Indigrid Infrastructure Trust (540565) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to India Grid Trust Q1 FY '25 Conference Call hosted by Nuvama Institutional Equity. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Subhadip Mitra. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you.

Good evening, friends. On behalf of Nuvama Institutional Equities, welcome you all to the first quarter FY '25 Results Conference Call of India Grid Trust. We are joined today by the top management of the company, represented by Mr. Harsh Shah, CEO and Whole Time Director; Mr. Navin Sharma, Chief Financial Officer; Ms. Meghana Pandit, Chief Investment Officer; and Mr. Satish Talmale, Chief Operating Officer. I would now like to hand over the call to Harsh for his opening comments. Over to you.

Thank you, and thank you, everyone, for joining the first call for financial year 2025. I will follow the slide numbers and then refer [indiscernible] on the call and I'll then subsequently have the management team talk about the business. I'm on Slide #3 to reiterate -- our vision is to become the most admired yield vehicle in Asia, focused on -- focusing on the business model, value accretive growth, predictable distribution and optimal capital structure. On Slide #4, based on these 4 pillars, we have built a large portfolio, which has been spread across India, they are all put together INR 29,300 crores of AUM on 49 lines and 87 -- kilometers, 13 from substations encompassing 22,500 [ MUA ] more than 1 gigawatt capacity in solar and 400-megawatt hour of battery storage projects that we recently won. Our portfolio is unique, the transmission assets offering the perpetual contracts on solar side, still having a residual life of 190 years and a sizable amount of [indiscernible]. On Slide #6, where I'll take you through the quarters '24 and '25 highlights. The first one in the portfolio side we had signed the battery energy storage purchase agreement for 180 megawatt, 360-megawatt hour best project awarded by GUVNL in quarter 4, '24. This is significant because this is going to signify that the project is going to be built and each customer is ready to support that and the agreements are signed for it after the bid. On the financial side, this is a quarter in which we're seeing the full impact of acquisitions of Virescent and RSUPL, which we did last year. And therefore, on a quarter-on-quarter comparison, versus last year to this year we delivered a growth of 22.7% in revenue and 35.2% on EBITDA. On the AUM side, our AUM stands at INR 29,300 crores with net debt to AUM at 61.3%, which leaves sizable amount of headroom for us to grow. On the collection, we had a very good quarter. Typically, the quarter 1 is relatively weaker, but in transmission, we had 94% collection and in solar, we had 104% collection, which has resulted into a sizable amount of NDCF for this quarter as well. On the DPU, we have distributed the first INR 3.75 a unit DPU, which was as per our guidance of INR 15 a unit for this financial year, which is almost 78% higher than the quarter 1 of last year. So there is a significant amount of DPU growth that has been delivered for this year based on acquisitions and growth for last year. On operating side, our average quarterly availability is at 99.4% and solar CUF is maintained at 25.6%. On the next slide, I'll take you through Indian transmission sector opportunity landscape. We are very uniquely placed in the entire energy transition journey. Energy transition is absolutely critical and imperative for India, considering one, the climate goals that the country has undertaken and also energy securities, which allows India to be energy independent if the energy transition is done rightly by 2027. The goal of 500 gigawatt, which the government was put in by 2030, is certainly steep. But on the path of that goal, there is a significant amount of investment that is taking place in the areas in which we focus, which is solar, transmission lines, which will enable -- energy transition and battery energy storage, which will ensure the renewal energy can be deployed in non-natural resource available to us. With that, as you see on the slide, there is a rapid increase in power demand that is -- we are witnessing as a country, which the country is responding, they're putting in greater capacity addition, which is resulting into sizable amount of investment opportunity for us for transmission networks and growth. Also on the renewable energy side, the battery energy storage, the company is reaching grid parity levels is really putting a lot of wind -- in the wind to ensure that more and more utilities are coming with battery energy storage proposals and we do see this as a significant part of our transmission growth. On the Slide #8, as you can look at it, based on the tailwinds that we've seen in the sector, there is approximately INR 96,000 crores of transmission and BESS sector bids alone that we are witnessing over next year or 2, and this is to put things into perspective is, I would say, one of the highest level of bidding activity that we have seen in the last 10 years. In context in the last 10 years, pretty much total project size that was bidded out was in the range of INR 1 lakh to INR 1,25,000 crores. So we achieved that kind of activity coming to market in the next couple of years. So that's a significant opportunity for us to find growth opportunities. I would just take a pause of the summary, and I will take you through -- I will take my team through the quarterly performance. I will invite Satish, our Chief Operating Officer, to take you through our operating performance.

Thanks, Harsh, and good afternoon, everyone. I'm on Slide 9. I'm glad to share the operational performance for quarter 1. So we had 0 incident quarter in terms of safety. And as we continue our path on zero harm objective, on HSE matters. On performance, we achieved 99.4% as the overall portfolio availability. As you can see on the right side of the chart, there are 3 assets, which contributed this slight dip. I think 2 of which like JKTPL and Parbati, those are commercially indemnified because of Force Majeure event and line diversion event respectively. On [ ENICL ] we had conductor snap. And because of that availability is down, but I'm confident that over the year, we will get back to our target of 99.75%. On solar generation, we achieved 472.6 million unit, which is almost close to our plan at 25.6% CUF. On reliability, typically because of the change in climatic patterns, the natural events like lightning, thunderstorm increases. And this pattern we are seeing for last couple of years and is changing. And because of that, the number of trips have little gone up high, but we will kind of match up to our annual target of 0.18 throughout the year. Substation wise, I think it's pretty much lower compared to the benchmark that we have in the industry. On cybersecurity we like to share that for all our solar assets, which was recently acquired, we completed certification process for cybersecuity risk mitigation measures. That's it from my side, and I would hand over to Mr. Navin.

Thank you, Satish, and good evening, everyone. We are on Slide #10. Another strong quarter with consistent performance. We have recorded a revenue and EBITDA of INR 835 crores and INR 767 crores, respectively, which translates into 33% and 25% Y-o-Y growth. NDCF generated for the quarter was INR 313 crores, and Board has approved distribution of INR 3.75 per minute, which translates into DPU growth of 9% on Y-o-Y basis. Coming on to collections for the quarter. It stood at 94% and 104%, respectively, for transmission and solar business. For trailing 12 months, collection performance at entity level stood at more than 100% with both business segments having similar collection performance. The DSO as of 30th June stood at 51 and 45 days, respectively, for transmission and solar business. This reflects substantial improvement in DSO in both the business segments on Y-o-Y basis. Coming on to next slide, #11. DPU for the quarter is INR 3.75 per unit. It will be distributed in form of interest, dividend and capital repayment, which is INR 3.19, INR 0.21 and INR 0.35, respectively. The outstanding units at the end of the quarter is INR 78.37 crores and the gross distribution to all the unitholders comes to INR 294 crores. Record date for the distribution is July 30 and tentative date by the unitholders will receive a distribution is August 8. NAV as of June 30 stood at INR 143.98 per unit. During the quarter, as part of the standard process, the independent value reviewed competitive benchmarks for the valuation of transmission and solar business, to widen the index, they included power grid in the group of companies used for benchmarking. Consequently, the data was reduced, leading to a lower weighted leverage cost of capital and, therefore, a higher value of AUM. This has contributed to the increase in AUM and NAV during the quarter. For the quarter distribution, IndiGrid would have distributed INR 89.78 per unit with a total distribution of around INR 5,240 crores. On the right-hand side, we showcased the trend of distribution on year-on-year basis, which is stable and scalable growth of 6% over the years. We are on next slide, #12. This showcase a waterfall from our EBITDA to NDCF generation and distribution. At an SPV level, we have a consolidated EBITDA of INR 770 crores. Net of the finance income, working capital movement, CapEx and tax at SPV level. NDCF generated at SPV comes to INR 725 crores. The net of the trust level expenses, finance costs, DSRA, working capital movement, tax and debt repayment, we have generated NDCF of INR 313 crores. In Q1 FY '25, we have added INR 19 crores to our reserves and closing results stands at INR 483 crores, which is in excess of 1 quarter's DPU basis current guidance. So that's all from my side. I hand over to Meghana to take on subsequent slides. Over to you, Meghana.

Thanks, Navin. Good evening, everyone. I'm on Slide #13, which reflects the position on the balance sheet. We continue to remain AAA rated by all the 3 rating agencies. Our average cost of debt for the quarter ended was about 7.74%. The cash balance was at around INR 25.54 billion, of this, almost INR 10 billion of debt was raised in June and which was already utilized for debt repayment in July, because of which you are seeing slightly higher number on the cash balance. The fixed rate borrowings continue to be almost 3/4 of the borrowing book. The leverage ratio reflected through net debt to AUM is about 61-odd percent and a very healthy EBITDA to interest coverage of 2.03x. The gross borrowing is about INR 203 billion, which is split 50-50 between NCDs and bank loans. And both sets of NCDs and bank loans are diversified through various investors, including mutual funds, insurance companies, PSU plus private sector banks. At the bottom of the slide, you can see the repayment schedule, which, again, we have ensured that there is no bunching up of maturities happening. And in no single year is the refinancing going about 12% to 13% of the gross borrowing, which is what we have been communicating all throughout. So overall, a well diversified and termed-out borrowing profile, which continues for the quarter as well. Going to Slide #14. In terms of our total returns reflected from the distribution, which is the dark blue part and the price change. So the total returns on an absolute basis clocked is about 125% since the time we got listed in 2017 as reflected in an annualized return of about 12% compared to all pure-play debt instruments and pure-play equity, if I look at the risk-adjusted total return risk being reflected by EBITDA and IndiGrid beta being very close to 0.08, you can see that IndiGrid continues to outperform all the other indices on a risk-adjusted basis. Coming to Slide #15 in terms of the business outlook that we are looking at. From a portfolio strategy perspective, we continue to focus on ensuring that the operations remain stable and we are able to provide for predictable and sustainable distribution and at the same time, looking at value-accretive acquisitions, which we have been doing. On the greenfield side, as you all know, we have 1, 3 transmission projects plus certain augmentation works in our existing projects. So a smooth execution on those projects continue to be our focus. In addition to that, the 2 battery energy storage projects, which also we have done in the last quarter, those remain on stream and in the right, we are looking to execute that. Apparently, we are also exploring partnership opportunities for these greenfield projects to ensure how we will be able to minimize risk and at the same time, achieve scale. Of course, start participating in other greenfield bidding opportunities, which we have seen in terms of the tremendous transmission bids coming up continues to be an area of focus, both on the debt side as well as transmission side. Also look at delivering DPU guidance of INR 15 for FY '25. On the balance sheet side, like always, we will focus on ensuring that as and when there are refinancing opportunities or opportunities for acquisition, how we are able to optimize the interest cost and elongate tenures and at the same time, consciously manage the leverage ratio to ensure that enough headroom is available for growth purposes. Asset management continues to be a very important area by ensuring we maintain 99.5% availability across the portfolio. Looking at self-reliant O&M practices, which we have imbibed across the portfolio and continue to optimize on the digital tools, which will help us on analytics and decision making. EHS, ESG, again goes hand in hand with the asset management practices, and we are increasing our focus areas on this. Industries stewardship again remains an area of focus in terms of figuring out what more private sector participation can happen in the electricity sector, both on the greenfield side as well as on the national monetization pipeline. And parallelly, specifically for InvIT, how do we increase awareness and investor education again remains an area of focus. Moving on to Slide 16. This basically showcases how on the back of value-accretive acquisitions, which we have been doing since the time we got listed has enabled us to consistently increase the VP and also increase the longevity of the DPU. So the various color graph that you see reflects the acquisitions that we have done over the last 6, 7 years, and on the back of these acquisitions, how we have increased the DPU and you can see the DPU longevity, how that has extended on the back of these acquisitions and the growth on DPU that we have provided for. I will take a pause here and leave the room open for Q&A now. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Ravish Chandra, an Individual Investor.

Yes. Good evening Mr. Harsh and team, congratulations for the excellent revenue, P&L and DPU increase. In fact, I'm observing from INR 11.75, INR 12 to INR 15 it's a good achievement, congrats. And also, I think the management team has purchased the units very recently in this quarter, it's actually excellent for the investors confidence we are getting a lot on this handle. But my question is, it's maybe a repetition in every reason. Now we have AUM of around INR 29,000 crores, so potential is very high, INR 96,000 crores in 2, 3 years. So we have headroom only to go up to 70% debt. Right now, we are at 61%. So if you have a huge effect in the bidding process, if you get, then immediately we now have to do something like a rights issue or something like that, Harsha, how we can worst situation. And second point, recently, Finance Minister told that asset demonetization will not be only selling, I think it looks like that last year, we had a discussion that the asset sale might not happen, asset lease might be there in the pipeline. Is it true? Any thoughts on that.

Thank you, Ravishji. I think to answer your first question. You're right. There is a significant size asset that we are looking to acquire we need further capital issue. However, that number is in the tune of INR 7,000 crores, INR 8,000 crores. So I think we don't foresee any one acquisition of INR 8,000 crores in the near future, which can really necessitate the need to raise capital. We are looking at several growth opportunities, but one of that to the size of the tune of INR 8,000 crores, which is a capital at which we would need to look to raise capital. Having said so, we have raised capital in the past when rights issue, preference issues, QIP a variety of methods. And our unitholders like yourself have been kind enough to support us in different capital raise processes. [indiscernible] and I hope we do get opportunities of INR 8,000 crores and more. We would come back to market where we have to, and that will be a good scenario as we grow further. On your next question on monetization, I think in general, governments monetization program has been on and off with mixed reactions from several quarters. And certainly, on transmission side, it's been I would say, lukewarm to say the best. And there are structural issues with respect to that. Having such a risk the government already has published a policy of monetizing transmission assets and lease bond. We will be keen to participate on that. So as and when that takes place, we would really look forward to participate. However, the timing of it will remain in the hands of the government.

The next question is from the line of Pradyumna Choudhary from JM Financial.

Pardon if some of my questions are a bit basic, I'm a bit new to the company. So my first question is regarding the assets that we've been acquiring lately. So you've been acquiring solar assets and now embarking on greenfield BESS projects as well as transmission assets. So this is while we talk about a huge transmission opportunity. So when do we see this acquisition pipeline come on stream for us to be able to acquire some of the already operating transition aspect.

Great. So I think there are -- I would answer this in 2 parts. One, transmission projects typically have a life cycle rather the construction cycle of 24 to 36 months. And usually, the monetization takes place 6 to 12 months after that. So it's like a 3-year cycle. So that's all the pipeline that gets bidded out eventually, if it is to players and developers who want to monetize come to market about 3, 3.5 years from the date of the bid. Having said so, as you can see in the outlook slide, which Meghana described, and also we have been acting on it. We are bidding for transmission assets on our own, which means that we don't need to depend on the scale of transmission line because we control the quality, we control the returns, and we build on the asset upfront. Having said so, we have limited capital that we can deploy on the under construction side. And therefore, we are also exploring partnership opportunities at the development projects, which minimizes the risk at IndiGrid because we are sharing the risk capital with other investors. And we've been able to do much larger and more projects, right? So we would look to participate on transmission side, on greenfield on our own in terms of ensuring that we get the assets after completion. However, we are mindful of the fact that there is going to be limited capital that we can deploy on the development side, we would look to partner with developers who would partner with us at development stage and provide a risk capital. And after completing, we will buy those projects and add to our pipeline. So it depends on what is going to be our success in the bidding and eventually execution, that will define how much of the pipeline. But in either of the cases, the pipeline that we are seeing today of around [indiscernible] takes bid to bid and bid in and bid out around a year, year and half and then subsequently around 3 years to monetize. So I would say it will start giving in sizable amount of results in anywhere from 3 to 4 years.

Okay. So now, at least in terms of transmission assets, getting into our operational portfolio could be a little [indiscernible], right?

Depends. See we already have around INR 2,000 crores of assets that we are already building, right? That may come in next -- actually, that will come in the next 12 to 18 months to fruition. So we'll start generating EBITDA. Those projects we already won last year, right? So they will start generating in next 1 year and start hitting our NDCF line. And also, there are projects, which are bidded out earlier, which may come for monetization, but we don't control the time for it, right? And therefore, it's difficult to guide. But we ourselves already have around INR 2,000 crores of assets, which we are executing right now, which will come for us soon in the [indiscernible].

Understood. And secondly on the solar asset side, I just wanted to understand, will you given that all of [indiscernible] solar tariffs are being more to the production, which tends to be little variable and also, there are questions regarding the productivity of this solar tariffs keep going a little down to maybe wear and tear. So how does [indiscernible] operational variability on these solar assets would be higher than on the transmission map? That's one. And second, what is the kind of IRR we end up making on solar assets?

Sure. So I think one you rightly answered the question, there is very little variability. It's not variability, which you need to worry about especially if we are able to -- we are assuming the right assumption at the time of acquisition, we are buying projects which are built well, and we are, I would say, doing the technical diligence well, there is limited variability in the solar projects. I would compare it with any other renewable energy projects, whether it's hydro, wind, solar has the least amount of variability. Second, solar generation has a very, very long track record now in India. I've been tracking this sector since 2008 when solar plants came in. It's been 16 years I think the worry that we carried in 2008 till 2,012 or all gone because the solar generation is one of the most predictable resource. Yes, there have been variations on account of cloud cover, on account of unseasonal rains. But they are not the ones which can really impact the end result massively unless the developers are extremely leveraged. We're 1% lesser generation and you have to default, right? So I think we aren't taking a sizable amount of risk in solar. We have about 20% maximum 25%, 30% will be on that line. And 1% or 2% solar variation, that is what we have seen in the past in various years, does not impact us on the bottom line. So we are fairly secured on that. Having said so, you've got to check that you are buying the right modules you are investing in that, you're cleaning it well and all those parameters. So I think the reliability of solar modules and panels and delivery results are fairly proven now versus what it was 10 years ago. So there is a high degree of confidence in that, that we pursue.

And the IRR on the...

IRR depends on the situation, right? I mean I'll tell you -- IRR has changed materially depending on the interest rate, depending on the desperation of the seller so it is dependent on the macroeconomic cycle in which we buy the asset. So we would have bought the asset at 13% also. And we bought the asset in which you make 20% also, right? So it is subject to the opportunity that we received. And I think the IndiGrid and for that matter, anybody who wants to make a differentiated return, got to have patience. And with our size, scale and assets, we have patience, we are in the market. We don't get desperate when the prices go back. And we're there to acquire each asset as long as the pricing is right. And that allows us to have windows of opportunities to acquire reasonably good IRR projects, right? So I give you a range, it can be 13%, it can be 20%, that depends on the situation. Our focus is on making a differentiated IRR.

All right. And my last question before I join back the queue. So, I believe, around 78% of our debt is [indiscernible], right? So how -- like would the benefit of lower interest rates going forward in case there's an interested cut, would it not so much to us like how do we stand on...

It is opportunistic, right? If interest rates are reduced by 1%, we have about INR 20,000 crores of gross borrowing, does not mean that our interest will come down by INR 200 crores in the next month, right? There is a transmission process that will take place, about 28% or 22% is immediate pass-through so which would be immediate pass-through. And subsequent one, as the things get maturity and refinancing when the reset window comes in, we can exercise certain options to really take advantage of that. And certain debt is such that we can never refinance because we are -- we prefer to have long-term fixed borrowing. So we have taken certain calls, which are anyways very good rate. So we will never refinance. So the exact math, we haven't calculated, but my guess is that if the interest rates are 1%, it will take around a year or 2 for us to have a 50% of benefit on the portfolio on that.

The next question is from the line of Sarvesh Gupta from Maximal Capital.

Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Just 2 questions. One is on this asset pipeline visibility. So you mentioned INR 2,000 crores, which is going to come up next year. But apart from that, from the bid pipeline or something, if you can sort of give some estimate of what is the visibility that we have at the moment about the addition in our AUM. So that is one. And secondly, this jump in NAV so I'm guessing this is because the beta of PGCIL -- sorry, Power Grid InvIT was much lower than the other. So what is the rough number of -- or the amount of beta that has been used for these calculations? And what was it roughly before that?

Sure. So I think to your first question, we don't forecast on growth. We don't give projections on what number of assets they are buying. We buy, we bid and we win and we communicate, but just to give you a picture, it's been 7 years since we listed, we have 7x in size, right, from the time we listed. So give or take, every year, we have grown by now INR 3,000 crores, INR 4,000 crores at any point in time and sometimes more. Now why I said that is that we are dependent on opportunities that are there in the market on M&A side. Also on the bidding side, while we do bid for it does not mean we have to bid to win. Our focus always remains on -- are we getting differentiated return? Are we getting risk-adjusted return, which is superior to where we are trading at. And if so, we have a larger appetite to bid. And I think the dependence for you as well as we management, the core belief is that as long as we follow that philosophy, there are going to be businesses in the market for us to acquire and grow. Beyond that, I think it is -- I won't say impossible, but it is something which as management, we do not guide on that this year, we are going to acquire INR 5,000 crores of assets or INR 8,000 or we are evaluating INR 4,000 crores in BD and variety of things. So we don't like to project that. But if at all history is any measure, we have grown every year by INR 3,000 crores. So we are confident that the market is huge. There is tailwind in this sector, whereas investment happening across sector, across every aspect of electricity value chain that we see. We think we have the right team acquisition growth and engineering capability. So I think when all of this mix, we will end up growing the portfolio. I think that's the belief under which we operate. So I think that's what is more prudent to follow. On the beta front, I think I'll invite Navin to brief the exact number. But I would urge you to look at the valuation report, which is the exact methodology and the numbers and everything so that in case we heard on the [ phone ] on some numbers, et cetera, you can check on the valuation report itself, what is done. But Navin, over to you.

So broadly, PGCIL beta -- levered beta was close to 25 bps, which was taken in the month of March. And Power grid InviT, this has reduced to around 0.19 or 0.20...

So 20% reduction in that.

Yes, close to 20% reduction, but on overall working this has an impact of around INR 10 on anything.

Understood. Understood. So Harsh just on the answer to the first question. I think the transmission sector, we were seeing some -- I mean it was challenging in general to sort of acquire new assets. So are you seeing any positive or negative changes to that in the environment, which was existing before maybe a few quarters back. Are there any changes in that environment? Or is it broadly the same as of now?

No, I think in the last 4 quarters, if I compare what is changed is the [indiscernible] pipeline rate of assets and the bids are happening. As we speak every month, there are a few bids and it is all public bids so bids are happening. So in general, the [ FX ] of the sector has gone up. Is it competitive? Yes, it is competitive. So I think that competitiveness remains so one needs to find out assets where we have more better place than others. And we bid for it. So I think it remains a competitive place. Having said so, the market has become large. So that offers opportunities for everyone.

And if the bid pipeline is much higher for the newer assets as well? Then wouldn't it also mean that the guys who are having the assets on their book because they would be now forced to embark on newer greenfield developments, the propensity of them to sort of download these assets to third parties like for sale should increase ideally in such an environment?

Yes. I would wish so, on paper, yes, but things move -- things take time to happen, right? But I think I would have similar hypothesis as you are suggesting.

The next question is from the line of Subhadip Mitra.

Harsh, I have a 2-part question. First part is that in continuation with the previous participant on the same lines, are we looking at possibly seeing a bit of a lean period for the next couple of years in terms of ability to acquire more assets or what I should say, maybe the opportunity to acquire more assets since most of these newer transmission assets are probably in the bidding or under construction phase today. Yes. And secondly, when one looks at the kind of bidders who are probably bidding for these new large [ IFCS ] assets, especially a large component is PGCIL followed by some of the larger private names. Some of these large private names also seem to be more of hold to maturity kind of holders who may never end up downloading the assets. So are you seeing some kind of shrinkage in terms of the transmission [ IFCS ] opportunity and hence, you may need to diversify into other areas more?

Okay. Yes and no. Yes, there are players who are hold to maturity players, so there in one time. But the only thing that we have learned over the last 7, 8 years since we listed the market, things can change in a variety of ways. So our job is to wait and wait for the right time and assets to come. We don't look at our business in a year-on-year manner that this year is lean, next year is active. So we are okay for linear for 2 years or 1 year. There is sufficient assets that we have acquired. And even if we don't do anything, right? We don't acquire any assets. Our DPU is not going to drop for whatever 8, 10 years. It's going to continue to yield results. But rather it go up when interest rates go down. So there are enough that we have done over the last 7 years that allows us to, I don't know how to put it, but let's say, time the market or what is the right time to acquire assets. So that's one. So we don't need to acquire something just to grow year-on-year to deliver a pack. That's going to come from our current assets. Second, what we are doing is instead of being a reactive player in the market, where the projects are bidded out, then subsequently dependent on strategy of developer that comes to monetization, as we've already done, we are trying to bid for projects ourselves. We already executed the first project. This year, we'll be commissioning 2, 3 more projects. So we're already putting in projects in place on our own and adding it to -- we can probably call it organic growth, right? So over last 7 years, at least the first 5 years, we did not talk about or we did not do any organic growth. However, 2 years ago, when we started on the first under construction bid was the beginning of our organic growth. And as we have done in the past, we start small on anything new. And when we deliver it, we grow big. That's what we did for solar from 100 megawatts, we waited for 3 years and we did a [indiscernible]. We put in a proto in a substation. And then last year, we increased it to 400-megawatt and certainly this year will increase more. And for transmission, we did a small project of INR 200 crores and now we are doing INR 2,000 crores, right? And they will come in line in the next 12 months as we complete the project. So that leaves us for doing more on this space on greenfield, especially if the size is large. Having said so, we completely, as I said, understand that we are not going to deploy entire risk capital on under construction projects. But with a pedigree and track record, there is tremendous amount of development capital waiting on the sideline to partner with developers. So we are working to see if we can put something like that thing in place, which enables us to do or rather ensure actively participate in the large transmission market.

Understood. Understood. And with regard to the solar and the best related projects, what quantum of your AUM would you say would at max be or what you would look at in those types of investments...

Yes. So the best -- best is transmission. And we are following MOP guidelines. As long as the best is co-located with transmission assets, it is considered transmission. Second best the asset nature is also like transmission and substations, right? The contract is like such the transmission, take-or-pay contract, capacity-based contract, O&M is like substation. So it is more like transmission as an asset versus renewable. So there is a tremendous appetite on there on our end. We are building a lot of scale capabilities to both execute and manage those projects. So I would say, basically, this is part of our base plan we can do as much as we want as long as the returns are good. On the solar side, we will maintain around 25% ratio at this point in time. And again, opportunistically, if people ask prices, it does not make sense, we may not acquire. And if there are assets, which are returning us substantially good returns, we may acquire so it's something which will break out.