MFE-Mediaforeurope N.V. (MFEB) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Mediaset 2021 9 Months Results Web Phone Conference Call. Today's conference is being recorded. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Sara Bersan. Please go ahead.

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the 9 Months 2021 results of Mediaset Group. Today, the speakers are Marco Giordani, CFO of the company; and Matteo Cardani, Managing Director of Publitalia. We'll have less than 1 hour today, so let me hand over immediately to Matteo for the advertising and audience outlook. Matteo, please go ahead.

Thank you, Sara. Good morning, everybody. Thank you for your attendance. Today, we comment on the 9 months results with a short outlook at Q4 ongoing indicators. Starting from the economic scenario, I'm commenting Chart #3 and #4. With regard to confidence index indicators, the monthly evolution shows a continuous improvement of the economic scenario. It is worth underlying the fact that since April, we are definitely in the positive field, both for consumer and business confidence index. This positive evolution of confidence industry is also reflected in natural dynamics of goods and services consumption that beyond the obvious positive counter digit versus Q2 '20 base numbers keeps on going quite well also in Q3. These indicators are, of course, strictly linked with hard indicators as GDP dynamics. The [indiscernible] and trend variation of gross domestic product in Q3 are both positive, plus 2.6% and plus 3.8%. And moreover, the forecast for the 2021 full year is in a positive range, quite close to plus 6%. That is the actual consolidated progress in the first 9 months of 2021. And a similar range of growth rate expectation is also gaining consensus for 2022 due also to recovery plans. So definitely a positive macroeconomic scenario, to some extent, reflected in the advertising market. I'm now commenting Chart #5. We have a 9-month data from Nielsen published yesterday. The interesting thing is that the overall market is catching up with its 2019 pre-COVID level. As you can see, 9-month indicators are positive for all media, excluding the ARPU movement that anyway is recovering. But specifically, for our addressable market segments, the recovery is really solid and robust. You see a double-digit growth for TV and digital that are now above the 2019 levels. While radio is growing double-digit, it's still below 2019 levels. But radio is catching up. And the early indicators for the last part of the year with regard to radio are quite encouraging, quite positive. Having said that, let's have a look at our performance, now commenting Chart #6. We are -- keep on outperforming the market by more than 2 points. Our truck -- our growth in the 9 months is 21.5% versus market 19.3%. And this positive gap delivers a shorter increase in market share. Again, we reached an all-time high 9-month market share of 41.1%, and we are 100 basis points above year-on-year. We are particularly satisfied by this 9-month progression and positive Q3 performance, because it's absolutely a valuable performance considering that in June, July, August, we did not broadcast Euro football championship, of course, and [ IMPX ] too. And we had a tough comparison against August '20 for Champions League. Last year, we had Champions League in August, of course, not present this year. So the most significant achievement is that we completed in H1 the recovery of 2019 baseline. And in 9 months, we are now 1% above 9 months 2019, as we anticipated to some extent in the last conference call. Again, the overall result has been achieved with a double-digit contribution for all the free media, TV, radio and digital, and specifically, radio and digital, they are outperforming by far their respective market segments. And so the other good news we are commenting with you. It's the one reported in Chart #7. It's the fifth positive quarter in a row. Q3 is a positive quarter. Even despite the fact that we didn't have the other championship, the league peaks, the final Champions League matches we had last year. So I underline again, we fully recovered 2018 level, and we are even 1% above. Last remarks with regard to audience and sector dynamics. With regard to audience, we are also benefiting from a very positive trend in total video. They are strongly growing for the second year in a row with remarkable results versus 2019 baseline. You see in Chart #8, we have positive, let's say, good health on the first screen linear, and moreover, the high-growth on digital screens. Both connect television and mobile plus desktops inventory, they are growing, and this protects the legacy business and increase the revenue diversification towards a higher digital mix. Coming to Chart #9, the Mediaset linear TV volume is at 33.8%, in line with 2019, on a commercial target. And we are getting used to the fact that our digital nonlinear audience shall perform even higher, 39.7%. So this level confirms the solid leadership in the broadcaster arena on digital screens. Last but not the least, a comment on the advertising breakdown by sector. With regard to settlement, we are in the market recovering with a double-digit trend, and all sectors are more or less aligned to this growth. And I would say that our position is strong, better than the market, especially in the key sectors where we are outperforming the market average, as you can see from this chart. And the real strength of our portfolio is the high degree of sector diversification. So as you can see from the split of the sector percentage in this pie chart, we are not so dependent on each single sector performance. So for example, the fact that -- as you know, there's a customer mark for the world market, not only for us, the [indiscernible] situation of the automotive sector that after the strong recovery in the first H1, it is suffering Q3 and Q4 for key components shortage. And this is a bottleneck to sales and contextually to investment. But anyway, the interesting thing is that the overall weight of automotive in November, December is the lowest of the year. And we are more than confident that difficulties of the auto sector that account for less than 10% in November, December, could be compensated, or even more than compensated, by positive dynamics in the other main sectors, with a significantly contribution by seasonal categories driven by Black Friday or Christmas. Just to give you an idea, if we take a look at the progression of some strategic sectors like retail, consumer durable, pharma, leisure time, travel, and moreover, the direct-to-consumers' contribution, it's a sector -- the e-commerce and direct-to-consumers players that is absolutely booming. So the combination of these 8, 9 sectors that are doing very well, is expected to compensate or more than compensate the [indiscernible], let's say, trouble of the automotive sector in -- for the last part of the year. Having said that, now I hand over to Marco for the financials.

Thank you, Matteo, and good morning also to everybody from my side. I'm very pleased today to comment these results that are really outstanding, I would say. We really achieved great results in the first 9 months of 2021. From Chart #12, you can realize that we went back to '19 revenue lines with a huge increase in profitability. In reality, EBIT was EUR 275 million, 50% more compared to '19 first 9 months, and clearly 3x better than last year, that was a very exceptional year. As far as the net result is concerned, we achieved EUR 274 million net profit, 3x higher than 2019. You know that we had some extraordinary contribution. But also without taking into account this extraordinary contribution, our net profit in the first 9 months of 2021 are better than '19 in net profit. Another incredible result was on the cash flow. The group net financial position was negative by EUR 920 million at the end of September 2021, with a great and incredible cash generation that improved by around EUR 145 million in the first 9 months of the year, also considering the distribution of more than EUR 340 million of dividends we paid out in July. Clearly, the net financial position for covenant purpose has improved, and it is very far from our, let's say, covenant threshold. Stepping down with the Italian business in Page 13. Matteo has already commented the advertising performance. So I'm moving down to the P&L. The other revenue line was EUR 233 million in the first 9 months, 2021. Main contribution to this line went from the Champions League we started to stream on our OTT platform, the transmission fee on other platforms of our, let's say, content and services. Clearly, we had a great performance from the sales of our content to third party, and we had also the exceptional income from Dailymotion settled. That number of the first 9 months is confirming our guidance for the full year, that will be broadly in line with 2020 performance. As far as costs are concerned, the total cost in the first 9 months of 2021 was EUR 1.254 billion, showing a reduction of more than EUR 118 million compared to '19. We are keeping, let's say, pace with the efficiency rate we registered in the full year 2020, confirming a reduction of almost 9% for cost compared to '19 cost base. As far as the full year is concerned, we are confirming the guidance we already gave of EUR 1.780 billion for the full year. And this guidance includes also the cost of the Coppa Italia right that has been acquired in July. This guidance implies that we are going to maintain the cost base aligned with 2020, and we will register a decline of 6% compared to '19. EBIT in the first 9 months of 2021 was EUR 135 million, a great result compared to both 2020 and '19. And just the last comment on the slide is the fact that EBIT margin we registered in the first 9 months of 2021 can only be compared to the one we reached in 2011. So really, the best performance in the last decade. Moving down below EBIT. Net financial income was positive for EUR 90.4 million. And associate was positive for a little bit more than EUR 100 million. In terms of guidance for 2021, we are improving our guidance on financial income. Financial income will be around EUR 15 million compared to the previous guidance. While on the associated line, we are confirming the guidance of EUR 108 million. Another important, let's say, result was on investment part, on Slide 15. As you can see, we are investing almost EUR 100 million less than last year. That's mainly due to the fact that the mix of content has changed, leaving right acquisition and investing more in, say, in-house production. And for that reason, we are improving our guidance for CapEx for a total amount of EUR 320 million compared to the previous guidance of EUR 360 million, EUR 340 million. This means a reduction of almost 25% to 30% compared to '19 level. And that's one of the reasons for which the cash flow has been really extraordinary in the first 9 months of 2021. Page -- slide Page 16, you can appreciate that. The first 9 months -- in the first 9 months of 2021, we have generated more than 3x the free cash flow we generated in '19, and it is more than the double compared to 2020. You know that we have already commented, but we have distributed EUR 341 million of dividends to our shareholders. And in any case, our net financial position for covenant purposes is below EUR 900 million, and that's really a remarkable, let's say, performance, let's say, also, considering the EUR 340 million paid in dividends. In terms of guidance, we are expecting the group net debt compared to EBITDA ratio to be confirmed below 1x. Then, I believe that it's time for your questions. So I'll open the Q&A session, and thank you for your patience.

[Operator Instructions] We'll take our first question from Fabio Pavan from Mediobanca.

First of all, congratulation for the results. I would like to focus on the advertising outlook, which seems to be much more reassuring than the ones we had from other European broadcasters. If my understanding is correct, you are not afraid about any slowdown in advertising from automotive. I was wondering if this is why in Italy, the dynamics are different, or maybe your strategy is allowing you thanks to the contribution of addressable TV convergent offer and radio to offset this potential drop in the sector.

Matteo? Probably you are in mute.

I was saying thanks to Fabio Pavan for his question. And I address immediately. Of course, the automotive sector is a real situation. The advertising expenditures by these sectors is declining in the last part of the year due to the bottlenecking availability of key components. But the referring thing is that, if I take a look, for example, at October dynamics, October has been a positive month compared to past years, and we achieved the results, despite the fact that the automotive sector was suffering. And this comes back to, let's say, the health status of our portfolio of sectors. We are very well diversified, and we are, let's say, quite clever in, let's say, catching up with the growing sectors. So for example, the direct-to-consumer e-commerce sector is absolutely booming. It's around plus 80% in terms of growth year-on-year. And this, combined with other key sectors like retailers, consumer durables, travel, leisure time, is actually more than compensating the down trend in the automotive sector. So this is true for the first 10 months of the year. And that is why, of course, we are cautious, but we are confident that the last 2 months of the year will not affect our progression. Just to give you an idea, as I said, October was positive year-on-year, and so the performance of the first 10 months has improved again. So if we closed the 9 months plus 1% versus 2019, the performance in 10 months is now plus 1.2% compared to the 2018 baseline. And our aim for the fiscal year is to achieve a pro forma at least above plus 1.2% against fiscal year 2019. So with some -- let's say, there are some things to be -- to take into consideration, but the overall outlook is definitely positive.

We'll take our next question from Julien Roch from Barclays.

First question is, Matteo, you just said that you thought advertising would be up at least 1.2% versus 2019, which should be about EUR 1.96 billion, which should be up about 13% versus 2020. But you said, at least. So what would be the best outcome? That's my first question. The second question is, Marco, any update you can tell us about consolidation? Do you have active conversations with other broadcasters? Or will nothing happen until you have 2 class of shares in January and you can issue shares to do some M&A? And the third question, going back to Matteo, and on Page 8, I assume that linear viewing is up 3%, not 103%? And also, would it be possible to have some idea of the breakdown of your audience between the 3 component you highlight on Page 8?

I'll answer my question, Matteo, then I'll hand over to you.

Yes.

No, I mean, as we said last time, I mean, clearly, we are not going to comment on M&A unless and until we have something to say officially. So you know that from the, let's say, institutional, or in any case, an administrative point of view, we are going to have the shareholders' meeting of Mediaset on the 25th of November. The shareholders' meeting will decide on the company name and on the introduction of the 2 classes of shares. So that's the only official news we can give out. As far as the rest as -- we don't want to, let's say, to pass over any kind of speculation on that. We will announce things when and if we'll be sure. So Matteo, then you can answer to Julien. Thanks.

Yes. Thanks, Julien, for your questions. Yes, your -- let's say, your calculation, of course, are right. So the implicit 1.2% versus 2019 basis, it's equivalent to lift at least plus 13% fiscal year '21 versus '20. What I would like to underline is the fact that we say, at least, so -- because this is what we have on hand now. We have, let's say, 7 or 8 weeks left. They are selling weeks to [indiscernible]. And the last 2 months of the year are the 2 most important months, to some extent, the most unpredictable because there are a lot of things around Black Fridays and Christmas. But we are building visibility weeks after week. And honestly, we are not concerned about the base level I declared before, but this is the best level. This is, we say, okay, at least this is our expectation for fiscal year. What I could say, we met probably 4 weeks ago, and we had a progression 1.0. After 4 weeks we met again, and we have a progression 1.2. And so let's see what's happened, but we are, let's say, quite positive on the progression, if there are no accidents on the roof, let's say. And with regard to the total audience evolution, yes, here, you have Chart #8, absolute percentage increase year-on-year for 3 separate screens. So TV linears are connected to television and online video. We are looking forward how detailed to release next year to the market finally a total audience metrics that could help us to make a comparable data, that really is comparable but across 3 screens. As you know, we don't give details about the split of our business components with regard to different media. The only thing I can add is that the CPM for connected television of online video is a premium CPM that is helping us in revenue collection. And anyway, even the linear TV is in a positive upward pricing trend. So after the deflationary trend last year, '20, the 2021 is a inflationary year for CPM for linear television. And being television components in recovery, the market is, to some extent, accepting the trend. So this is the whole picture.

We'll take our next question from Sarah Simon from Berenberg.

I've got a couple of questions. First on -- Marco, would be on the reduction in CapEx. I'm assuming that's mostly coming out of programming investment, which suggests you're investing less in rights, but you're managing to maintain the cost base, which would be -- there's much more in-house production. Is that the right way to think about it? Second one was on the -- the Champions League streaming. Have you got any numbers you can give us in terms of the number of people you attracted to that? And then finally, on radio, where are you in terms of listening compared to, say, 2019? We were looking at the Spanish numbers the other day, and they're obviously still quite down. That would be helpful.

Thank you, Sarah. No, you're right. I mean, the decision that we have taken some years ago to leave, let's say, rights purchase and increase the local production, it has been confirmed even in the last period. And so the reduction of the U.S. mainly TV rights has been steady and is going to be seen also in the next month, because, as you know, these are long-term contracted. So once you have decided, then the effect of your decision will come to the balance sheet and the P&L after some years. So clearly, what we are experiencing now, it has been the effect of decisions taken a couple of years ago. In terms of -- in general terms, we are buying less and we are paying less, and the combination of the 2 is creating the headroom that, for us, it's very important because we are able to invest more in local production, and all in all, to save money. So I believe that there was a perfect combination, and the results are clearly in the cash flow statement. The last -- the second question on Champions League. No, we are not disclosing numbers in any case regarding Champions League. In any case, we can say that the first week game, that was mid of September, and frankly -- we were frankly surprised by volume, and we had also some problem in serving all the customer. After this issue in the first week came, clearly, we updated our, let's say, services. And service is pretty okay, and it is in line with the best practice on the Italian market, and we are getting very good results in terms of consumption, better than expected, frankly. And it's also a good, let's say, editorial mean to serve Publitalia because also the advertising collection on the Champions League streamed -- it's very good and it is beyond expectation. Matteo, do you want to comment on the consumption or...

Yes. With regards to the other consumption, radio is, let's say, recovering audience level. It's beyond the 2020 situation experienced here. The official radio terra audience data are quite reassuring on the overall audience ratings. On top of this a key trend, the market has completely understood the [indiscernible] of radio audience. This means 2 things. The fact that the standard linear radio listening is becoming more and more distributed by digital platforms, so mobile, web and so on, and this increases the attractiveness in radio because, when you have the digital, let's say, track of your audience, this increases the appealing in the medium. And on top of this, if we move from -- it's like TV, move from TV to total video and the parallel movies from radio to digital audio. Our proposition to the market is, okay, radio again, but we are offering a full portfolio of digital audio solutions. And this is improving. We are also considering the podcast offer. So we want to cover the full range of digital audio market, that means linear radio, digital audio and podcast. And what I can add, that after 12, 15 months, home installs -- some troubles for radio as a whole. Now the last part of the year, we are seeing less clouds on the horizon, and the market is recovering confidence on this important medium. And that's it. Hope to have answered. Thank you.

Next question is from Stefano Gamberini from Equita.

Two from my side. The first is regarding advertising sectors. If I'm not wrong, in September, according to Nielsen, also telecom was down in the region of 8% as well as food down 4%. So what is the trend in the fourth quarter of these 2 important sectors for you? And why in your view, there was this weakness in September month? The second topic is on other revenues. The guidance, full year guidance is flat year-on-year. But if I understood correctly, this means a decline in the first quarter compared to the first quarter, '24 -- '20, sorry. Why, considering the good trend in Champions League streaming, you expect this decline? And there were some one-offs or nonrecurring revenues in the third quarter high other revenues?

Maybe taking -- answering to the latter. No -- yes, you're right. In the third quarter, we accounted the extraordinary, or let's call it one-off revenue, coming from the settlement with Dailymotion, that was EUR 26.2 million one-off. That clearly cannot be, let's say, accounted again in the fourth quarter. And that's the main reason. As far as the rest, the progression is the same, and actually, it's even better because, for instance, Champions League was only 1 month in the third quarter, while we are expecting a better performance in -- with the fourth quarter. But I mean, the only extraordinary and non-comparable, let's say, item was the EUR 26.2 million settlement from Dailymotion accounted in the third quarter. And maybe, you can answer too.

Yes. With regard to advertising sector, the situation is the following one. If we have, on the one hand, the [indiscernible], or let's say, trouble of the automotive sector, it's true that food and telco sectors are not down. They are simply, let's say, slow -- reducing the growth rate. But if I look at the 9-month trend and also the 10-month progression, they are, let's say, slowing down, but they are definitely still in the positive field. So they are contributing positively to the whole portfolio, okay? So they are single-digit growing compared to a portfolio that is double-digit growing, but they are contributing. And moreover, for me, the key point today to share with you is the high degree of sector diversification of our portfolio. We are very well rooted and distributed in all sectors. We have a customer base of more than 1,000 active companies each year. And another strength point is our capability to renew year-on-year by 5% to 7% the customer base with new business. So we are, let's say, quite clever in detecting and discovering new clients facing the market. This, thanks also to our perspective in Europe, thanks to Europe, that helped us in detecting new clients coming from abroad. And that is why I say that the direct-to-commerce and e-commerce sectors is becoming more and more important, and is growing at a very high double-digit. And on top of this, we have retail consumer electronics. But also for them, pharmaceutical is now a public contributing sector. So let's say, the solidity of our portfolio is this diversification of sector. So if you have a structural situation like last year, okay, we suffer, and we suffer because we represent the whole market. But due to the fact that we represent the whole market, if there is 1 or 2 sectors in trouble, we are in the position to try to compensate with other sectors. And I would add that in this perspective, our offer on football is a very positive leverage because as you know football puts in the position to have a sort of forward buying, forward selling situation, because we try to sell in advance 3, 4 months, and managing the whole offer for football for club, we are in the situation to detect the upcoming trends with 2 to 3 months of competitive edge versus our competitors. Okay. That's it. And I hope that answered, and I...

Just a quick follow-up on the other revenues for me. Regarding content resale, how the content resale is going? And if you can, in some way, offset or substitute the contract with Sky that, if I'm not wrong, is expiring in this period?

I mean the content resale is an ongoing, let's say, activity. We have a large library, probably the largest in Italy. So all the platforms are pretty, let's say, hungry of Italian content, and this is an activity that is -- going forward, I mean, we don't see any kind of deceleration in that respect. But clearly, you need to finalize the contract before accounting them. Looking at the future, clearly, it will be a mixed situation. Next year, we will have certainly some contracts that will expire, but we are positive because we have, for instance, the movie cash in, in the theater that, as you can imagine, has been none -- almost none in 2021, that we believe and we hope that in 2022 we'll be back there. Champions will be 12 months and not only half season. We have [ Atasun ] that is going through. So I'm pretty optimistic also for next year. It's not -- on -- the line, the EUR 300 million line, it's composed by several components with different trends. And our objective is to compensate them and to keep, let's say, the same path we had in 2021. But I mean, as far as content resale, I'm pretty positive. I believe that Matteo would like to also to add a little bit -- something on the previous answer. Matteo, right?

Yes. No, no, just to make it crystal clear. My point is, we have a very well-diversified portfolio. So some [indiscernible] situation in one sector could be compensated or more than compensated by other sectors. Of course, it's important for us in our conversation to remind all of us that November, December last year was absolutely quite a all-time high record in terms of revenue collection. So we have to compare, our Q4 last year was up 3.5%, with November and December strongly outperforming the quarter. So the -- let's say, half glass full because October was positive. But of course, we are, let's say, confident and cautious at the same time, because -- we'll see how the weighted average of the performance of all the different sector would -- the final outcome of November, December. So we are positive. But let's keep in mind that the baseline for November, December last year, it's anyway quite challenging, but we'll see.

We'll take our last question from Richard Eary from UBS.

Yes, 4 questions from my side. Just to be clear on the other revenue numbers. Is it -- if we look at the guidance you've given, which is similar levels to 2020, which was EUR 311 million, but that now includes, obviously, the EUR 26 million from the Dailymotion settlement. I mean, it implies that actually there's actually a downgrade to what you were guiding, which was EUR 300 million before. So I'm just trying to clarify whether that's correct or not, or whether that you're being conservative around the numbers for the same as last year. The second question just comes to costs. Obviously, you've guided this year EUR 17 million - EUR 18 million. How should we think about costs as we go into FY '22? And what are the puts and takes that are in there that may influence those numbers? The third question is just on ProSieben. Whether you can just give us an update in terms of what the position is in ProSieben? How much is in derivatives? How much is actually in a physical cash position? Because I noticed in the press release, it states that -- saying that the Mediaset is facing charges about EUR 104 million to increase the stake held in proceeds, and affected by Mediaset Espana. So just whether you can clarify that statement. And then just lastly, whether you can comment on the position of EI Towers and what the plan is, if you can?

So I will try to follow your list. And again, on other revenue, I mean, we didn't change any guidance in the sense that, if we -- if you turn back to, let's say, our announcement, the agreement with Vivendi has been reached in the second quarter. So when we had the first quarter, let's say, conference call, we knew already about Dailymotion. So when we guide the EUR 300 million, we knew already. So we are exactly, let's say, hitting our target for 2021, with clearly a different combination, because when you set the target, you don't know many things. And running a business, you can have good news and bad news. The fact is that we are exactly getting what was in our forecast with clearly a different composition. Many things have changed, but the reality and the results are exactly what was in our forecast. Unfortunately, we are not really collecting fees from the people. We have to work through 12 months to reach our target. And on the other revenue lines, for instance, frankly, at the beginning of the year, we thought that movies on the other revenue would have been part of the other revenue. Unfortunately, it didn't happen. But on the other hand, Champions League performance was better, blah, blah, blah, and we were able to offset their own forecast on theater and on movie theater. So again, next year will be the same. It's not one single line. It's made by several lines. Our objective is really to maximize the line, working 12 months. Unfortunately, we cannot be sure both about the target -- but I mean, this year, we were able to meet our objective and budget. As far as cost is concerned, on the other hand, clearly, the budget exercise has not been completed. I believe that we are starting from a very outstanding performance in 2021. The policy will not change. Great effort in local production compensated by many savings in all the parts of the group. As we said, we are below 2019 level in terms of cost. And as I said, the budget has not been completed, that we have, for instance, some other extra costs that we have to compensate like the Coppa Italia and SuperCoppa rights we acquired in July. But I mean, we are working to keep the cost base in 2002 flattish compared to 2021. When the budget will be completed, we'll be guide you -- we will guide you exactly on the number. As far as ProSieben is concerned, I mean, again, we don't want to -- let's say, to feed speculation through news. We are the largest shareholder. We have secured more -- a little bit more than 24% of the voting rights. We always said that we had completed all the form required by Bafin, and let's say, we officially stated our position. We are going on in communicating changes from loan position and derivatives. The reality is that we have secured a 24.2% voting rights. And as far as how we structure and finance the stake, frankly, it's something that is a little bit tough for us to decide. And we were always complying with what the former requirements are. I mean, clearly, the company is entering in 2002 where many things will happen, some changes in the supervisory board, listing of parship. I mean there are many things we are clearly looking at it. We are long-term investors. We don't look at 1 week share performance. We are looking on, let's say, long-term strategy and long-term creation of value, and that's our position. We are very, very happy about the investment, and we are confident the company can really pursue its objective and increase the company value and also our stake. As far as EI Towers is concerned, again, no changes. I mean, we are happy about the performance of the company. You have seen that -- thanks to them we have accounted a great extraordinary gain with the sale of the mobile towers. Again, thanks to the management, and thanks also to the strategy we have implemented before, let's say, the delisting. So again, we are happy on the broadcasting towers. I mean the performance -- the operating performance of EI Towers is in line with the forecast and with the plan. You know because we already said that the stake is not strategic, so it's not part of our future media strategy, but we are not yet to undersell, or we are trying to take the maximum value out of the participation. And once that the level will be reached, will be a good chance to take profit and to sell it. But I mean, for the time being, there are no news. Clearly, the management is working in different, let's say, activities, and the performance of the company, as you can see from the numbers, is improving. The last -- and this is probably someone in Italy has already read on the newspaper, they were able to, let's say, to become partner of [ La Liga Serie ], so the Serie A League for the, let's say, off-field referee. So I mean, they are really working well, and the performance of the group is great. It's not part of our future because we are a media company, and we want to pursue a media strategy. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you, Marco -- thank you, Marco, and thank you, Matteo, and thanks, guys, for all the questions and for taking the time for the conference call today. As always, we'll be available for any question, information you would like to ask. Have a good day. Bye-bye.

Ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today's call. Thank you very much for your participation. You may now disconnect.