GTPL Hathway Limited (GTPL) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Q3 and 9 months FY 2022 Earnings Conference Call of GTPL Hathway, hosted by Emkay Global Financial Services. We have with us today Mr. Anirudhsinh Jadeja, Promoter and Managing Director; Mr. Rajan Gupta, Chairman and non-Executive Director; Mr. Piyush Pankaj, Business Head, CATV and Chief Strategy Officer; and Mr. Anil Bothra, Chief Financial Officer. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Naval Seth from Emkay Global Financial Services. Thank you. And over to you, Mr. Seth.

Thank you, Nirav. Good evening, everyone. I would like to welcome the management and thank them for this opportunity. I shall now hand over the call to the management for their opening remarks. Over to you, Anu-bhai, for your opening remarks.

Thank you, Naval. Good evening, everyone. Warm welcome to all of you to the conference call of GTPL Hathway Limited to discuss the financial and operational performance of quarter 3 and 9-month FY 2022. The highlights of 9-month FY 2022 performance was CATV business expansion in new state, coupled with robust subscriber addition and subscription revenue for broadband business. On the broadband side, the company is expanding in Gujarat and is penetrating other states through business partner. GTPL Hathway added 130,000 net broadband subscriber in 9-month FY 2022. The company adhered to follow its strategic road map by offering a value proportion to its esteemed consumer and constantly enrich their experience. With that, I hand over to Mr. Piyush Pankaj, who can take you through the business and financial aspect of the company.

Thank you, Mr. Jadeja. Good evening, everyone. I hope all of you are safe and healthy. As you are aware, GTPL is one of the few consistently profit-making cable TV and broadband company in India. I'm happy to share with you that GTPL Hathway has become the #1 MSO as per TRAI's latest report. In the last 5 years, our CATV subscriber base has grown sharply by 1.6x to 7.5 million. Our broadband subscriber base has grown by 3.5x to around 0.76 million with an addition of 130,000 net subscribers in 9 months FY '22. We are the #1 private wireline broadband player in Gujarat. We have been consistently generating free cash flow and are a net debt-free company since FY '21. GTPL has consistently rewarding its shareholders with regular dividends. Additionally, GTPL has accredited with excellence in financial transformation by Kamikaze during 9 months FY '22. Let me now share the performance highlights for 9 months and quarter 3 FY '22. In the CATV segment, our active subscribers stood at 8.2 million as on December 31. GTPL's digital CATV services reached 1,100-plus towns, spread across 17 states of India. The company is expanding aggressively in Maharashtra, Andhra Pradesh, Telangana, Tamil Nadu and the Northeastern states. Of the 300 million-plus households in India, only 210 million TV households, that is translating to 70% penetration only, thus the CATV industry offers an underlying growth opportunity for an organized and seasoned player like GTPL Hathway. Our CATV business expansion will gain momentum with organic and inorganic growth in the coming quarters. The Indian wireline broadband sector is a sunrise industry with huge untapped growth potential. It accounts for mega 6% penetration of the total households in India. The India broadband market is anticipated to move towards the road of expansion and growth in the upcoming years due to the change in preference pattern of consumers regarding Internet consumption in India, increasing applications of Internet and communication services, bundled Internet plans, and increasing connectivity in urban and rural areas of India are expected to further drive the wired broadband market in India. In the broadband sector, we added 530,000 new home-pass in 9 months FY '22, taking the total home-pass as on December 31, 2021, to 4.40 million. During the period, GTPL added 130,000 net broadband subscribers, taking the total net broadband subscribers as on December 31, 2021, to 765,000. The broadband ARPU for 9-month FY '22 was maintained at INR 445 per month. GTPL looks forward to expanding its broadband business by leveraging its existing base of 10-plus million CATV subscribers and attracting new broadband subscribers through business partners. Let us now move to our financial performance. On our consolidated business expansion business, excluding EPC contract, during quarter 3 FY '22, GTPL's consolidated revenue grew by 9% Y-o-Y to INR 6,110 million. The CATV subscription revenue stood at INR 2,702 million. The broadband revenue for the quarter surged by 35% Y-o-Y to INR 1,054 million, led by healthy subscriber additions due to the adoption of e-learning and work from home. EBITDA for quarter increased by 3% Y-o-Y to INR 1,472 million, with a margin of 24.1%. On our consolidated business, including EPC contract, during quarter 3 FY '22, GTPL's consolidated revenue stood at INR 6,130 million. EBITDA for the quarter stood at INR 1,473 million, with a margin of 24%. PAT for the quarter stood at INR 546 million, up 21% Y-o-Y. Our EPC contract during quarter 3 FY '22 reported the revenue, EBITDA and profit before tax of INR 19 million, INR 1 million and INR 1 million, respectively. On our stand-alone business, excluding EPC contract, during quarter 3 FY '22, the company's revenue grew by 6% Y-o-Y to INR 3,861 million, the company reported EBITDA of INR 852 million, with an EBITDA margin of 22.1%. On our stand-alone business, including EPC contract during quarter 3 FY '22, the company's revenue stood at INR 3,881 million. EBITDA during the quarter stood at INR 854 million, with an EBITDA margin of 22%. PAT during the quarter stood at INR 354 million, up 30% Y-o-Y. This is all from my side. Thank you, everyone, for your attention. We can now begin with the question-and-answer session.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Pratiksha Daftari from Aequitas Investments.

So my first question is, what is the home pass target that we are -- we have set for ourselves in FY '23, like in near future?

Pratiksha, as we are at 4.40 million right now, we are looking forward that by next year, we are going to cross somewhere around 5.2 million to 5.3 million.

So we should be looking at some 25,000 around the range every quarter? Is that a fair way to look at it?

Yes, that's right.

Okay. And this year we've seen a slight -- this quarter we've seen a slight increase in ARPU on our broadband division. Any reason where we -- why we could increase our prices? And do we expect ARPU to increase going ahead?

Rajan sir, are you there?

Yes. So on ARPU, look, we have been maintaining that GTPL has a real edge, okay, in terms of the kind of market share in Gujarat market, the kind of growth in broadband numbers, keeping the ARPU very low and keeping EBITDA still in the range of 40% or so. Okay. So through sheer planned mix itself, there is a possibility for ARPU increase, okay, as our 100 MBPS plan starts getting more and more traction, which is where automatically you will see gradual increase in ARPU. However, current focus is frankly on ensuring 25% penetration is there in our broadband home pass. That's where customer acquisition is the biggest focus.

Okay. So this increase is purely attributable to planned mix?

Yes, please.

Right. And this -- so this quarter, we've seen some -- like our quarterly addition in subscribers now has started plateauing a bit. So are we seeing any significant change in the market? Or do we expect this kind of trajectory going ahead?

In the broadband side?

Yes, broadband addition -- subscriber additions each quarter.

Yes. So this quarter, as you know, that Diwali festival was there. And in Diwali festival, Gujarat gets affected for around 15 days. That's why you have seen that we have added around 30,000 net subscriber base. It should be somewhere between 40,000 to 45,000. Going ahead, we'll -- our projection is that we are going to maintain the quarterly 40,000 to 45,000 additions. And that's why we have given the projections that we will do at around 150,000 to 170,000 subscriber base additions in FY '23 also.

Understood. And sir, if you could just give the details of CapEx so far. And do we want -- are we maintaining our guidance of about INR 400 crores for the full year?

Yes. So till date, CapEx is INR 237 crores we have spent in 9 months' time, where the CATV CapEx is INR 111 crore and rest INR 126 crore is in the broadband. We are looking forward that this CapEx will be somewhere between INR 360 crore to INR 370 crore by next quarter on the projection. So yes, it will not reach INR 400 crores, somewhere around 8% to 10% down from INR 400 crores as we have lost first 6 months on the COVID that...

Right. And sir, last question from my side, on the cable TV front. We had -- we were facing certain issues with churn. And basically, the commercial subscribers coming back. So if you could just elaborate on that. And what is the strategy for subscriber addition on cable TV front?

Yes. So churn side, if I talk about, last quarter, we had seen that there is some arrest in the churn, which has started showing right now. Yes, commercial side, some subscriber base has come up. As we said in the beginning, we are maintaining that at around 7.5 lakh subscriber has gone away in the corporate side. And we have seen that only around 300,000 subscriber has came back. This quarter, we have seen that, again, 25,000 to -- or 30,000 subscribers from the corporate side has come back. But we are hoping that if the situation improves with the time and it becomes normalized, then at least we are going to get 50% back of whatever right now, 4.5 lakhs subscriber base of corporate has not come back. And overall, retail is coming. And we are continuing to add retail subscribers, which is giving us the impetus.

Okay. So sir, I think we started FY '22 with about 7.5 million subscribers, and that's where we stand today. So what is the medium-term target here?

So we are looking forward that by end of FY '23, if everything goes as it is going in this quarter, then we will -- somewhere we are going to have close to somewhere around 9 million by FY '23, the next 5 quarters.

The next question is from the line of Dixit Doshi from Whitestone Financial Advisors.

Some of my questions have already been answered. Sir, my first question is regarding our share with -- in the ARPU with MSO. So last quarter, you mentioned that it's been almost 2 years, and now we may start to increase our share with the MSO from Q4 onwards. So -- and there is a scope of almost 25% increase. So if you can elaborate on that, where we are standing now?

Yes, Dixit. We have the plan to increase our rates in the market. Actually, the plan was earlier that we will increase in the quarter 4. But as you know, that NTO 2 has been announced. And after that, we don't want to disturb the market twice. That's why we are waiting. The plan is already there to increase. We are waiting that what happens with the NTO 2, if NTO 2 is coming in the quarter 1 of FY '23, we will increase our prices with the change in the plans and all. Otherwise, we will take the call by end of this quarter, that if NTO is not coming, then we are going to increase the price in quarter 1 FY '23.

Okay. So you are saying, let's say, if the NTO 2 comes or don't come in Q1, we may start increasing from next year onwards, Q1 onwards?

Yes. That's right.

Okay. And will it be like a gradual, like we will increase 5%, 10% -- 5%, 5% every year? Or it will be like one go will from INR 120 to INR 140, INR 150 we can go?

No. It is going to be gradual.

Sometimes, it's through plan because of this package planning, maybe [Foreign Language].

Okay. But let's say, over 2, 3 years, it will -- it can go up to 20%, 25% gradually?

Gradually, yes. That's what our plan is, that we are going to take up from INR 122 to somewhere between INR 135 crores to INR 140. That's the plan which is there, and we will work on that.

Okay. And one more question. Recently, we have given the notice of GT -- we are acquiring some shares in GTPL vision service private limited. Something you have mentioned that it's a partial settlement of outstanding dues. So I mean, is it not -- was it not our subsidiary, and we had some dues and that company has defaulted? Is there anything like that?

No, no, no. It's not a default thing. It's a -- the discussion is that we are completely -- either we have to pay, either we have to do an outstanding settlement. So as -- like GTPL last [Foreign Language]. But somehow, strategically, call [Foreign Language]. So it's not -- it's because of this it's -- so the company is doing good and company is doing profit also.

Okay. Okay. Okay, sir. And lastly, can you give us the latest numbers for -- as on December 31, and breakup, if possible?

So for December 31, on a stand-alone basis, the debt stands at almost around INR 299 crores. And for consolidated, it stands at INR 315 crores. So if I -- it is the bifurcation of INR 315 crores, which are referring on a consolidated basis, the marketing and carriage receivables are INR 144 crores, subscriptions are INR 35 crores. EPC project is INR 97 crores. And some of the other which are not actually falling in about 3 categories, almost around INR 39 crores.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Shivam Saxena from ICICI Bank.

I just wanted to know that you are having a target of 40,000 to 45,000 additions. So is it -- in Q4, is it being getting disrupted because of this Omicron issue or the infection increasing? So are you seeing any trend that it is -- it will again fall, it will again decline? It will not be approved target in this Q4?

Right now, we have not seen that type of trend in -- mainly in Gujarat and the markets which we are operating. But Rajan sir?

No. Even last time also, the peak of pandemic, we have seen Gujarat market actually broadband numbers developed a lot. So we have, in fact, seen exponential growth. In fact, pandemic in markets like Gujarat and a few of the markets were the catalyst actually. Some of the better markets industry get affected, but Gujarat has seen a very good increase in numbers, specifically on the broadband side. As Piyush rightly mentioned, as of now, we don't have any negative information to share, and we are all quite optimistic.

Also, you are saying basically there no disruption. Like in second wave also, there was no disruption so this wave there was no disruption in revenues?

Yes. Essentially, as we keep on sharing, Gujarat is a market which has been starved of quality broadband service. And as our home pass is increasing, as our technology is getting upgraded, and pandemic kind of environment, of course, is further getting -- giving acceleration, is acting as a catalyst. So as on today, we don't see any concern there at all.

Okay. And another question is on the price hike. So right now, your focus is not on the ARPU, I understand. But with these telecom operators increasing prices in the prepaid tax, do you think it will shift -- give an upward boost to the broadband services also? The prices should increase in the fixed wireline also as in the prepaid segment. Don't you think so that you should take some cue?

No. As we were mentioning earlier, the current focus is on ensuring we reach 25% penetration to the home pass. But of course, over a longer period, directionally, what you mentioned is correct, as price per GB is increasing in mobility many of us are, of course, even paying 50% more now for higher-end data plans in mobility, wireline across hasn't seen any price increase, but we have, of course, scope considering the kind of pricing we have in Gujarat. But I think focus currently is on developing market because the data margins are already healthy and reaching 25% penetration, okay? But over a period of time, you're right, at least in metro markets or in the urban market, there is scope for further price increase.

Sir, just one question more, if you can answer that. If -- what is the price differential between you and your competitors in Gujarat? And any other region or is it higher? How much higher? If you can -- you might be aware of the plan. So just wanted to understand what is the differential that you are having?

No plans actually vary. As we have been earlier also saying, BSNL is one of the largest competitors, et cetera. But you can safely assume we have definitely kind of the best value for money package. I think off-line, you can take from Piyush detailed plans. But if you see overall value for money package, which means speed, GB and price and service, I think, clearly, we'll rank ourselves #1. At least by 20%, 25%, we kind of are better than any other nearest competition.

So you are higher by 25% as compared for the lowest package, you are saying INR 450 or...

We are saying...

As I said, the value for money offering what we are giving to consumers, we are definitely better by 20%, 25%. And value for money...

So you are saying you are lower. You are lower as compared to the competitors? BSNL.

No, no. So what I said was the value for money, for speed, GB and pricing, as well technology and service that we're giving, my assessment is we are definitely 25% better than anyone else. But exact pricing, you can take it off-line from Piyush.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Saptarshee Chatterjee from Centrum Portfolio Management.

Sir, actually, we just wanted to know that you have talked about this. You are approaching other states, apart from Gujarat, for broadband, and we are going through a partnership model. Sir, if you can talk about like slightly elaborately, like how many LCOs you have been interacted and how many we have already got in our platforms. And how the revenue sharing and both investments happen with this partnership model?

So I'm -- actually, the rollout [Foreign Language]. But yes, response is coming very good.

Okay. And just want to understand that last for 4, 5, 6 quarters also, like we are adding between 40,000 and 50,000 subscribers in the broadband. So now when you are opening up for new states, should we not target slightly higher number in terms of subscriber addition?

So that is the -- through partners, yes, it is a different target. I'm talking about directly that this is -- the number is what Piyush is saying, directly B2C customers, majorly in the Gujarat side. So this is the number what we are saying, 40,000 to 45,000, majorly B2C customers, broadband sites. And major part is in Gujarat. So broadband through partners, we will give you the numbers now in the next call that what are the projections from that business.

Understood. Great, great. And I think there was one news about our tie-up with Aprecomm for AI models under, I think, service quality of the government. So how meaningful is this, sir?

Rajan, sir?

No. Aprecomm essentially is a service provider, which help us remotely manage consumer premises device, okay? Which essentially means it can help us kind of remotely handle either a lot of complaint issues of customer or help us delight customer. Just for sake of -- I mean, it's too complex a topic to explain in this call. But just an example, I can explain one thing. WiFi speed in your house also depends upon how is the WiFi -- what setting WiFi is there in all your neighbors, okay? So many times remotely, we have to change your WiFi settings, which is where these kind of devices help, okay? So essentially, even sitting at the north, one can monitor all the devices at a telco grade, okay? And one can make a lot of changes to make sure customer delight is there. So it's meaningful in the sense that post-pandemic, we have seen customers are more and more particular about speed. They're particular that they need to get -- if it's 100 MBPS plan, they need to get at least 80 MBPS even on a WiFi, and which is where remotely handling their issues can add to the customer delight, which is where we believe it's a meaningful alliance.

Understood. Very good, very good. And just last question is about this I think in -- around December, we have interacted on these DoT and AGR issues. And anything we have heard on this? Any development on this part, sir?

[Foreign Language]

Sir, most probably maybe by end of next quarter, we would get to know something on this?

Yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Bhupendra Tiwary from ICICI Direct.

My first question is on the hybrid box thing how worth it if that has uptake and the pandemic increases third wave and all those things has kind of slowed down this overall plan that we had or overall product that we had on this regard?

Bhupendra, we have already launched our hybrid box. We wanted to do the biggest splash on the PR side and all, and it was planned in this week only, last week, but we had to avert it because of the COVID. As the COVID will take control, we are going to do a big splash on the media, that's on the boxes -- on the launch of the boxes and all. But the box has already started going into the market. And right now, the response is very good. We have started from the Gujarat market right now. And then we'll start the Andhra Pradesh, Telangana and Maharashtra, these 3 targets. And then we will go into the Northeast. So that's the plan right now, and the responses are very good.

I mean, if you could just elaborate on your further plan on what is your overall target over the next 2, 3 years and just how much...

Bhupendra, sorry, but your voice is breaking. [Operator Instructions]

Okay. Hello. Is it better?

Yes, sir.

Yes. So I just wanted to know that -- do you have any 2, 3 years kind of a plan on how much conversion do you think can happen and resultant ARPU increase that might -- or profitability increase, whatever way you want to kind of put it at your end, from this hybrid thing? And second is your CapEx plan for FY '23, I understand broadband will have a higher role going ahead also. But you said that we're expanding into newer states also. So how would that look like?

Yes. Yes, Bhupendra, see, hybrid box, we have launched, and we have launched CATV plus TVs OTT plus broadband bundling plus the combinations of OLT type, whether it is broadband plus OTT, whether it is CATV plus OTT, all type of pricings are there. And I will say that the details of that projections and all, I can share one by one if required, right now, not on this call. But yes, response is very good. And we are looking forward that we'll go with the media splash also in very short time. On the CapEx side, as I have said that the total CapEx, which was at INR 237 crores right now in 9-month, where broadband is INR 125 crores and CATV is INR 111 crores. And this quarter, we are looking forward that we will be between INR 100 crores to INR 120 crores more of the CapEx. So the total CapEx will be somewhere between INR 260 crores to INR 270 crores for the whole year. And so yes, broadband CapEx is going to be higher than the CATV CapEx.

No. I was talking about FY '23, sir. Any which ways, if you guys have actually planned about or thought about it, so that's it.

FY '23 also, we are keeping the same CapEx plan of INR 400 crores. And the split is that somewhere around INR 225 crores to INR 230 crores will be in the broadband. The rest is going to be on the kind of CATV side.

The next question is from the line of Vinit Manek from Karma Capital Advisors.

Actually, all my questions have been answered.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Anil from Centrum Asset Management.

I wanted to focus on 2 aspects. One was, once the hybrid box is commonly launched, what kind of subscriber additions on the CATV side are we anticipating? That is part 1. Part 2 is more about the broadband itself, independent of the hybrid box, just the broadband subscriber additions. So given our spread, given our size, I would imagine -- I mean we have 7.5 million I mean, subscribers. So is -- I mean, why are we not moving faster on the broadband side, given that cross-selling opportunity exists for us, and yet we are aiming for 40,000, 45,000 per quarter, whereas some of the bigger telcos are adding one more 0 next to it every quarter. So why is it that despite having this partner network, despite having this cross-selling opportunity, our broadband expansion is moving at the speed at which you are indicating?

Anil, on the first question, on the hybrid, as we have just launched, it's -- we have started giving the boxes formally from January 2, January 3, I can say. Second was Sunday, and 3rd, we have started on the market. Right now, we have launched it in the Gujarat. And the consumption is good. Whatever boxes we have sent in last 2 weeks already has been consumed and already we are going into the consumer places. But yes, give us time till January end, I will say, or February start that we can start giving you how much boxes are getting -- going into the market and what are the numbers which is coming. So that's what I will say for the hybrid, it's early days to give you any exact numbers or any predictions on that. So that's why I asked that we talk one to one with earlier participant also. #2, broadband to partner sites. Anil-ji basically, we started just in November, December. So the response is coming all states wherever the GTPL's penetration is there in its cable TV side. So exact numbers, yes, as you say, [Foreign Language] So in quarter 4, we'll tell you how numbers -- except this 40,000 or 45,000 that broadband to partners [Foreign Language] that we will let you know in quarter 4.

[Foreign Language] so...

Anil-ji, yes, absolutely right. But we started in November. [Foreign Language]

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of [ Kritika Jain from Sequent Investment ].

Sir, are we screening any M&A opportunity in the CATV space?

M&A, yes, so yes, as I always saying and given my statements also, that we are looking forward for CATV expansion through organic and inorganic growth. Some inorganic deals are already there on our table. We will start announcing that one by one as we are in the process of doing those. And we will start seeing it in the numbers also. So yes, we are doing the -- the consolidation opportunity is very big as -- in the CATV business, and we are looking forward to do those consolidations.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Saptarshee Chatterjee from Centrum Portfolio Management.

Sir, I just want to understand, one part is when on this partnership model, we are going on this broadband type. On the investment side, just want to understand, earlier, I think at some point, you touched upon that total investment for lying one home pass would have been somewhere around INR 4,000 to INR 4,500. If I'm correct? So -- but now when we are approaching in new states and building from scratch and everything, so does that investment change significantly? Or like how is that number in general?

We will give you all the information. Yes, you are right, that as we are going ahead with the partner, so the CapEx will be lower than what it is going for the direct customer, and as the CapEx will be shared between the partners and us. And one of the major thing is that the speed on which you can do, because already partners have this fiber reaching to the consumers. And we just have to upgrade that and reach to the consumer faster. So that is one of the reasons, that to reach faster to the consumer and use the already laid infrastructure, we are going ahead with the partner model. We will give you all the details of -- as you know, that we have launched, and already it's around 2.5 months now. So we'll give you all those details in quarter 4 or either one to one, I can provide you.

Okay, sir. And just lastly, on the cable TV side. So I think overall, in India, you have -- in your presentation, you have demonstrated that there's around 17 crores total paying subscribers in cable TV. Now in our major focuses like Maharashtra, Andhra Pradesh, Telangana, Tamil Nadu, Northeast these regions where you're focusing. What would be the total size of these subscribers? And which are the low-hanging fruits? Like which are the major subscribers that we may actually capture?

You are talking about TV households? 17 crores?

Yes. In the cable TV. So like from whom we are going to take share from? And what would be -- out of the 17 crore, what would be our size of these major 5, 6 states?

So if we talk about all over India, there are 300 million households. Out of that, 210 million households is TV households. Out of that, if we take out [indiscernible] which is around 40 million, that is the 170 -- around 170 million is the TV plus DTH household. Out of that, around 100 million is cable households and 70 million is the DTH households. On that 100 million, if they talk about organized there, they have around 40 million. 60 million is there, which is the low-hanging fruit for the consolidation. That's one. And second is the competition there is 70 million, which you can win back as we have the -- you can say now you have the equal opportunity to get to those customers. So that's the target on that way. If we talk about the states, I have already given that we are growing aggressively in Maharashtra, Andhra, Telangana, Rajasthan and Northeast markets and Tamil Nadu. These are the states on which we are targeting to increase our sub base.

Understood. And any broad ballpark figure of out of this total 170 million, how much of this will be in our focused states?

I'll give you that. That's a state-wise number. If I start giving you, it is going to be. But yes, if we talk about on that way, it's going to be somewhere around 120 million, which is coming into our states right now. 50 million is there on other states. But that's a ballpark figure I'm giving you. But exact numbers, I can give you later on.

The next question is from the line of [ Tushar ], individual investor.

Sir, one question on the guidance, if you can provide for the existing year fiscal. Like what kind of top end we can expect? And also, with the which kind of expansion that we are planning in different phase are we giving any reachable target for next year and maybe after that?

Your voice is not very clear, [ Tushar ]. Can you repeat the question? Sorry.

Yes, sir. Are we giving any guidance for the sales growth for existing fiscal? And my second question is, with the expansion into different states, what kind of growth can we see in the coming years, maybe fiscal '23 or afterwards?

We are going to give you the exact projections of next year in the next call. But yes, on the wholesome, I will say that we are going to maintain our growth rate of revenue and EBITDA. And that's our target. And based on that. But yes, we're going to give you exact expansion plan and everything for the FY '23 in the next quarter call.

As there are no further questions, I will now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.

Thanks, everyone, for joining the earning call of GTPL Hathway for 9 months and quarter 3 FY '22. As the Omicron is back and the COVID situation is again back, I'm hopeful-- so we are hopeful that it will improve from this onwards as the numbers are coming down. Please be safe and healthy. And look forward to talk to you guys again in the quarter 4. Thank you. Thank you very much for your time.

Thank you, everyone.

Thank you very much. On behalf of Emkay Global Financial Services, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect your line. Thank you.