's the African Recovery and Resilience Plan. The second aspect other than resilience is whatever impact turbulence has had, can we ensure the organization fully recovers. And then we have said let's not focus on Kenya, let's look at Africa, and that's what pilots do. Pilots change routes. When the route, the number of routes have turbulence, they don't try to an eye of a storm. They take a different route. And I'm sure the last 4 years we heard of a strategy of saying banking is affected differently from insurance. Can we change the mix of our business so that if it's banking that is being affected, then insurance, we keep on rewarding our shareholders. Can we reduce the sovereign lease. Countries are affected differently, like in our region, Kenya is the most integrated global. So essentially, it has the biggest transmission effect into business. So we have focused a lot on the strategy of the group led by Brent and Brent has now a team of 7 that lead the focus on strategy. Maybe I will ask the team in the strategy office to be outstanding. Yes, very good. As [indiscernible] instructed, very good, lot [indiscernible] your strategy. Maybe don't know themselves. It looks like -- and also missing is John and who else, and Charlie Wilson, where are they? So that is the team that we have entrusted and said, "how do you deal with this?" Those who know Oscar joined us from being a chief executive of Nairobi International Financial Services. Before Nairobi Financial Services, he was the Council to Qatar International Financial Center for 9 years, and before that, he was in Landen Financial Center for 16 years. And how do you deal in turbulent market. You have seen these -- if you take 16 plus 9 plus. Oh gosh, you've worked that long, 30 years of operating in the market. That one is the former Chief Executive of image registrars. [ Vicki ]. You can -- I said [ Vicki ] look at it. Oscar brings international markets experience in Qatar and Landen. But we have our markets here, those who may not know immediate registrar, there are just governance and registry, helping all the listed companies in the Nairobi Stock Exchange and comprised so we said, work together. So it's global and local. Then we went to economics. This is about economy, understanding economy. We picked Charlie who? Robertson. Charlie Robertson is the emerging markets mostly known economist, is the author of the book, The Traveling Economist. And you can google, The Traveling Economist, it will give you his profile. I bet I'm not wrong that he's rated the best economist in emerging markets. When you talk about the emerging market, I want to remind you China is an emerging market. So that's the caliber. But we then matched in with our own well, one the most renowned advisors to the Kenya government is that -- we must predict how the government is truly creating a strong strategic team equal to the task of significant turbulence. Then we got John on capital allocation from previously, Bakeries Capital in Landen, how do capital allocation works and works very closely? And of course, then we've got maybe one of the most renowned commercial layers in the market. You can lease your heart to get through it. I said this is legal. Let's do the legal and David Bagenda, former strategy Director of Diageo Finance and Strategy Director for Diageo, for who many years? 5 years and before, why did we go to Diageo? Before Diageo he was in BAT because we needed to understand the consumer mindset. This is turbulence when pass on, it affects is the consumer. There is nobody who understands the consumer than FMCG. That's why we said, why don't you come under the strategy execution Director. So that team is the one we have entrusted. Those who were in the bank 4 years ago when turbulence started can see it. If we were in the bank 4 years ago, only Brent would see it. Gertrude, less than 2 years -- almost 2 years. We keep 5 months, Oscar, 7 months, 3 months, where are they? 3 months, there's Charlie 3 months. So it's a new team built for purpose, feed for purpose. So essentially, you could see how strategy has been thought and how much we have invested in strategy. They are in charge of organization of culture, the business model and the [indiscernible] colleagues. The second one is governance. It doesn't matter how much you deal with issues. If you don't have the right governance, things will go wrong. You strengthen. And I'm glad that our Chairman, Professor Macharia is with us. Professor maybe you could start. And we have been humbled. When I did this, the Chairman also decided to enhance and strengthen the bench of the board. And maybe today, I would say, and we'll talk about them another day. We might have the best board anywhere in the world, that has been brought to help us, highly experienced, highly, highly experienced people who could help us cope with this. One of the most celebrated board member is the former chair of Tata group in India and previously revised Chair of IFC, the private sector of the world that says, can we understand economies. The Chairman has really strengthened his board to be able to -- I think it's all boards to have the capacity, the competence to guide such [indiscernible] of CEOs in the strategy to question and to clear our tension between management and the board so that you don't have. So that governance and then we have created the position of governance in management. That is what Victoria is focused on, Group Director of governance, strategic retail and chief of staff. So because allowing people to freely get everything aligned for people who when we have seen, she's in-charge of regulators with Chief. So that has really been done. And of course, the people we then we have asked ourselves, what would make people stick with Equity? What would make Equity attracted the best people now. And now that it has attracted them, how will Equity keep them? It's a question of cooking looking after your people. Give them the best medical scheme the world can provide, the best pension scheme. I want to say we're now up to 20% of salary as a pension, so that in the old age, you lead the same quality of life as when you were working because you are saving 20%. Medical comprehensive, minimum 2 million shillings cover. We are glad that the shareholders allowed us to benefit from 5% of the entire bank group as to create an employee share ownership scheme. You can't attract that kind of people. You can't retain high-quality top without very good performance reward and compensation scheme. And then in unlikely event, there is a challenge, right cover for staff of up to 8 years gross salary, so that it could take care of families that would be left behind. Bring certainty in the employees so that the only thing you can count on during difficult times is people. Getting the right people who can make differentiated decisions and are passionate and enthusiastic. It doesn't matter how good people are. If they are not happy, the outcomes are not good. People can only be enthusiastic and passion because they are happy. Nothing has ever been achieved without passion. So that is really what we have focused on. But the end game is the customer, but we deliver to the customer, through systems and processes. And I feel very, very proud with what Equity has achieved. It's unfortunate the entire team of IT which is being added by our Executive Director and Chief Operating Officer, is in India, a team of 24, and it's really ensure we have the best systems or not. They have done the core systems or infrastructure, that is complete, processing capability has been done. And now they are looking at processes, how do you engineer processes? So that they deliver to their customer. They have built a product house that has developed the right products here. And I'm sure all of you could witness that instability of our system is something of the past, and we are very excited. And we see our transaction -- despite the challenge, transactions this last year went up by 67% because the systems are stable. Customers have come back. They are trading, those who had become multibank, has come back, they have really focused on the bank because the systems are capable, they are reliable, and dependable and are accessible. So broadly, that is what we are focused on. We are focused on this because we are living in uncertain times. We can't make uncertain time certain. But certainly, we can prepare ourselves for uncertain times. And everything has been made fit for that purpose of living in uncertain times. It's not easy to navigate an organization when you have 5 shocks -- 6 shots simultaneously. Alex bring back that Slide of shocks. It's about this is what we are dealing with, an environment what you could call a perfect storm. So the only thing we can do is look at how do we have strong capabilities within the organization that differentiates us. How can we make differentiated the decisions because we need differentiated decision. That is the quality of management. How can you give management the right tools that is IT, the systems and processes must be the right. How do you get the staff to be committed to battle in turbulence without losing faith or confidence - by looking after them, investing in them. So this is the time I really focus on investing on the staff to make sure that they can remain loyal. They can remain committed. They can be enthusiastic and they can be great champions of winning the battle. We are in a battle field, battle field with turbulence, and that's what it is. So having done that, then we asked ourselves, but also how does -- does the environment has opportunities. So Alex, the next slide. And we look at East Africa, we said, there is turbulence. But you pick what you see, we have chosen, we have built enough resilience. We have built enough capability to light our tabular. So we have focused on opportunities. Every cloud has a silver lining. Our silver lining, which holds the future for this bank, is that we are lucky to be in the fastest-growing region in Africa. And when we look at that growth, it is not a season of growth, is that is pinned by fundamentals that guarantee long-term sustained high growth, whether it's DRC, whether it's Kenya, whether it's Tanzania, whether it's Uganda, they are growing on the strength of fundamentals and we can predict that -- and we believe that Eastern Central Africa is the new Southeast Asia. And those who know Southeast Asia, the Singapore, the Taiwan, Hong Kong, they sustained growth for nearly 30 years. We believe that is the beginning of our 30 years of very, very rapid growth because it's really the fundamental. And you can see how on average East Africa is doing compared to all other parts of the world. It's almost growing 5x faster than the Europe. It's growing 3x as fast as the United States of America. So what will that growth do to attract global capital and global investment? And we believe that will play on the platforms of equity because the strategy we took of diversifying in the region, we acted on it and became systemic in the entire region. So if there were a regional bank, there is only 1, Equity as we shall see. If we move to the next slide, then we look at the monetary policy. We are seeing stable inflation for most of our economies. Yes, there is turbulence out there. But back home, the turbulence is not significant. So we're not dealing with the domestic issues. We are dealing with international issues. So you could manage the code that leads the local with -- there is only 1 vertical that you need to really focus on. And when you look at the inflation outlook, it looks like it would be fairly managed. There is nowhere inflation is out of range. And that gives us real confidence. If we go to the next slide, Alex, we look at the outlook. Kenya, very promising; Tanzania, very promising; Uganda, very promising, same as Rwanda and DRC. There will be internal challenges. You can talk about the great rates conflict. But that conflict has been there for about a year. It's only we are hearing it more because it's active. The active volcanoes have been with us, every 20 years they erupt, but life continues after they have settled. So that's the confidence, that's the outlook we have given officially. And broadly, when we look at the region, we are happy that Kenya, despite not being the fastest-growing economy still anchor the financial market stability. And that then gives us confidence that our headquarters, our reporting currency is of the strongest economy in the region, the most stable because reporting, as we saw, is a big issue. And when you look at upside opportunity, this is the most significant slide, you see if you take these rates as of today, East African region, this year is growing at 8.75%, when the world is growing at 2.8%, when Europe is growing at 1.7%. That's the energy that we talked about. We can talk about GDP to -- debt to GDP. We believe it's still manageable. The monetary policy, the inflation. So this is the summary of economy. And we are saying the resilience we have built could [indiscernible], and lastly is that we see East Africa as the heart of the driving ecosystem of the African continent free trade area. It's a multi-integrated regions in trade. And now is the opportunities that we are not strengthening the organization purely for capability, we are strengthening the organization for the opportunity, East African region. So what it means is it will not just be a cost. Upfront, we know we have upfronted management. When all these Chief Executives come in 1 year. Of course, you see a significant jump in cost. But for sure, within 3 years, we have generated enormous volume of business because the opportunity is strong that the unit cost of staff will be negligible. Alex, so you can move on. So let's go to the strategies that we have been and let's measure the health of the organization. Our priority strategy has been regional diversification of the banking business. And as you can see, we are very, very excited that when you look at the region, from a past perspective of deposits, 48% of our deposits are outside the region. Loans, 48% of loans are outside Kenya. Our assets, 49% of our assets outside Kenya, but look at revenue. We don't do assets for the sake of assets. We don't give loans for the sake of revenue. Look at revenue. The region is outperforming Kenya. 54% of our revenue is from the region. And when you look at profit before our provisions, our 55% is from the region profit before tax, 54%. And we feel very confident that we have derisked the sovereign risk of head office. And this is when you know you are successful. When the regional subsidiaries become bigger than your parent company. That's really then when you say, wow, the strategy of expansion is really really working. And we take significant pride as to how that has happened, and that ensures that, that diversification helps us to manage the economic shocks because different countries, as we saw, they have different economic parameters. So you can compensate and we have seen Kenya went through huge challenges, DRC jumped in to be the support the organization. And we can see maybe shareholders, you can look at the return on average equity. The babies have a better return on equity than the parents. That's when you then realize you are doing better when your children goes to a higher grade than yourself. That's when you say you are successful and you have a legacy. And we are excited that even return on assets, the region has 2.7%, where in Kenya is at 2.4% and it then demonstrate where WACC needs to be done. If we look at the next -- how do we see it? Because sometimes you can see the numbers and miss the big picture. The big picture is that we are #2 in Kenya, #2 in DRC, #2 in Rwanda. Those are the most significant markets. The 2 largest markets, Kenya and DRC are the central market. And as you can see, Uganda, we're #5 and not too far from #3 and #4, in South Sudan, we are #4, not so far from #3. So essentially, we can generalize the judge and say we are systemic because we are in the top 4 positions in each of the markets we operate in, except one. That's when you then say your strategy works, not in your domestic market, in a foreign market. The business model is working, it's accepted. And you also say the brand is performing across markets. And that is a very good position to be as an organization and I feel very, very proud of what our management has been able to do. Then we said the banking is not enough. Banking behaves differently from insurance. Let's diversify from, yes, we go regional, but we also diversify our offering of products. And we decided to go into insurance and as you can see, we saw the graph of the banking and the last 4 years have been significantly difficult. But look at what is happening in insurance. Look at the policies. We now have issued 14 million policies in 3 years. That is about how many times number of policies issued by the other players? 2.4x more policies than the entire industry. And you say, it's the brand. Remember it's the brand, it's the Equity brand. So it performs well in banking, it performs well. And you can see unique customers, 6 million unique policy holders. What does it mean? Every policyholder is having at least an average of 2 policies, at least to 2 policies. And we are very happy that the consumption is -- can lead us to cross-selling. So insurance, we do. Then we ask ourselves, what is the big picture. Another slide, look at live industry. In the third year, you are #4 largest insurance in the industry. And you can see it's neck to neck with -- that position in 3 years, actually, we will finish 3 years this quarter. We were still 2 years and 9 months when we printed this account. We are finishing 3 years this quarter. But you can see the position. We are #1 in return on equity, #4 in profitability, #7 in total assets. How many insurance companies are there in the industry? 64. So you are not #1 out of 2. You are #1 out of 64. Sometimes that is why the context is very important. So we're very, very happy that the brand is performing wherever it is, the reputation of the brand is very, very strong. So we are happy with the insurance. So banking is doing well. Insurance holds the promise of the future and then you look at technology and how we are performing with the technology. Of course, the end of COVID reflected us right challenge people going back to the old ways during COVID. We are doing 89% of all our transactions via digital, but we came down to 89%, but we have started going back. We are now up to -- sorry, we came to 85%. We are now roughly 86%, would like to see more digital. We saw our customers going back to agents, but it looks like they are now getting back that maybe online business is a better way. So again, the technology group has really supported us and the channels. We talked about the product house. Really, it's not just product, but the channels. But look at the performance of the channels. And what really has drilled us is that we have moved from brick and mortar, we have moved from the variable cost channels to self-service channel. What self-service means is that there are no cost to us. It's a customer serving themselves on their own devices. That's no cost. And as you can see, those are the dominant channels. And that's what the previous right, Alex, I look at the digital channel self-service. Agency is that party of the ATMs and branches is brick and motor. Now we can see how the shape so that you can interpret the channels. The dominant channels are now the self-service. We are increasingly becoming a nonbanking business. What does it mean? We're able to provide banking 24 hours wherever you are, whatever type. So we have compressed distance, we have compressed geography to allow customers the freedom. When we look the nonbanking, what is the contribution of the nonbanking? As we can see, we take confident that most of the numbers are showing on upward, whether it's profit before provisions. If we look at profit before tax, yes, it's more, but the direction is right, that the insurance, it's not just growing, but it's growing faster in profitability than the banking industry. And that's why its ratio of contribution is growing. We now, this year, have activated the general insurance. This is just life insurance. So general insurance and health insurance now will come in play. So if we assume even at the beginning, each of them takes 3, it means 10% of our business will be in the insurance industry hopefully by next year. Yet this is a systemic regional bank in the top 4 positions in 5 markets in the fastest-growing region in the world. I've paused so that we'll be on the same page with what I have said. That's a very broad statement for an investor. So we then we have seen and then the last is our 2 regions, the social region and the sustainability region. We are very, very excited. One number that you may want to take that has peaked very, very significantly is the contribution to women and youth in providing livelihoods, opportunities for them to be in business, a 2.5 million customers. The second one, you may not want to miss is the last quadrant. Look at Equity Afya, 3.3 million patients in a period of 4 years of start-up. And you may also want to see the Equity Afya clinics are now 132 in 4 years. So since the head of the pilot and we're very, very excited about Dr. John. So Dr. John can answer all the questions about the social region. The banking region, Moses; insurance, Angela and Brent to talk about strategy. So you now know who to direct the questions to, so that you really can get to the depth of it. So what is the story? The story is we have built the resilience. We have built a leadership that is differentiated. We have built governance that is really strong. But despite that hard work, how do the numbers look like? So Alex, if we go to the numbers. This is our numbers, the balance sheet. And you can see the growth between 2024 and 2023. As we said, one of the biggest issue was the strengthening of the Kenya shilling from 160 to 130. So it has significant impact on our numbers because every currency is being translated into Kenya shillings. So while on the face of the balance sheet, it shows like we didn't grow, that we are maintaining at KES 1.8 trillion. If it was like-for-like, that the currency was constant at 160, we could have grown from KES 1.8 trillion to KES 2.1 trillion. That's an 18% growth. The region is growing heavily and significantly very, very fast. As a result, when we look at deposits, again, like-for-like, in terms of constant currency, we have grown at 23%. Well, remember, 40% of our balance sheet is in dollars. So the dollars have been translated at 130 instead of 160. So we could see the impact. If you look at -- because the health of a bank is intermediation. So you look at both the customers' trust and confidence at 23%, we're happy. Look at shareholders. Again, very strong capital buffers, the shareholders' wealth is growing faster than the balance sheet, almost 2x as fast as the balance sheet on constant currency. If you look at the other items that you may want to look at, is liquidity. Liquidity is very well. If you look at cash and cash equivalent, as we turn the corner, we are very well positioned to do business. And this is what one of the biggest responsibilities we had was to structure or to restructure the balance sheet from the turbulence. How do you have your balance sheet? Turbulence doesn't last. We see seasons come and go. So we believe they will go but how well will we be positioned. As you can see, the 2 biggest buffers or let's extend them to 3. The 3 biggest buffers is capital, how well are you seated with the ultimate protection of our business capital. How well are you in liquidity for agility for quick turn when opportunity, for ability to take opportunities. Look at a combination of cash and government securities that are tradable. That's where the bank -- that's liquidity. Kenya has almost a liquidity of 82%. The whole bank has a liquidity of 57%. So it's really -- and we are hoping these opportunities will unlock. We're very well capitalized to grow the business. And we shall also see when it comes to net loans, we set up provisions to ensure that the quality. I take pride that we might have the best coverage in terms of provisions at 71% coverage so that you don't carry or be lagged behind because of need for provisions. We have taken whatever provisions we need at cash basis at 71%, ignoring the securities. If we look at P&L, that is of great. We all knew we were struggling with interest income. Interest expense was growing faster than interest income. And of course, our net interest income is where we struggled. It's more at the top line. Non-funded income, much better total income. And again, as we said, the loan loss provisions so as to enhance the quality of our asset up 43%. You don't fail to provide -- you tell the shareholders the truth. These are difficult times. We all know NPLs in Kenya are around 16% as an industry. We are glad that we are at 12% when the industry is at 16%. But if you look, we start out as the bank that has made the biggest provision relative to the balance sheet. We have now managed to -- despite the huge staff complement we have acquired, we have now stabilized our cost of staff, meaning that most of the staff are just 1 year. So the 2 numbers are now almost equal and stable. So profit before tax, we go up -- maybe I should have emphasized that this result when we saw revenue is straight, it's growing at 6%. We then said, what do we have control over. We have control of our expenses. And as a result, you can see we constrained our cost growth of only 2%. And that gives us a 17% increase of profit before tax and 12% after tax. Very confident about the future. As you can see, we increased dividend from KES 4 to KES 4.25. The capital is big. We don't need -- we need to start -- these are difficult times. It's not only difficult to organization, but also to shareholders. So how much do you invest in shareholders? You don't just look at staff, you also look at your shareholders. There are many stakeholders you need to balance, relationships on. And the dividend payout becomes a record dividend of KES 16 billion. And we hope this will not only go to the shareholders, but will be felt at the economy level and dividend yield is at KES 850. So the KES 4.25 is of a share of KES 0.5 that's value of an equity share, the par value -- is not KES 5 like most of the shares we compare with. Our is [KES 0.50] as the par value. That's really the money we get from a shareholder as the capital, but for [KES 0.50] you are giving KES 4.25 in a year. I hope shareholders can see how the yield for your plant is. But going forward, what really we focus on is the ratios. How are the ratios. And as you can see, the ratios tell us the health of the organization. Analyst, this is your page -- PAR as we can see, we have come down to 12.2%. Coverage, we are at 71% higher than last year, it was 67%. So we are -- despite the improvement in quality of loan book, we have increased. And of course, loan deposit ratio, the lowest we have seen in many years below 60%, core capital at 17% and 19%. When you look at core capital and total weighted risk capital [Indiscernible] shows how capitalized we are, and that's why we are willing to pay out dividend generously to the shareholders. And as we said, look at liquidity at 57%. So Alex, if we go 2 slides back, we then are confident -- sorry. So we increased our profit from KES 43.7 billion to KES 48.8 billion. That's after tax. But before tax, we increased our profit from KES 51.9 billion to KES 60.7 billion. And we're very, very confident. How do we look at the past? Alex, if we can go to the forecast. The first one is to look at what had we given as a guidance. We were very optimistic that we could grow loans at between 2% and 5%. We missed the target. Our loans shrunk instead of growing. We were optimistic, we would grow our deposits between 7.5%, but to 7%, we only grew by 3%. And this is what we are talking about. We are operating in a very turbulent environment. If you look at those numbers, particularly deposits, we might be the best in the industry. Everybody else has shrunk in deposits. It's difficult times, but we have been very, very resilient. As I said, this picture is because of the structure -- in summary, so that people can understand how our balance sheet was. Interest cutting, the shock made us unable to lead to unsecured borrowers. So what did we do? We bought into government stock at 10% and then the cost went all the way to 18%, but your interest [Indiscernible] remains at -- bought Eurobond at 7 interest rates, cost went to 12. You are getting negative. The good thing, we have seen significant revisal. The Central Bank rate is where it was before the peak. So that is normalized and you see a normalized performance when we report the first quarter. And that explains why despite missing the target for last year because of [indiscernible] shocks, which we couldn't be able to really predict when they could hit. We are now more confident. We have built a resilient team, a resilient balance sheet. So we are optimistic that this year, we'll grow our loans by between 10% and 15%, deposit between 10% and 15%, and we will test this in the first quarter, which we will be reporting in just about a month's time. And that also explains the interest -- net interest margin. We're optimistic, we will enhance that. [Non-funded], we are optimistic, but we will still be able to retain above 40%. And now we are confident that because we have seen stabilization in costs, interest expense is likely to come down significantly. We are confident we will be able to be below 48%. Return on equity, we had projected 25% to 30%. We added at 21.5%, and we could tell the reasons, return on assets. So our optimism and confidence in the future has not been affected by the turbulence. It's reinforced by the strategy, the capacity of our people and more importantly, how we have been able to adjust the bank. And the cost-income ratio, we're confident we are even aiming lower than we had aimed last year despite missing. We say that was storm of -- the eye of a storm. We are through the storm or we have built resilience of operating in a volatile environment and that tells us confident. We are confident. I think this we need to pay a little bit attention, the subsidiaries contribution, we have targeted the same because we are feeling like Kenya, the sleeping giant is waking up, and will push back. And it will be interesting to see Kenya gaining to contribute more than 50% of the profit. So we are wishing [Indiscernible] as well. The task is -- he has taken it in stride that not yet. You push back in terms of -- we are confident. It looks like [Indiscernible] so that's our outlook of the future. The present is what it is, but the future remains starting and it's because of the transformation that the organization has gone through. I want to stop there and give you an opportunity to interrogate the management with questions so that we can lead through to what you may want us to focus on. Once again, thank you very much for being houseful.

Thank you [Indiscernible] for keeping us upbeat. You spoke of that we now look at opportunities instead of beating ourselves up a lot. In DRC, outside traditional mining, where are you seeing upticks that has made it even overtake in terms of registering profitability. To Mr. [indiscernible], what opportunities are we seeing locally in agriculture that can help us -- that can help our farmers and our economy. To Dr. [Indiscernible], the biggest pain point now for how to pay for medical care -- how are you -- what are your experiences around this pain point?

Thank you very much, George, for those 3 questions. I think, Brent, you can give them a go. DRC outside mining, what are the other sectors that driving that growth? Or is it a concentrated mining business? And the second question, what are the agricultural opportunities in Kenya. So Brent, you can go for those 2 questions. And then Moses, you can jump on that Kenya to add on what Brent will leave out. And I'm saying that, George, because Brent, we said strategy is equal to agriculture. So Brent can't tell us he succeeded unless we succeed in having 30% of our loan book being in agriculture. So he's the person responsible, but the book is with Moses. And the third question will be shared between the Dr. [indiscernible] and [indiscernible]. I think it talks of both the demand side and the supply side. How do we make medical care affordable. So Brad?

Thank you for the question. So on the first question on DRC and the opportunities that we see. I think we need to think of our subsidiaries, including DRC in the context that we operate as a contiguous operation across East and Central Africa. So the opportunities we see in our markets, including DRC, is both a domestic story outside of mining as well, but also the opportunities in which this trade and investment corridor provides of which DRC is a key anchor to our activities in East and Central Africa. So let me focus on the domestic story. So yes, there is more opportunities beyond just mining. There is the ecosystem around mining. So this is logistics services or specifically mining services, the FMCG companies supplying into the mining ecosystem, particularly in Southern DRC. But we have set up our business such that we are capturing the entire opportunity set in DRC. So it's important to talk about our operational structure to reflect that we've set up the business in terms of management structures so that we cater for the West, we cater for the South, Central, East and Northern DRC as well. Across these markets, we see agriculture as a key opportunity. You will appreciate that DRC has -- is 4x the size of Kenya. It has about 80 million hectares of arable land, of which 10% to 15% is utilized. You will also appreciate that there is significant investment going into what is called the Lobito Corridor. So this is a critical minerals infrastructure belt running through Angola, DRC, Zambia, of which DRC is a key part of that corridor. And important to highlight, this corridor straddles -- whilst it's a critical minerals rail corridor, it does straddle across the agricultural potential of these 3 countries, including the DRC. The DRC also has over 100 million population. This is a country where credit penetration is around 8%. There is about 7 million, 8 million bank accounts. If you include mobile wallets, there's about 15 million in an adult population of 50 million. So this is, call it, Kenya 20, 25 years ago in terms of the potential of banking opportunities. So agriculture is clear. There is the FMCG, the fast-moving consumer goods. As I mentioned, 100 million -- over 100 million population. Over time, there is a lot of manufacturing businesses that are already catering for what is almost a 20 million population in Kinshasa. So there's a high density of population in a few cities. There is also the opportunity around the asset financing that we see because of the capital expenditure that the manufacturers are looking to do in terms of their investment in capacity expansion as well as the mining equipment. There is a lot of asset finance opportunities. Also, we see payments. So there's a big focus of the group, not only in DRC, but across the group around what we do with payments and the movement of money. You will appreciate that the DRC is a cash-driven economy. So our ability to provide these value propositions on making it easier for customers to move money is also a big opportunity for us. SMEs, if I -- and SMEs obviously is a cluster of many industries. but SMEs is a big opportunity for us. Similar to what we did in Kenya, the expectation is that we will also grow our SME book. What this means for our bottom line is that -- and our balance sheet is that with this low credit penetration, you should expect continued high double-digit growth in our balance sheet, but also importantly, margin expansion as we penetrate the SME market. But because we're leveraging off digital channels, agency banking, we'll also look to contain the costs given our abilities and experience in other markets. So to be precise, beyond mining, there is agriculture, there is FMCG, there is SME and there's big opportunities in what we see in the payment space as well. And then what we do in Kenya, for instance, what we're doing in insurance, we will replicate in DRC as well, leveraging off the infrastructure of the banking business. On the question around agriculture. So agriculture ranges between 20% to almost 40% of economic activity in all our countries, whether you're looking at Tanzania, DRC, Kenya, et cetera. As a proportion of GDP, it's between 20% and 40%. So there's a lot of opportunities there. And -- but you contrast this to the banking industry, and we can talk about Kenya. In fact, Kenya will probably be the highest, where loan mix of the banking sector is only 3% of the total book, and you contrast this to economic activity of 20% to 40%. So what are we doing? As part of this Africa Recovery and Resilience Plan, it essentially looks at developing value chains. And when we talk about value chains, this is everything from the primary sector. So this is agriculture in terms of farmers as well as with the extractive sector or mining sector. So these are the raw materials that industries, businesses require. But when we talk food and agriculture, it's everything from the farmers all the way to agro processing to FMCG manufacturing, all the way to exports into global markets. So in agriculture, we have a systematic approach to develop the agricultural value chains. And we're working with many stakeholders, including the Kenya government on developing livestock value chains. We have a big initiative around leather and beef. We have big initiatives also that we'll be looking at in terms of tea, cereals, oilseeds, agriculture. So we are looking across all the different subsegments within agriculture. But we're doing it in a manner where we will look to support value addition in agriculture. And this is consistent with the governments across our markets, policies around import substitution. The learnings from COVID, the learnings from the disruption and the changes in global supply chains is that countries need to be more self-sufficient. So this import substitution industrialization that the Kenya government is going through is complementary to what we are doing with developing value chains and importantly, supporting value addition with our manufacturers, our agro processes. So you'll see more of the activities on the agricultural side. As James mentioned, it's a strategic importance of ours. The intention is for us to move our food and agricultural loan mix to 30% by 2030. So we want to be known as the banker to value chains and not just a bank to SMEs. I think we want to be a lot more intentional in how we connect SMEs into a logical sequence called a value chain. So hopefully, that answers your question.

The thing I can add is, in our target of reaching 30%, we are now at 16%, 16% of the entire loan book is in agriculture. Moses, anything you want to add on agriculture?

Thanks, [Indiscernible]. To complement what Brent has mentioned, one of the things we are also quite strong on is using our strength as a group known as having a foundation, having a commercial arm. So we are working very closely with the foundation in terms of capacitating, particularly the [Indiscernible] farmers and ensuring they do have the right technical skills to enable them scale up. In addition to that, George, the other piece we've done as a Kenyan Bank is to ensure we have the right specialists across the subsectors that George has mentioned. That enables us then to map the whole of Kenya and be able to target opportunities wherever they sit. If it's a dairy area, then we're able to deploy specialists to support our farmers in terms of financial capacity targeting dairy. If it's an area around animal husbandry, similar as such. So we are quite poised to achieve the targets that James has mentioned to move us from that 16% to 30%.

Dr. [indiscernible], what pain points are you addressing with [indiscernible]?

Okay. Thank you, George. So the question was on the strain as far as paying for health care services. So if you look at health care services and total health care expenditure, you'll note that about 50% or at least 50% goes to paying for outpatient services with only 25% going to pharma and inpatient services and the final 25% going to the ancillary services related to health care. So a large cost of health care payments go through outpatient services. And that advised the need for equity to look at outpatient health services as a priority starting point in terms of addressing health challenges and access to health care issues. So when we look at trying to manage down the cost of health care, we noted as well that the aspect of access would be a key driver of the cost because without the access elements, then cost drivers present from even issues to do with transport to access those services or escalating costs because of lack of timely seeking of health services, you're postponing your care because you have no facilities perhaps next to you. So that advised our very strict targets in terms of how far and how fast we need to expand our Equity Healthcare network. Over the last 4 years, as you've had, we've been able to grow the network from 4 medical centers -- 5 medical centers all in Nairobi to the current 132 medical centers, all counties of Kenya covered. And now we've rolled out into our next subsidiary, which is DRC. So in taking the services closer to people then, we are able to manage the access aspect, therefore, lowering the cost. Another thing that we are then looking at is then how do we build in efficiencies into our model because ours was driven by not just the access element, but also the affordability and high quality. How are you able to safeguard quality even as we manage the affordability aspect. So we work with partners, including the pharma partners because inside outpatients, of course, we've noted that pharma and the human resources for health are the biggest cost drivers. On the human resources for health, we are pleased because we have alignment, the medics that are running these facilities are largely from our education program, the equity leadership program. So we're able to bring from the same page and we tell them how can we work together to manage the aspect of cost of health care and the human resources for health. On pharma, we are now working very closely together with the bank and its ecosystem of pharmaceutical importers, distributors, manufacturers to see how can we localize manufacture and how can we then strengthen local value chains around pharma to then bring down the cost. So I think we've been largely successful given that our target has always been to have an average cost of 2,500, which we currently are around there. It's 2,900 and always exploring ways to bring it down lower. But then we've also realized that it is not in order and it is not sustainable to have our patients paying for their health services out of pocket. And so because of that, we've worked collaboratively with our insurance arm who are then developing solutions to see how we mitigate the aspect of out-of-pocket payments because it presents a risk as far as empowerment of our communities. We're working very hard on our social impact initiatives to empower the communities. So we want to also safeguard that when you seek health services. That's when [Indiscernible] on the economic end. So that's one of the challenges that we are [Indiscernible] the insurance team.

So before I hand over to [indiscernible], you can come and take the seat. George, I think the objective was to make health accessible, affordable and of the highest quality. As we speak, the doctors we have remember the top performance in the country, sponsored by Equity. So that almost guarantees quality. The second thing is the franchise is owned by a nonprofit making organization. We have no intentions of making money from health. So Equity Afia franchise is owned by the Equity Group Foundation. That's why [Dr. Joan] is speaking about it so that we don't make money. And that was the intention. And how do we bring the benefits of the bank like its brand, like its capability of procurement, correct centralized procurement, bulk purchasing, how do you ensure the costs are managed by having what she talked about, the target is 2,500, but that covers the cost of tests as you walk in the lab, they cover the consultancy by the doctor, then covers the prescription or the drugs will be provided by the pharmacy. And that also includes if you have a dental or an optical issue that will be included. So -- and that is how we've been able to add that cost of all those inclusive per visit. But KES 2,500 is not cheap for every Kenyan. And so the next step is how do we make it even more cheaper by ensuring it's not an out-of-pocket cost because if it's an out of pocket, it then becomes a problem. And that's when we thought of thinking how do we provide the country with a health insurance policy that then you don't pay the [Indiscernible] visit, but you take a policy, maybe KES 5,000, KES 7,000 or whatever amount it is, that covers you for the whole year and covers you and your family. And to do that, we have Equity Health, the Managing Director of Equity Health Insurance is Dr. Gatonga. Dr. Gatonga do you want to speak to the surprise side and how you are making health more affordable using insurance?

Yes. Thank you very much, Dr. James, and thank you, George, for that question, and good morning, everybody. So on the health insurance side, as has been mentioned, one of the things we -- the real problem we want to solve there is household resilience as part of responding to our strategy of the Africa recovery and resilience plan. And what we are doing to -- in order to connect what is happening on the supply side and what is happening at the household level in terms of paying for health care is to then create insurance solutions or financing solutions for health care. And in order to make that very easy and affordable to access, there are about 3 fundamental things we are trying to do there. One of those is to make sure that we develop solutions that are very simple for customers to understand. And we've done a lot of studies on this to understand what have been the barriers that have stopped people from buying these solutions. One of them is that you have to make them affordable. But at the same time, you have to bring the solution to a simplicity level that speaks to health care. So making it -- stripping it of a lot of complexities on things like [Indiscernible]. So that's one thing. The second problem we are addressing as we roll out this solution is to make sure that it's very accessible because the health insurance operates. For it to be successful, it operates on the basis of pooling, which means we have to get as many customers as possible into the pool so that after subsidizing the cost at the service delivery point, we also subsidize the cost through risk pooling. So -- and how we are solving that problem is to make sure that we work through our distribution network. We have a very unique advantage of as Equity of having a very wide distribution network covering branches, both the bank branches as well as the Equity Afia clinics, merchants and all of that to make sure that we can reach the country into all corners and reduce the -- and therefore, increase the pool, but at the same time, also reduce the cost of bringing these solutions to our customers. And the third important area we're also doing in conjunction with the supply side is to make sure that we drive education. Education in terms of financing because ultimately, health insurance is a financing solution, but also drive education in terms of health education because one of the things we've also noted as the burden of disease increases is that we need to increase awareness, particularly around prevention because more than 50% of what we suffer from is largely preventable. So that's what we put together in terms of health insurance products that we'll be rolling out.

[indiscernible]

Thank you, Dr. [indiscernible] I think just going back to the question, the studies show that 63% of consumers indicate affordability and financing are actually the largest barrier. So even as we design the product and we talk about the supply side, affordability is one of the biggest things that we needed to solve. Now through our partnership with the bank, we're very fortunate to have Equity Bank Kenya Limited, we structured insurance premium financing solutions, and we have a blend of 2 solutions for customers who are corporate and SMEs, and this is for all insurance products, they're able to get this as part of the typical loan product they would get from the bank, but for customers who are retail, we have partnered with Equity Bank Kenya Limited so that they prescore the customers, they provide them with an automated limit. And as a result, the minute they select a health insurance product, a life insurance product or a general insurance product, automatically, they have a prescore limit, which they will be able to access through the equity app and in a seamless manner, be able to get an insurance solution. We intend to go live in market in Q3. And so we are encouraging customers to join the partnership with Equity Bank because then you get prescore, you get an automated limit from day 1. And as such, we then remove the barrier of accessing insurance because we already have financing from the bank. The last one, which I'll mention is that, as I'm sure you know, Life Insurance solutions also have an option to provide a policy loan. And as such, any customer today of Equity Life who is consuming a long-term product or an endowment product, you're able to get a policy loan of up to 60% to 70% of your current savings and be able to apply that at concessionary rates to be able to access health insurance. So you can see from a collaborative perspective, we have the bank, we have other insurance partners, we have the technology business, and we're able to provide you with insurance solutions through the app, easily accessible and be able to do that to provide you with health care solutions, but also other solutions you might need for personal as well as business needs.

I think if I summarize it, George, that the sponsor of Equity Afia is a foundation that is not looking to make money. That really significantly removes the profit portion, which is normally maybe 20%, 30% of the cost. The second aspect of it is a controlled franchise by people who are convinced that they want to change society. They are giving back to those much has been given much will be expected. And we are really glad that the doctors agreed to be charging just KES 500 for consultancy. You could compare with this. When it comes to quality, accessibility and affordability, we aligned at the same level with Nairobi Hospital and Aga Khan. So that's the level of quality and affordability. And -- but last is what has been said here. We guarantee you quality, we guarantee you accessibility, but we are now addressing affordability by bringing insurance such that we are jointly bearing the cost of insurance. It's not the person we seek. It's a market, it's a population. And so the premiums are fairly affordable, but not maybe to everybody. So we have developed a premium financing. And I'm glad to say 50% of all the insurance policies we have issued are financed by equity bank, and we are very grateful. And that is why the offtake is such strong. The next question comes from [Indiscernible]. Going into the new year, what's the plan with Equity Afia? Will we see investment in [Indiscernible] Level 4 -- 5, 6 hospitals? Is there a plan to take Equity Afia into markets beyond Kenya? I think Dr. [Indiscernible] has answered those. Another one, Dr. [Indiscernible], my start-up is targeting KES 500 billion market with a unique value proposition designed to serve real estate industry. As found as we operate in a dynamic and resource-constrained environment, balancing innovation with limited access to capital. Given Equity Bank's commitment to supporting entrepreneurship and financial inclusion, what strategic advice would you offer on securing the right financial backing, forging impactive partnership and scaling efficiency to capture a significant share of this market. I think I would invite you [Indiscernible] and we really provide me more information and then I will be able to respond to that. But before you come, I would refer to you to somebody who had a similar value proposition, a company called [indiscernible]. So if you talk to Mr. [indiscernible] he has now provided our diaspora with a solution of owning a home in Kenya almost guaranteed by Equity. So if you could talk to [indiscernible], then you can come, we then design and co-create your product. Another question? Yes, please.

Thank you very much, especially for making so much money for us.

That's why I -- I can see why you took a little bit longer to count it this year.

Yes, it is true. KES 60 billion is not little money.

That's why I can understand. It took some time to count. Now on the issue of dividend since we passed the law between 30 and 50 -- for 3 years, you have remained too close to the minimum [Indiscernible] competitors are giving 80% of their earnings per share. Being that close to minimum puts you in [Indiscernible] why am I not fighting you in the top half of the reach when it comes to dividend. And when you have invested in a company where dividend is guaranteed, that dividend is an important input in household income, and many of your shareholders are people who that also addresses the issue of income in quality, one of the disasters we have in the world now. So can I encourage you to move towards 50%.

Thank you very much. It's true that dividend payout policy is between 30% and 50%. And Brent, is it 50% or 40% -- 50%. And it's true we have averaged near the minimum for the last 3 years since the shareholders passed that resolution. But if you look at it, it's how do we finance the subsidiaries. So you'll see although DRC made a lot of money and huge money. We are very, very encouraged by DRC. It's not able to pay dividend simply because it is growing faster than it can [Indiscernible] itself internally. Last year, but one, we had to [Indiscernible] despite profit is making -- huge profit, we have to add another [$70 million] to capital injection. And that explains why that state is in DRC. That state is in Tanzania, which has really now recovered and it seems it's trying to catch up with the others. So it's constantly we are putting capital, Uganda constantly putting capital. So there are only 2 subsidiaries that are making money and paying money is Kenya and Rwanda. And as you can see, Kenya is 50%. So if -- by the time the other start reaching where Kenya is, that whole 30% is by one subsidiary, Kenya, and that is why -- and yet the subsidiaries that are not paying are still asking for capital. So what we are doing is to build a future for our shareholders. And we are very excited that we are using dividend of the slowest growing market, Kenya and investing in the fastest growing -- the fastest-growing economies in the world, Uganda, Rwanda, Tanzania and DRC are in the top 10. So we are saying, do we allow this opportunity for our shareholders. And we are saying, let's do the delicate balancing act. Let's give them a contractual obligation, but also ensure that the future is becoming brighter. So I maybe have a cup of [Indiscernible] with you to dialogue how can I balance that better with the team, but the objective is to create a future. As you see, it took Kenya 16 years to reach a 4% return on assets. It took Rwanda 14 years. Looks like DRC would do it in 12 years. So what we are seeing is that we are making better bet for our shareholders. And as you heard Brent said, only 7% of the population of DRC has bank accounts. Loan to GDP is only 8%. Kenya, we are 32%. You can see the runway, how large is the runway. So we need to balance that, but it's a conversation we need to have. Do we miss the future? So do we balance the present and the future. And as we all know, wealth creation is not a function of the KES 60 billion, it's a function of how much we save to invest into the future. That's how you create compounded wealth. So it is more of paying today, consuming today or creating bigger investment in future. And we -- that's what we -- the last one I want to say -- our brand has become iconic. So what happens is that the European banks and international banks that are exiting the market, we have become the first point of call. And now you can see you look at [indiscernible], you look at ProCredit, you look at BCDC to do a startup in such a market like DRC will be almost impossible. So again, we always read that these opportunities are being shown to us constantly. And you can imagine the discipline of saying no to maintain the 30% rule on dividend payout. Yet, this is a one in a lifetime opportunity. You imagine now there is no European bank in DRC. The 2 that were there were taken by Equity. We missed that, it means it will be a start-up. And startup in such a market would be difficult compared to taking a BCDC, which was being consolidated with the European bank and had been in existence for 120 years. So that is the decision that always confront us. Opportunities for the future and consumption of today. And building resilient. Another question?

Yes.

My name is [indiscernible] from Citizens TV. A couple of questions. One of them is on nonperforming loans. Could you give us the actual figure in terms of how much are you holding in nonperforming loans? And also what is the spread in the region? When you look at the different markets that you are operating in, what is that spread? And for Kenya, in what sectors are you struggling with nonperforming loans? And number 2, on interest income, could you tell us how much of your investment in government securities contributed to that?

Alex, in a detailed paper, I'm glad we'll give you a very detailed answer. Maybe you could project that, Alex, not in the summarized version, in your printed version. It's on NPLs in [Indiscernible] section, not in the summarized paper, in the big -- the printed copy that you are handing over or you can pass to me -- on this one, Alex. Very good. I wish we could have seen this together. I hope it's on Page 44, if you are able to project Page 44. So the NPL ratios by segment, the one that we are struggling most is corporate. And I'm sure you know corporate [Indiscernible] pending bills that's purely matter. That is at 22%. SMEs are at 13%. So as you can see the average is 22%. Our best performing segments are Retail and Public sector. Alex, Page 44, if you can project, so that everybody can follow for themselves. I think our biggest challenge in terms of concentration is Kenya, which has 17. Uganda, 14 and straight we drop from there Equity BCDC is at 5.7; and Equity Tanzania 3; and Equity Rwanda 4. So as we said, Kenya is the most integrated, but as you can see, you can read it directly it's corporates and it's the corporates that are holding [Indiscernible] For the group, the NPLs have declined from 13 to 12 if you combine. The average for the banking industry is 16. So we are 400 basis points lower than the industry. In terms of coverage, coverage is at 71% on cash basis and the balance up to 103 is covered by credit guarantees. So this is coverage of 100% without putting into consideration the value of securities. So it's full provision and that's why we said we have not carried the risk of the past, we opted to do. Alex, I would really appreciate if you could put -- that slide is on Page 44 and 45. But you get this booklet, so if we didn't get to the numbers, you get it. It's ready.

Thank you very much for the good work for the year. As you have said, the year had a lot of challenges, but generating such a profit and also giving us that dividend though may look constant, you deserve a pat on your back. Now I have 2 questions and 1 observation. And one question is about -- you said that a lot of your transactions are now digital, and that's very good. But -- and I also thank you because there has been a lot of sensitization about this thing of people telling you, can you call this number? And in the process, you see those people who are not informed end up losing a lot of their money either from the account or from the phone. Now I don't know how strong is your IT department so that whenever I am called by a number, and I may not be -- maybe I'm imagining of my mother in the village who may not know that Equity will call you on this number, and then somebody calls and tells her to do ABCD and then she ends up losing a lot of money. So what measures have you taken as a bank to make sure that you are savings -- the savings for your customers is safeguarded. Number 2, you have said that you're projecting your cost-to-income ratio to go between 48% to 50%. And yet you have also told us that we are experiencing shocks, although some have gone, but there are still some shocks like geopolitical and what is happening [Indiscernible]. Now my question is, how are you confident that in this year -- you are able to increase your income and to reduce your cost so that your income ratio may be between 48% to 50% or you might be a bit cautious and say even it remains at 56 or 58 there is no problem in that. And then lastly is you have said that in 3 years, there have been 14 million policies as far as insurance is concerned, and that is very good, then becoming #2 or #3, that is very good. But my question is this, what is your target for 5 years because if you have 21 million customers and so far you have 14 million policies, I'm thinking that by now, maybe around 18 or so of your customers, about 90% may be aware of these policies and maybe they have taken it. So what is your projection in the next 2 years as we celebrate the fifth year. Otherwise, I wish you well as you have said, the pilot never loses focus because of the turbulence. He keeps ahead to make sure that where he is taking his passengers, their life safely. And so we are sure that we as your passengers [Indiscernible] your management, you will not divert and go back to the airport you came from, but you will take us to where our destiny is. Thank you very much, and have a very good year 2025.

Thank you very much [indiscernible], very encouraging words. The reason why we are able to do this passionately, and then realistically is because of the support we get from shareholders and such a powerful statement of understanding the environment. Well, let me say this about our next model. We said there are [indiscernible] that we are dealing with. But we said if the appeal shocks is our new way of life. But the path will have shocks so we have to learn to navigate those shocks. [indiscernible] has learned that the hunter has learned to shoot without missing. Like birds have learned to fly without flapping. We have learned how to manage the business amid these shocks. And that's why I said I spent a lot of time. We had to transform Equity so that it's resilient. And we transformed Equity from strategy, from governance, from people, from systems and from customer offering. And the objective of each of these forecasts is to create resilience with the offering that we are making customers, resilient in our staff, resilient in our systems, resilient in our governance so that we could be able to write and be able to operate in an environment that we don't expect to go back to the old days where we could guarantee. We have met targets, not just for us and it's a little bit embarrassing for me because for 25 years, we were precise. We could tell our shareholders this is where we will be. That's where we'll be. These shocks, normally, we plan without them in mind and then they show up. While you are dealing with one, another one -- as we said, at the moment, we are dealing with these fixed simultaneous shocks. So what we have done is then said how is the business operating model in a turbulent environment, in an environment of continuous shocks. And we hope this year we will surprise the shareholders by surpassing and exceeding the projection. So we are testing ourselves have we build the human capability that can then think differently, that have seen it, have experienced it, that capability is now in the bank. We're looking at systems and saying, do we have the tool that will allow us to navigate and change the direction quickly. Do we have the agility of the balance sheet that could allow us to do. And one of the reasons of going agriculture 30% is that agriculture is the more resilient in the marketplace. Remember, the only sector that grew during COVID was agriculture because people have to eat. So we said, how do we insulate ourselves using a domestic capability because food in Kenya is normally a domestically produced to feed the populous. So that will remove you from the global shock significantly. So we'll work together and ensure. I think on the cost income, yes, I appreciate the suggestion of capital cost, but we may want to grow revenue. And one of the ways of growing revenue is reallocating. If you look 45% of our balance sheet is in sovereign risk. Sovereign risk is the lowest-yielding asset class. Now we are focused whether it's in agriculture. Let's put this asset into credit. And that alone would increase income by 30%, even without cutting cost. And that is why we are very optimistic that we should be able to take it to 48%. And I appreciate this skepticism moving from 56% to 48%, but you can hold me to that and we can test it with the first quarter, are we moving? We will not be at 48 because we are moving from 56. But are we making progress towards 48. And I believe, I'm confident, that we'll land about there, and we shall go to our destination. For sure, the transformation that has occurred to the group gives us significant confidence about dealing with shocks. And again, as I said, it's not about expense, it is also about revenue. As [indiscernible] you prepare on where shall we be in 5 years from 14 million, what position, what contribution of that group revenue will be coming? When will be -- what percentage will be the balance sheet size in 5 years? Let me deal with this issue of social engineering because that's what our customers are. We are spending a lot of money to advertise, to sensitize to our customers that we will only call you from one number. But you notice that once you open to a fraudster then what they do is socially, mentally [indiscernible] you lose track, you cannot see who they are. And we have encouraged our customers as much as possible, don't engage with fraud that doesn't give us number. Unfortunately, these numbers, calling the customer, we have no visibility because it can be any mobile network that is calling you. And the way you act, you're acting as normal because it is you. It's not the fraudster who is managing. If it's the fraudster, we can tell the difference between behavior patterns. But because it's you who is operating, you are operating accounts as it is normal. So -- but what we have done is to use significant resources on AI and we are the leader in using artificial intelligence, and we have created significant agents to help. I'm glad to say, raise the compliance level -- we have reduced social engineering frauds by what percentage?

It is about 30%.

30%. So you can see we are working loud [indiscernible]. But you can see we are doing it without visibility of the action. But AI -- we have invested heavily in AI to monitor then every fraud call, we feed it to the AI. So what -- how could -- what is unique about this? And then we pulled out screening of all transactions. So we are making every effort because, one, fraud is too many because that might be the only money the customer has in their account. So it's not about how many, it should not happen to any customer. One is too many. And so we are investing ourselves a lot. The IT team, is there anything you want to talk the fraud, is it [indiscernible], who wants to make a comment? [indiscernible] head of security.

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. [indiscernible] and Chairman [indiscernible] so much intervention that we have done as he indicated the problem is that these are people also coming from other networks, and we have gone ahead to even involve the commissioner of communication because you have to see where these lines that are being used to call. And how do you also ensure that we do have a way of preventing and also [indiscernible] from a banking perspective and those costs coming from Equity [indiscernible] them. The other numbers are coming from other sectors, and you see they have gone in a way that you can have so many SIM cards. And that's one area that we have started with the police the other network and we have [indiscernible] with the team within the law enforcement agencies, to track those people. But they keep on evolving bearing in mind of centers like [ MLOTS ] prison centers that actually propagate some of these [indiscernible]. But within the bank and there is further intervention and rolling up a program with even new systems that deal with machine learning and AI as have been put across just to try and address this particular menace. So what are we doing as a bank is a lot of intervention data analysis and also trying to bring on board on how do we protect our customers, is actually one of our key agenda that we seek and we review on daily and we update on weekly basis to see was there threat, how can we protect our customer. That's what I can add.

It's an industry problem, it was a mission of value systems problem. So the best way to protect the customer and that explains why we are spending money to sensitize the customer so that they avoid being social engineer. [indiscernible], I guess you now have the future you can share with us.

Thank you, Dr. James, thank you for that question. I think I'll start by taking us back to the overall good strategy, which is the Africa Recovery and Resilience Plan, where as highlighted previously by Group Strategy Officer, Brent, Equity Group is looking to target or achieve 100 million customers in the markets in which we operate. And those customers would be consuming various solutions. Now when you look at the Equity Insurance Group, this was the short-term goal, we had said that we had intended to have by 2030, 4 million customers. I think you can see we've already reached that. If you look at the 14 million customers, 5.9 are unique policies. So that tells us we've already achieved what we had targeted to do within 2 years and 8 months, and that is really a demonstration of the strength of the distribution capability within Equity Group. Now going forward, we've realized that the one thing we want to do is ensure that we are bundling our product. As you well know, the banking business does well to create wealth using credit, but then the insurance business then comes to help customers protect that wealth, protect life or protect health so that we have a holistic value proposition. So the first thing we want to do is ensure that all of our customers consume at least 3 insurance solutions, 1 life solution, 1 health solution and 1 wealth solution, which, therefore, means that as we look at brands target of ARRP of $100 million, the natural number we would be looking at for insurance policies, is 300 million policies. I still think, though, that 300 million is low because previously, Dr. James has talked about use-based insurance, and used based insurance is where we want to provide the insurance as a service. Our customer is traveling from a Nairobi to a certain town in [indiscernible], we want to be able to provide them insurance for that journey back to 100-kilometer journey, and that is a single policy. So we want to move from having annual policies, which are paid in advance. We have talked about the fact that they are very expensive, to use-based insurance where customers enjoy insurance solutions as they have a lifestyle. Today, if a customer is taking a flight from Nairobi, let's say, to Mombasa, they can just take an insurance -- travel insurance policy for that flight alone. And so we believe that we should be able to have customers consuming on average between 6 and 8 insurance solutions. I'd let you do the math because you can now see we're in millions. But as I said, that's more the capability of Equity in terms of distributing. Now from an industry perspective, currently, if you look at the markets in which we operate, the insurance penetration is 1.34%. The higher penetration is Kenya at 2.2%, the lowest is DRC at 0.4%. Our target by 2030 is to double insurance penetration in the markets in which we operate. The last one, which Dr. James asked me to mention is what proportion do we believe the insurance group will contribute to the overall PBT? We're currently sitting at just about 3% of overall group PBT, we are targeting to have double-digit contribution. However, as we mentioned, as the banking group of Kenya wakes up, as the DRC team wakes up, you can tell that it's going to be the risk of a life time to ensure that we can get to double-digit contribution. So thank you for the question, and I hope I have answered the brief, but also made the future commitment from the insurance group.

Not so quickly, [indiscernible], Dr. [ John ]. Can we be able Equity Asia and Equity Insurance be able to provide Kenyans with a universal health policy? Dr. John, you can go first. Yes, you're on, it's a surprise for you.

Okay. So universal health coverage is about availing health care services that are affordable to communities and that can assess them without financial crippling through access of health care services. So when you look at that definition of universal health coverage, you can see that the Equity Group, we are on course to deliver on that, and we're doing it in a very structured manner, because we're doing -- we've accessed overlapping on the aspect of the access through the health service medical centers, and we've also been challenged to also consider inpatients even as we further expand access here. So as I mentioned earlier, we're also looking at the aspect of how we safeguard our communities from financial ruin that can result from seeking health care services that were sudden and perhaps of a financial crippling in nature. So we are on course because we realize this is -- in the various countries where Equity operate, speak about health, you'll hear all of them defining universal health coverage as a common denominator. So we are on course and we're doing it in a very structured way to ensure that it's well delivered.

[indiscernible] is there anything else to add?

Yes. You make it [indiscernible] policy for all of us. We share health burden.

Absolutely, it's very possible. And one of the big things we've done is to make sure that the health solution that you get is a solution that's very flexible. You can buy whatever you can afford there, what you can afford is KES 500 shillings a month, you can buy a health coverage for that. If what you can afford the KES 50,000 a month, you can also buy health coverage products. So there's a huge element of universality in the solution. When you combine that with the flexibility we talked about and in terms of payments, in terms of insurance premium financing, that is very positive.

I think broadly like what we have done and what Dr. [indiscernible] is talking about is to ensure we are able to take a policy who's inpatient is only in fee-based hospitals because imagine how that comes through. Another one is where we give you a coverage for outpatient, you go to [indiscernible]. But in case of admission, the policy is for a public health hospital. So you can see the cost, then it's [indiscernible] to the pocket or you make the choice. But if you can afford and you weren't held in a 5 star hotel, then you also pay the policy of a 5-star hotel -- in a hotel, but you are receiving health. So you provide everybody with what fits them, not a one fits because that has been the problem. We have given 1 policy, but can't all afford the same policy. So we look at that. Alex, do you -- are you able to project that to Page 44 because that question was interest [indiscernible] So this is NPL issue that we are being asked about and you can see the big -- the problem we are talking about NPLs in the country is not [indiscernible] and you can see the relations between corporate and SMEs. When corporates are not paid their bills then they don't pay the SMEs who are [indiscernible] But you can see -- so it's a concentrated risk. So for us, I think we are talking about 12 loans are causing that corporate. So if we deal with the 12, if we are confident with we will be talking about 1 digit. We can see that trend from 13.4 to 12, and we can see the coverage. And you can see this quarter is the best coverage we have ever had for the last 5 quarters in terms of coverage. And that's why I always said, we are more focused on the quality and ensuring we don't carry the risk of the past into the future and return dividend. So this brings certainty as to how we manage the bank conservative. Again, we can see the countries that are having challenges. Again, it's a little bit of concentration looks like [ Kristine ], Uganda should be single digits? Look at Tanzania. Tanzania, 3 years ago, if you remember, was 39. Last year, it was [indiscernible]. Look, we are now hopeful by the first quarter we will be talking about one. So there are problems we can solve. It's just timing. I'm sure you are seeing too many head [indiscernible] of equity [indiscernible] few. So we have -- we believe this year would be our year of resolving. And if we recover those approximately 17 loans in the entire group. And if you look at in absolute number, we have a standard interest of about [ $23 billion ]. That can quickly swing back into profit. That is not provisioned. Provisions as we saw in the next page Alex is, as you can see, 78 billion of provisions. So standard interest out of that is 22. So by collecting those 17 loans, you'll see that swing and we expect to present surprises this year. And what we are talking about, the average Industry is at 16.4%, while we are 12.2% speaking about the quality despite the terms the shock, our performance remains pretty. Is there a question at the [indiscernible] before we say, thank you for -- thank you, I can see no question -- can't see question and make it very brief.

[indiscernible] incredible leadership is the [indiscernible] for every success in any given company. I want to appreciate you for being the powerhouse that you are, and then Equity's [indiscernible]. Allow me in this moment to welcome the new management, the new managers who came to this institution and to thank them to give this company a touch of quality and a taste of excellence.

What is this and what else? A touch of excellence. Yes. That's [indiscernible] on behalf of the shareholders, that's what the shareholders want, help me to hold management to account.

A touch of quality and a taste of excellence. And I want to say 3 things that you do the right thing at the right time, do not be complacent so that we can take strong actions a new underline. Do the right thing at the right time, do not be complacent. Now I have 1 [indiscernible] it's about confidence restoration and customer centricity. How does the institution organization ensure confidence, restoration to customer centricity?

Very good. Please, where are you? I wanted to shoot it straight to the Director of Customer [indiscernible]

Another [indiscernible] for the startups. As one of the giants in the banking sector, what's your [indiscernible] offering support to Kenyans [indiscernible]

Very good. So Dr. [ Joanne ], you take the question on support for start-ups. And Moses you on the customers. You are Director never showed up so take that question. And where is [indiscernible] be prepared. What are you doing to guarantee what the shareholders want is what deliver?

My name is [indiscernible] for those who might not have seen me since the [indiscernible].

And also Director of Strategic [indiscernible] you hear the [indiscernible] from the customer, what assurance can you give -- sorry, shareholders [indiscernible] is a shareholder. So Moses?

Thank you very much, [indiscernible] for putting us on the spot. Customer is the center of what Equity is and where we see as management, we fully dedicate ourselves to ensuring a level of customer service at the highest. Without a customer, we can't to be paid, and we are very cognizant around that. So the pertinent question you've mentioned around what are we doing to restore customer confidence? I think Dr. James did quite elaborate. There are many facets we are dealing with. One, we've seen the stability that we've put around systems, and that has taken significant investment to ensure that as we are able to serve you seamlessly so that you're able to transact when you want, how you want to transact. That's quite important in terms of ensuring that the reliability around what it is we promise you as a customer. You've talked of the management team, and you've put us to task around that. The team that's there is then to also drive a lot of innovation. One of the things we are looking at around customer centricity, is to develop products that talk to you. If we just generalize products, there won't be centricity. So even as we talk to you today, one of the big assets we have is give us feedback around what did you want. Our DNA now is approaching customers and telling them -- tell us what your dream is, then we are able to develop something that tailored towards that dream so that it really talks to you as a customer and provide you a solution as to what it is we are looking. The last one that I want to talk to and at the end did talk about it, is the overall governance around the organization, starting with the Board and the Chairman is here. So Board holds as a management totally to account to ensure we're able to deliver to you. But even within us, we've ensured we've provided proper structures and proper checks to ensure that quality levels are at the highest possible. As we do that, we're also transforming it to ensure that we are almost with you at par when you're doing transactions. So our level of monitoring, our level of digital solutions are also going to be up there to ensure that we are able to serve you fully as you do wish. So it's one Sally that we focus significantly a lot. It's a daily conversation for the management team of are we in touch with what the customer really wants. And that's a question we keep asking ourselves every day. We need to continue to invest. We'll never stop because the customer needs also evolve as we get to do that. Dr. James, let me touch a bit on the startup question before I hand over to Dr. John. We do appreciate and what made us who we are as a bank is being able to carry customers from startup to ensuring they develop through the motions to become like SMEs or very large corporates. We don't want to lose that. So where I see sit at the bank and together with my other banking colleagues, we are quite cognizant that the true DNA of Equity is actually around startup. That's what made us. That's what we'll continue to drive us because we're able to work with you from a start-up till you get to a large corporate, then we've transformed you, we're able to leave what our vision and the mission is as a group. So we're working very closely with the foundation to ensure right levels of capacitation happens. So that when you become bankable then we hold your hand from there till you achieve your dream. Thanks, Sally.

I think Sally, what you're asking so we are saying our vision is an African vision. Ensuring nobody is left behind. And it cuts across all the sectors, agriculture, mining, energy, environment, SME so that we are covering community. It's not necessarily individuals. But why I like most is what Moses pointed out to you, we shouldn't be giving you products. We should be giving you solutions to your needs. So we want to lead, educate customers, not to come and ask for loans but to ask for solutions for the -- what they should be able to articulate most is what they want to achieve. What Moses said we have a destination. How are we getting there? Help me to get to these destinations. This is what I want to achieve. Because when they come to us for loan, they prescribe their own and yet, they are not experts in loans. But if they give us the program, then we'll be able to provide a specific solutions, and that is why the product house has become very, very powerful. The second one is test us with the experience. We longer want to be known as a bank, we want to say it is the total experience. It's product, it's channels, its systems, its governance, it's how we make you feel as a human being. It's your dignity, it's your honor and the opportunities we are partnering to open for you. Every day living to the purpose of Equity, giving dignity, chasing life and expanding opportunity for wealth creation, that is what we want to hold ourselves to. And as Moses said, we are an inclusive bank. I believe the most inclusive bank in the world. What it means is that we acquire at the bottom, at the micro level, and then graduate people to -- from micro to small to medium to large and to corporate. And we are very proud the journey we have walked particularly with Kenya. And that is why as they grow, that's the only way we can grow. Equity doesn't grow. The numbers we are talking about 2 trillion is not Equity. It's the aggregate of what customers have achieved. The bigger the customer, the bigger we shall be. There is a perfect alignment, and that is why beyond that dream, we think what can we do to capacitate and list everybody particularly the start-ups. And maybe we are doing that a lot from the foundation and from sustainability. So a few words. And then I hope [ Oscar ] you also have your mic, what are you doing for small businesses for sustainability. [ Joanne ] go first.

Okay. Thank you. So on the foundation, then we are working closely with the start-up and supporting them to graduate as has been indicated, ours input is largely around knowledge and capacity enhancement, then linking them to the right tools that they would require at whatever level or whatever sector in which they are playing. So one of the additional things that we've done as far as that goes beyond the customer MSMEs that we had, we realized again the young people have a very heavy leaning towards technology and innovation. So we launched a program last year to also see how we can reach that capacity building towards establishing MSMEs for young people that are focused towards second innovation. So we set up a second innovation hub at [indiscernible] boost upskilling in whichever sectors they are focused in, whichever sector they are trained in at university and then be able to link them with whatever financing tools they require to be able to start businesses should they require to.

And then there is our big program, Young Africa Works how do we get those startups to function. And we provide them with financial literacy and entrepreneurial training, and we also provide them with guarantees because they don't have credit. So we've partnered with Africa Guarantee Fund, we have guaranteed with IFC such that those without the credit, it is just a small amount for guarantee. So everybody now can access credit. But the most important thing is to derisk them and to capacitate them so as to be able to get and you do that with group training and delisting them through guarantees so that nobody is being left behind. [indiscernible] yes what are you doing to make this a sustainable journey?

Thank you. So just to add to that, the next stage really after we've capacitated and worked with the start-ups, if collecting them to other stakeholders within the ecosystem, the accelerators, startup incubators that can provide access to other types of capital as well, private equity, et cetera. But then also connect them to other businesses across the continent. So we're working with UNDP, for example, with a program that they have across different accelerators in the continent, and to see how we can plug in and help to support those start-ups, particularly in the technology space. But then increasingly, in some of the other spaces that impact very young people of the country are along the creative sector, the sports ecosystem as well. So we're looking at those sectors as well. and then helping them to drive include sustainability within our product offering so that the work that they're doing, the infrastructure they're trying to build is build with an end to ensuring that there's a low carbon footprint that is environmentally cognizant of what needs to be done to ensure that it's all sustainable. So there's multiple levers we are doing also from a funding perspective.

I think the biggest I've seen him do is start-ups in Agribusiness because we are seeing a lot of young people going to innovate in agriculture. And last year, we were named the bank with the highest number of loans for mitigation and adaptation to climate change. So how do you ensure micro small of start-ups in agriculture provide the shock of climate change. And so we have these huge capability of mitigation and adaptation loans. I think [indiscernible] was talked about. We have put 415 of faster [indiscernible] students, 84 -- told they work together and said, can you create silicon valley for us. That's the team that has been set to be in capital city and their patrons have obtained an expat from Silicon Valley. Why don't you take a little bit of mic and tell may be Sally what you are doing? Journey is another graduate of Stanford University in Silicon Valley and a master's degree from Harvard University. This is the brightest of the brightest brains in Africa. I want them to succeed the way the Silicon Valley succeeded. Where are you in succeeding?

Thank you for the question. We are very happy to share that the young folks who've been upskilled at [indiscernible] city have joined the group and are very busy internally working on solutions. I love what Moses said because [indiscernible] in that program, the innovation program, it's a sandbox environment, and it's a solution center. It's where people bring problems and it's where young people actually develop solutions and then we invite the rest of the group to help develop products around those and bring those to market. So we're advanced with that initial cohort, and we're looking forward to launching a 2025 program very soon.

We don't want just a business to be [indiscernible] we want our start-ups to be in the technology innovation space. And the team that I talked of 24 that is in India is looking at how we can create a digital public infrastructure for these young people so that we can play in an innovation center where the cost of infrastructure is put up for them and hopefully, that is how we create Africa's Unicorn. I have no doubt. In just a short period of 1 year, they have been able to create 45 IPs solving our problem. So as they mature, and we expose them globally, I have no doubt they would provide robust solution. [indiscernible] and then I hope [indiscernible], you've also got a mic.

Thank you, James. I think I've been requested to talk about customer centricity and customer experience. And I would like to say that customer centricity is actually a core part of our corporate philosophy and our culture. And that is a strategic customer we have at all levels of our organization with the induction of ongoing business discussions. But I think what's important is the fact that we now have devoted structure the way [indiscernible] collecting customer insights, but also reacting to them. And that's why at every brand we have and every organization...

I think the question was on people. How do you create [indiscernible] people doing the right thing? The 3 things, right? Without being -- it was about culture.

Do the right thing at the right time. Do not be complex, that's number 2. Number 3 is stronger [indiscernible]

So it's about culture, yes.

So as part of that culture to embed it, number one, we put it in a structure to within the way we track performance. So the extent that every employee today has a key performance indicator to articulate how they contribute to customers' centricity and how that culture of customer experience is embedded in what they do every day. So every employees are holding themselves accountable for improving customer experience in whatever they do.

There's quite a lot of going to that catch-up so that people believe in our philosophy, our ethos and corporate philosophy such that they are not just on the board. You can see the core values there. You can see our [indiscernible]. We don't want them to be on the walls. We want to be -- them to be in the minds and hearts of our employees. And so we are doing that through a [indiscernible] also performance management so that as you rightly said we concentrate people with a [indiscernible] dashboard. This is what your performance should look like. This is how it should look like and we have no challenge with the separation if it's necessary because you can only invest so much. It must be in the person's mind so accountability for leadership and governance.

Thank you, James. In terms of doing the right to the right time, I think we are also looking at it from a governance level, and this is really cascaded rate from the Board with the responsibility that we've been handed over, where we are not only looking at what [indiscernible] performance. We're also holding accountable all leaders, including the MD starting from the MD position. So gone are the days where we will go for the [indiscernible] all this has to start from the top. It is a problem down, definitely must have started from the top and we cascade. So that is really an area we are looking at. Culture, as has been said, again, is I think we are rebuilding. More people to leave it daily not necessarily just it's been a separate matter. It's our work operation, and that will go in, [indiscernible] the customers, we get to feel what is the Equity cash, what is the Equity [indiscernible] the way that we listen to customers and it's starting from us creating an environment within the organization. So definitely providing employees, everybody all staff the right tools that they need to perform and the right skill set upskilling them as well on a constant and also have regular engagement. Because as a listening caring partner, we are not only listening to our stakeholders out there, also want to be able to listen to the staff that are in here because they're also in the marketplace to bring us the information. So to create an environment for them to be able to then so that we are able to do the right thing right time and not be complacent.

So it's the Equity [indiscernible]. Allow me to invite the Chairman, I'm so glad that we added with the question about from a shareholder and what they would like to do, maybe that is above my pay grade. The only person who can assure shareholders is the Chairman of the Board, Professor [indiscernible].

Good morning, investors. Senior management and our customers. Thank you very much, James. The day of releasing financial results is the day for management to shine. The day for the board is the day of the AGM, but there is always the intersection between management and the board. And we've had the last question that has been built is refers to governance. And governance is at the center of the growth of Equity. And we recognize that governance is very, very important. Many organizations have grown and [indiscernible] down because they didn't take care of their governance structure. I must say that at Equity, we have realized the importance and the [indiscernible] of having a very strong corporate governance structure. I want to assure investors, our customers and also [indiscernible] that we have put a lot of thought into structuring governance structures that also take care of succession. I know within Equity and outside succession planning has been a very pertinent issue that has been raised. We've shown that as the organization has grown and the Board has realized that we must create a fee for purpose organization. We've gone all over the world to recruit talent that will take us to the next level. As you have seen today, when talking about the strategy team, I think only one person is more than 3 years. It's not that we didn't have a strategy team. But we realized when we developed the Africa Recovery and Resilient strategic plan up to 2030, that we needed to boost what we had in [indiscernible]. The Board has not spared any efforts, has not spared any resources for us to get the best in class for every department in the bank. As we have developed management, the Board has also gone out of its way to make sure that both our group boards and our subsidiary boards are also up to the task. You can't have very highly skewed, very highly exposed management teams, both at the group and the subsidiaries. And then you have board members who are not as skewed all as exposed because they are supposed to oversize these very highly skewed management teams. So if you look today, look at our group boards, you'll find that almost half of our board members have been recruited globally. From all over the world, they have been recruited for their SKUs. They have been recruited for their exposure, and they bring that global view and outlook. They bring that group so that they can challenge our management teams to think not only globally, but also to be futuristic because we are an organization that is growing. When you look at the demographics of our customers, the demographics have greatly changed. The requirements of our customers changing constantly. We have realized that at the intersection between our customers and the bank, we are there, and we are not just providing banking services. We are enabling lifestyles. So we have to think different for us to be able to enable lifestyles. Remember, these are people who want to consume our products 24/7. They want to make sure that where they are, wherever they are, there is no geographical restriction. There is no time restriction. And that is why, again, we have also invested huge amounts of money in making sure that our systems are not only stable, they are reliable, and they are very efficient. So I want to assure our investors, and we are very grateful for the loyalty of our investors our investors have really stuck with us. When you talk about our dividend policy and the questions that are raised and I do understand as an investor also that I want to get much more dividend. But then there is always a question that sometimes you have to have some delayed gratification so that tomorrow also, you will get gratified. If you note that our expansion in the region, you will find that this has been funded from internally generated funds. We have bought -- we have acquired some assets like we acquired in Rwanda recently. We did not borrow money for that acquisition. We use our retained earnings. We used our internally generated funds. What I mean is our investments today will enable us to continue back to 50% dividend even for years to come. And we all look forward to continuously increasing our dividends. We cannot be as a Board, be reckless to give everything and then we have nothing to grow. Those of you who have been invested in Equity, we remember the time during COVID when we held the dividend and that was the best decision we made. If you look at the growth chart, if you look at our asset base, it doubled at the same of such difficult economic times. And it was just based on the decisions that the Board and management have made that this is not the right time. It is the right to conserve capital to make sure that when COVID ends, we have the resources to take advantage of the opportunities that arose. So I just want to assure you that the board both at the group level and other subsidiaries on top of that. And what the management has promised you today in terms of their outlook for 2025, the board takes that very seriously. And we use it as a scorecard every quarter to ask them, you promised investors and our customers this. You promised our customers that they will be able to have a system that is stable, they will be able to transact at all times. You promise them that you are going to be customer-centric. Show us how you have worked towards achieving that objective. We will ask you -- promise our shareholders that you are going to cut down costs and you are going to increase the revenue. What steps are you taking? So I want to assure you that the group would seize all the -- because we represent you as shareholders to [indiscernible] management and to hold management accountable for what they have promised. And I want to promise on the behalf of our board that our boards are [indiscernible] when you get and when we publish our integrated report for 2024, I want you to take time and go through the profiles of not only our management, but also our Board members across all subsidiaries, and you get very surprised at the talent that we have been able to attract. I thank you for coming out today, and thank you for continued support of our organization and the fund that you have all bought into our dream and our purpose and we promise that we shall keep to that purpose. Thank you very much, and God bless you.

Thank you. That's our [indiscernible] Chairman once again. Thank you. As we come to the end of the investor briefing, I want to request [indiscernible] to come and close for us with [indiscernible] thank the lord for the year that has been and also position us for the year that to be, and then we'll do the Equity anthem.

Thank you very much. Shall we pray? Almighty God, our [indiscernible] in humility and thanksgiving, we come to you. Lord we thank you for every victory, lessons and the challenges that we are able to overcome last year. Want to pray for the investors, the shareholders, pray for the customers, the employees and even the partners who have done it with us this far. Heavenly father, we continue to champion the socioeconomic transformation of Africa. As we empower consumers, businesses and even communities, we pray for your divine guidance. We commit our plans for the year 2025. Praying the lord, you shall open those of opportunities. I pray for divine favor, alignment and success in the market. We committed our Board before you pay for the senior executive members and management, praying for all leaders at all levels, Lord shall give the spirit of evaluation, wisdom and [indiscernible] to be able to make the right decisions, give us clarity of vision and purpose. We pray further for strength and health but we may be able to lead and even to execute to the glory of your name. As we continue Lord, we pray that you guide our steps [indiscernible] level every mountain, fill every worry, remove every obstacles before us, Oh god, grant us success in all our endeavors. Lord just as you parted the Red sea, our prayer this morning is that you shall part the seas of impossibilities in our lives and even in our plans. Heavenly Father as we leave, we pray that your peace would be upon all of us and that your presence will accompany us in all our decisions and in all our endeavors. Father, may your name be glorified. Blessed be your name, and we pray the Lord continue to watch over us. And as we live now be with us. For this, we pray in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.