Orlen S.A. (PKN) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to Warsaw Stock Exchange Head Office to the conference call, which will be devoted to the financial and operational performance of ORLEN Group after the second quarter of 2024. Thank you for the turnout, which is pretty solid today and welcome to all the online participants of today's conference call. Today's speakers will include Mr. Ireneusz Fafara, Management Board President and CEO; as well as Magdalena Bartos, VP for Finance CFO. The floor is yours.

Good morning to you. I'm sorry for the technical glitches. Welcome to our conference call, which will be devoted to our performance after the second quarter of 2024 from our perspective, ours and the Management Board's perspective, this is a very important conference call, which will present -- which will present our performance after the second quarter, the quarter during which we have been responsible for -- we were responsible for all the performance. And I can say that those -- this performance proves that is the strengthening of our management competencies translates into solid results. In the second quarter, we proved. We have shown you that we are ready to and able to deliver strong results after a pretty challenging macro period. If we consider our LIFO-based EBITDA, given that it was the most subject to negative effects PLN 7.7 billion and more than PLN 15 billion throughout the first half of the year. This is a very strong result. What's important as well is to opt the best of our knowledge, the write-down that we reported in the second quarter -- the first half of the year will not be reported in charge to our performance in the second half of the year. And therefore we will be able to focus on our growth in the second half of 2024. Unfortunately, the macro environment was very challenging and pretty weak. Refining margins went down by over 9% and the same goes for our other margins, refining margins and petrochemical margins. As we said before, the petchem business has to survive the most challenging period in its history for our group. The petchem conditions are still pretty weak, prices of gas went down by 12%. Same goes for the electricity prices down by 25%. The negative effect of price downturns were compensated by a major uptrend in retail. Our promotional campaign proved very successful. On the one hand, we have higher sales. On the other hand, our clients and customers can buy gasoline and [ heating ] oil at a more favorable price. We also upscaled our gas business and the electricity business. We have taken a number of decisions in order to strengthen our operational results as well as growth projects, and we will move on to that in the second half of the conference. But before I move on to give the floor over to Mr. Bartos, Bartos will discuss the financials. I'd like to focus on three major things. As I promised during our last conference, we are rationalizing our investment spending. We estimate that we will spend more than PLN 35 billion, 9% down than we planned. This is due to the fact that we are not driving down our investments, but we are rationalizing them. We are more effective. And at the same time, we are more secure in that respect in a sense that we are spending on upgrades, modernization and maintenance CapEx much stronger, while we are not curbing or we're not reducing our effects. We are not spending every free penny. We do not throw money into the [ gutter. ] So we are rationalizing our operations and we are solid here. In terms of our security index and security indicators, we have introduced an uniform security across the group security policy across the group. The TRR indicator is down to 0.2 versus the previous quarter, and we will continue to do so. Let me repeat it once again, safety first. Safety of our people is our main priority. And thirdly, we have upgraded our Nation Policy in terms of CapEx information. We will not report it at the end of the year only, but we will report our CapEx spending and a planned CapEx and cash flow planned CapEx every quarter. That will be all in terms of the introduction. And Magdalena, please, the floor is yours.

Thank you, Ireneusz, for the interaction. I'm very happy to be here with you, all of you, ladies and gentlemen at another conference call we have prepared together with our team. As usual I will start with the key indicators, key facts and figures for the second quarter, and then I'll move on and go through with you in terms of our financials and operational results by segment, and then we will move on to our outlook for the second part of the year. And then the CEO will come back and discuss the future. Coming back to the second quarter, however, it was a period of intensive work. And our results are solid operational indicators. In the conditions as the CEO mentioned that we're not very favorable, both in terms of macro conditions, which were very challenging and obviously it had a different impact by segment. We'll move on to the segment discussion later on. However, what's very important in terms of the drivers of our financials was the regulatory environment. CEO mentioned about the windfall charge -- gas windfall charge. That is the charge that is reflected in our performance. It is meant to support our customers, specifically most sensitive customers and it had an effect of PLN 7.7 billion in the second quarter alone. However, it was as much as PLN 15.7 billion in the first half of the year equal to last year's performance in this respect. Obviously, we received compensation in the second quarter. We received PLN 1.4 billion in compensation, but it translates to over PLN 4 billion last year. So we have a higher gas windfall charge, but lower compensation. So this is the real effect of those regulations on our performance. And considering those effects, and those drivers, our LIFO-based EBITDA came in at PLN 11.3 billion higher year-on-year. I have mentioned that the macro environment is a challenge and remains a challenge for the group and this translates into the revenue for the second quarter at PLN 69.5 billion, down quarter-on-quarter and year-on-year, mainly due to lower prices of gas. We will move on to discussing that particular driver, but it was a major driver for us. Our operational performance on a cash flow from operations, this was down also due to the regulatory drivers and the compensations -- and the compensation or the price different payment fund. What's important here is the safe, secure, financial footing. Our net debt-to-EBITDA is close to 0, and it's pretty stable compared to the previous reporting periods. This is good news. As we are just ahead of the very intensive period of the second half of the year and the payment of the dividends at the end of the year. We have mentioned macro and the macro effects, this image on screen shows you what we call a normalization of our macroeconomic environment. Refining margins delivered in the second quarter of 2024 on average were at USD 12.6 per barrel going down 9% year-on-year. What's important, however, is the fact that our refining margins are still at a healthy level. Historically speaking, it is positive. However, the downward trend is pretty evident and it translates into the performance of our Refining segment. The price of crude oil and gas are in a sideway trend, and in a stable quarter, recent weeks have brought certain positive signals in terms of the prices of gas, which in the second quarter, those prices were at PLN 150 per megawatt hour going down by 12% year-on-year. In the entire first half of the year, this downtrend is more than 1/3. However, the price of electricity went down considerably by 25% year-on-year, mainly due to lower price of gas and lower CO2 emission prices. I'd like to move on to our operational results, and will start discussion by segment. But before we move on to that, I'd like you to take a look at those two charts. In the upper chart, we are showing both segments results, for LIFO-based EBITDA, and was important here. The performance of every segment with an exception -- with the exception of petchem, all those results by segment are pretty solid and pretty robust. I'd like to draw your attention to this pretty visible and evident regulatory effect, especially in upstream and the upstream segment delivered an operational loss at PLN 3.9 billion, which was due to the windfall charge. That's the gas windfall charge, as we will discuss later on in more detail. In the lower chart, we are showing you the dynamics and the change in the segment's result year-on-year. Please take a look at the extreme right and extreme left bar, this is EBITDA LIFO including regulations, which had an impact on our operations. So this is where you see most clearly our operational effect, with EBITDA LIFO going up by 8% at PLN 11.3 billion for this quarter. Moving on to discussion by segment. Let me start by focusing on the Refining business, which is our fertile field, so to speak. So I'd like to discuss this particular segment first. We delivered PLN 2.6 billion, going up by around PLN 100 million year-on-year. However, let me focus on the high utilization ratio despite cyclical shutdowns or regular shutdowns in Czech Republic, the refineries, both in the Czech Republic and -- Lithuania, I'm sorry, and Poland were at full swing and operated at full swing and the yields here were pretty high, which allowed us to mitigate and compensate to a certain extent of the macro conditions. So we need to also remember that the cyclical shutdowns, the Czech Republic had an effect on our operations. Obviously, it impacted our sales volumes, which went down by 2% and also had a negative impact on our business. In terms of the positive drivers in the Refining segment, we received partial compensations for the shutdown of the HGO (sic) [ HOG ] unit in 2022. We have now received partial compensation that come for this particular events. This allowed us to partially compensate the negative volume effect and deliver a very solid result in the end. In terms of the Petchem business, and image here is pretty clear. This segment still operates in a very challenging macro environment. Good news here is the fact that we are reporting higher volumes. And we see higher demand for petchem products from Europe, which is probably due to -- mainly due to logistics constraints in Asia and especially Middle East. This translates into higher demand. So we have reported higher sales, higher production volumes across all our petchem product groups and at a general level, we are talking about an increase of 8%. However, to a very challenging macro situation and lower margins -- product margins, this did not translate into the segment performance in general and it reported a slight loss. Next segment is the Energy segment, which reported strong results in terms of operational performance and a bit of more favorable macro and regulatory environment. A strong upward trend year-on-year. We're talking about close to PLN 2 billion in EBITDA in the quarter, more than PLN 1.4 billion year-on-year. It comes from two main drivers. First of all, this year the Energy segment did not have any charges in terms of compensation for sensitive customers. Last year, the charge was at PLN 500 million. The charge is not reported in this quarter, in the second quarter of 2024 and more. And also, we had better margins for the -- on sales of Electricity. So this drivers helped us perform pretty well here. In terms of volumes, the volumes of Electricity sales went down by 12% year-on-year, which is mainly due to lower demand in terms of the transmission system operator in Ostroleka, CCGT. In the context of our performance, I'd like to also mention a one-off effect of PLN 232 million as an instrument used to secure the interest rates for our offshore wind farm project with Baltic Power. One thing I would like you to remember was to help us and help you interpret our performance for the future, is the structure of our production, a seasonality effect in the Energy segment due to the fact that we have heat generation operations. It is a seasonal business, and it will impact the performance of our group in the quarters to come. In terms of investments in the segment, I'm talking about PLN 2.4 billion across the second quarter of the year. We are expecting investments at about PLN 6 billion throughout the year. And we're talking about investments in Ostroleka and Grudziadz CCGT projects and also renewable energy resources projects. In Retail, what stands out looking at our performance here in the second quarter, is the fact that, we are continuing to develop and increase our network, and we are also focusing on the higher efficiency of our business here. The growth of our network in Poland comes to -- on the forefront, we are increasing the share in the market in Poland, and it also translates into higher volumes of sales in terms of fuels. The number of non-fuel units and alternative fuel stations went up. We are still working on the visual identification of our fuel stations in the Czech Republic and in Hungary, we are rebranding our fuel stations. And all in all, we have already as much as 3,505 fuel stations altogether -- also considering the fact that we have a new network in Austria. In upstream. The Upstream segment was under strong regulatory pressures. We have discussed it before. There's one thing I'd like to draw your attention specifically are our volumes as well upscaling of our business. This translated into high a pretty solid increase in the production of hydrocarbon gas and crude oil, especially driven by production on the Norwegian Continental Shelf and the takeover of OPEC and Norwegian assets. We have two main directions here. We're talking about Norway and Poland as the main markets for Upstream segment. And the second quarter of the year was yet another quarter in which we reported more than 200,000 BOE per day. The downturn in terms of production in Poland was due to planned shutdowns of our fields, but we had a positive volume effect, translating into an additional PLN 1.2 billion in additional EBITDA, which allowed us to compensate negative effects in terms of the gas prices as well as the negative macro coming from the strengthening of PLN versus U.S. dollar and the Norwegian krona. The element that we mentioned already -- we have mentioned already, but it's pretty important. So it deserves another mention, because it translated into a charge that we had to report is the gas windfall charge which had an impact on our EBITDA at PLN 1.2 billion. Had it not been for this charge, but had not been for such a considerable charge versus the previous year, the Upstream segment would have reported a very strong, solid and positive performance in the second quarter. Last but not least, Gas segment. We're talking about trade and storage and distribution of gas. The segment that had the most obvious contribution to our EBITDA at [ PLN 1.4 billion ] -- over [ PLN 4 billion. ] However, it reported a decline versus the previous year mainly due to a downward trend in gas prices going down by more than 30% in the first quarter and 12% in the second quarter, which was the main driver behind our performance here. However, the good news is about sales volumes went up, which was due to higher sales in terms of our industrial customers and the demand from the industry. In Poland, in the second quarter of 2024 in terms of wholesale demand, it went up by 23%. The volume of gas to retail customers went down year-on-year. This was due to weather conditions and a much higher temperatures in the second quarter versus the previous year. And obviously, it had an impact on our retail performance in terms of Gas sales. We mentioned lower prices of gas and lower revenue from sales of gas under our contracts. You saw a slide where we discussed the macroeconomic conditions, the spread between the cost of gas production and sales of gas will become narrower and it will stabilize in the periods to come. Let me now move on to an additional section of facts and figures, that is the outlook prospects for the remaining months of the year. We assume that the trends in our macro environment will support the rebound in the region. Revised our expectations for gas prices from PLN 150 to PLN 160 per megawatt hour. In the second quarter -- in the second half of the year, we expect more solid results, as we said before, mainly due to the lack of the windfall, gas windfall charge. This will not be visible in the Upstream segment anymore in the second half of the year, which means that it will contribute -- Upstream segment will contribute more to our business. We expect a stable situation in our Petchem and Refining and in the Retail business, but we also expect more challenges in the Refining business. We expect that the margins will remain healthy at around USD 12 per barrel. But it will be lower than a year before, and it will continue to go down. The seasonality we have already mentioned, when we discussed the Energy segment, it will impact our expectations for the Energy segment and the Gas segment. However, we compared our expectations to the consensus, the political consensus. We have just published -- yesterday, we have published this information on the consensus and the expectations of the brokerage houses and I do believe that we can say that compared to the expectations of the analysts -- market analysts, we are quite comfortable. Of course, we have to bear in mind and we have to keep in the back of our heads, the seasonality, the macro effects, but the macro trends in general are free obvious for us for the quarters to come. So we are on the safe side here in terms of our comparison of our expectations with the consensus of the market analysts. That will be all from my side. Thank you very much for listening. And I'll give the floor over now back to Ireneusz Fafara to give us a more bird view image of what we expect in the quarters to come.

Thank you very much, Magdalena. I do hope that you do understand our situation now a little bit better. I'd like to discuss what's going on now in the company in general and what our assumptions are for the nearest future by the end of the year. In August, we have already mentioned that we have increased our renewable energy resources of the portfolio. We signed contracts with APE, we have Norwegian, [indiscernible] solar PV and wind farms from the company of more than 300 megawatts capacity and we have upscaled our renewable energy resources portfolio. It strengthened our position in the market. But on the other hand, it also had a major economic effects in general for us. Baltic Power project looks on to the project phase a bit ahead of the schedule. In December, we'll move on to the proprietary phase in order to make sure that we can start work offshore. In terms of our SMR project. We keep improving our knowledge, building our knowledge in terms of the technology. We want to look at this project favorably still. However, there is a lot of challenges here. The negotiations with the partner under this project are on the way still. These are not -- those negotiations are not easy. We need to make sure that our relations with the partner are as favorable and smooth as possible. The partner has certain expectations. On the other hand, our company will stand by our position consistently to make sure our assumptions are delivered consistently. And if we arrive at an agreement with a partner, we decided that the first location of SMRs will be -- was to make sure that we support the decarbonization process for our site. We have prepared a complete program for the decarbonization of our heat generation assets, especially focusing on [ Warsaw, ] and specifically focusing on project [indiscernible] We decided to launch the project, [ Skerke, ] we are currently securing environmental permits. The decision -- final decision will be taking in 2025 and the entire process of decarbonization of our assets, gas assets will be combined with innovative projects in this area. So we are keeping our fingers crossed that we will be able to use waste heat resources and our EBITDA will go up by PLN 5 billion in [indiscernible] on the schedule of work for Grudziadz, Ostroleka CCGT project is proceeding as planned. We do not expect any delays here. And the source itself has a temporary stage of our decarbonization process across the group is still our focus. In terms of CCS, the last time we were here, I mentioned that we are looking at the [indiscernible] project. The decision is already there, so to speak, but it also still requires certain arrangements with our partners. So as soon as we have arrived at this decision, we will be ready to communicate it to you. In terms of the specification of crude oil supplies, we have signed agreements with our Norwegian partners, those negotiations were very quick, fast track and very successful. We're talking about crude oil supplies from Norwegian sources, original fields. Logistically speaking, Norway is close to us, but what's most important is the fact that the crude oil we're talking about meets our technological requirements. So it will be efficiently used by us. In terms of Upstream, we're working on the energy upstream, it might not come across as a major news, but we launched a process that was kind of neglected in the company to tap into the synergies. So far, we have operated as a group of different companies with different procedures, different cultures, different methods of operations. And the fact that we'll be able to consolidate them finally and tap into the synergy effect in terms of both costs and revenue, it will have a major impact on our business, on our performance this year and in the years to come and something that we always focus on and you too as well the sponsoring policy. We will plan to spend PLN 700 million on the sponsoring activities. The decision was taken in the first half of the year already. So the margin for change for us is -- it's pretty tight. We have taken a number of decisions, but we need to remember that they are -- these are multi-annual agreements, and they are not easy to change. We do hope that we will have some savings. But at the same time, we deliver -- we prepared a new sponsoring policy. We still want to be a major company that supports Polish culture and Polish sports as well as local initiatives wherever we operate in our home markets. However, we want to make sure that whatever we do in terms of our sponsoring activities, it needs to be compatible with our business objectives and our business in general. We do not want to focus on anything that does not contribute to our business objectives such as the financing of -- for instance, certain charge related objectives on projects. These are good. In general, these are positive, but they do not contribute to our business. Moving on to what's really important, the olefin projects, it's about PLN 8.3 billion, PLN 13.5 billion, PLN 25 billion. These were the numbers that have been dropped throughout those years. As the amounts that were in the plans in terms of the delivery of our olefin 3 project. When the decision was taken in 2018, the decision was that it will be broken down into three investments, representing PLN 8.3 billion in total to be wrapped up by 2021. In 2021, it was increased by the previous management Board up to PLN 13.5 billion and then up to PLN 25 billion. And the investment was to be closed by 2027. Until now, the project already cost us PLN 12 billion. And at the same time, what's important as well in 2023, it was announced that this project will have lower efficiency by 1/3. Euphemistically speaking, the project is ill prepared. We treat this project as a trap for set up for ORLEN in general for the new management board, but also for the Polish economy in general. PLN 25 billion is the cap value for PGNiG when it was taken over by ORLEN, the market capitalization, PLN 25 billion is an amount that would allow us to build renewable energy resources projects with the capacity of the gigawatts or the building of offshore projects, with the capacity of 1.5 gigawatts of energy. So the management board has to take a major decision what to do with this project. As I said, it's an ill prepared project for the company and for the Polish economy in general. It needs a decision to be taken there. So we wanted to take that decision as quickly as possible, and we will take it as quickly as possible. And the reality is that we have to operate in. We have another adviser who is supposed to help us with the decision within the next 4 or 6 weeks. We can either stop this project, bearing in mind that we have already spent PLN 12 billion on the project. And in that situation, we will have additional spending. For instance, related to the rearrangement of the sites and the cleanup of the site and the payment of potential compensation or penalties to the general contractors in general or we can optimize the project. And by building the synergies between what we have and what we plan to complete, and thirdly, we can continue the project as before considering that we have -- ORLEN has announced the doubling of the CapEx on this project. We need to take that decision as soon as possible before we adopt a new general strategy for the entire group, which is supposed to be announced in December of this year. So as you can see, the responsibility of us as a management board here is great. When we're talking about the past, we emphasize once again the lack of competences of the people who are behind this decision makes us treat this particular project as a trap, a trap to ORLEN, a trap to the new management board, and we have to take a decision about the future of this project. Irrespective of the Olefin 3 projects, we need to focus on our strategy in general. We need to focus on the core business, the multi-utility business that ORLEN is Upstream, Downstream, Energy, Gas, and production of gas and energy as well as the supply. Secondly, a well-optimized CapEx. I said before and I'll say it again, that considering the way that CapEx was managed before, we will see some CapEx savings already this year. And we would like to maintain this approach, approach that will focus on optimize rational CapEx in the future. We believe that the CapEx plan, we prepare and we will present in a strategy will be just that will be -- it will be optimized. The proposals of any new M&A acquisitions. We'll be focusing on our core business. We do not need bad investments. We do not need unnecessary investments that do not contribute to our main business goals. We have mentioned that before post CapEx grew or the Media House, [indiscernible] we don't need those. And they present certain challenges and problems, both for the -- and there is operations and financials. And the spending here are millions of -- hundreds of millions in PLN. And the same goes for the losses. We do not need to do everything by ourselves. Company such as ours share split risks, both in terms of our minority business, and majority operations. We have discussed it with a number of partners. We are ready to work with them as a minority owner and tap into those synergies. We will not forget about the investments that were kind of neglective in the recent years. We want to focus our business on a rational and solid operations. In December already, we want to announce a concept for decarbonization competition of our -- for the assets -- for our assets. And we do believe that it will be a good starting point for us to create an innovation-based business. Moving on to a more specific -- the more specific activities. We are producing certain volumes in terms of our Upstream business. We want to revise those volumes and focus on those that are most important to us. Poland will remain a major element of this process. I do believe that we'll be ready to discuss it in more detail as soon as possible. We are creating Polska Upstream. We want to make sure that we will be ready to use our unique expertise in that market. In terms of Downstream, we are a major player here. We're talking about major volumes here. But we want to increase or upscale our business here. And we're talking about alternative fuels, biofuels and electronic. We want to decarbonize our refining assets also with external partners with access to the state-of-the-art technologies and the Petchem business, irrespective of what we have already said about the Olefin 3 projects. We are strengthening our presence in polymers. We want to focus on recycling, both mechanical and chemical recycling. In the Energy business, we have already discussed this. First of all, we'll focus on renewable and resources markets, We will focus on that market, especially now with the launch of the Baltic Power project execution phase, we will be considering our new locations in the Baltic Sea. The Gas segment, as I said before, Warsaw is our next target. We keep faith in SMR technology. But as I said before, the relations with the partners are a challenge, and they are really important. Energy itself in general, it remains an important element of our group -- of our structure. We want to tap into the competencies in terms of distribution and also onshore projects in general in order to make sure that we develop our -- and build our companies here. Retail. Retail is a great opportunity for us, irrespective of the knowledge and the expertise and the technologies in our network in seven countries. We want to combine it all into a certain multi-energy offering and the fact that we have certain opportunities to offer both energy and gas to our retail partners. I do believe that it will translate into tangible success here. But we need to answer here is the question, who we want to be as ORLEN? What do we want to focus on as a company, as a group? And this is why we focus so much on the strategy, because we believe that our main goal is to serve our shareholders, but on the other hand, we also have a major social role here to play and a major economic role here to play, because we are responsible for energy security in the country. So combining our economic goals and our strategic goals and the agenda here will be the main element that will shape our strategy. And the way we will present that strategy to you, the way we present ourselves as ORLEN in the future. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much for the presentation. My name is, by the way, [indiscernible], and I'm the Director of the Investor Relations office. We'll now move on to the Q&A session. [Operator Instructions]

I have two questions. First of all, to get this project to be auctioned and this year's capacity auction. Do we have that decision only? And the second question, what will be the reduction of the consumption of coal in this group after [indiscernible] is launched. We have [ Grudziadz ] for the gas. So a question about the reduction of coal consumption. So the question, in general, is about the relationship with your Saudi partners, Saudi Arabian partner, the previous management Board mentioned additional investments in the future. Do you have any outlook for the cooperation with Saudi Aramco in the future?

In terms of the auction, as far as I know, we do not have any plans for the auction about the reduction in coal consumption. Do you got all have any information on that?

We have declared the phasing out by 2035. In terms of your second question, today, 2 weeks ago, I actually met the CEO of Aramco. We have a short but very fruitful meeting, before our meeting at Saudi Aramco planned for September. We agree that we will address outline the field of our cooperation in Poland and Europe, I do believe that they are not that interested in it, but as far this is all I can say actually. The most important thing is that we launched and in negotiations, and they will be continued in the nearest future.

[indiscernible] So the decision on Olefins 3 project will be taken by December. What will happen in the meantime on the construction side or the construction process is still underway?

Great questions. In terms of write-downs, when for charge gas charge, when the regulations were adopted the legislators, the legal office of [indiscernible] of the Polish parliament decided that those regulations are not consistent.

Have you considered appealing against these laws that's happened all around the world? A company can appeal against regulatory this. So have you ever considered that particular action -- it's obviously not valid anymore, but just a question. Secondly, do you consider -- or do you see any interest on the other hand -- on the side in terms of the cooperation with Saudi Aramco and more specifically with SABIC, in terms of the area of the petrochemical business. It has been brought up before. We don't know whether you discussed it during that meeting that you've mentioned. And is the third thing, do you have any deadline for wrapping up the negotiations with -- as far as I understand, [indiscernible] company in the area of SMRs.

Coming back to your first question I do not know, honestly speaking, it was those decisions were taken before we actually became the Management Board of the company. But as you mentioned, as far as we know, there were no attempts to appeal against those regulations as far as we know. In terms of our cooperation with Saudi Aramco and the Petchem business, yes, we have rolled it up during the meeting. We said that it's an interesting area to be discussed, but maybe there was something that was missing in my discussion of the Olefins 3 project. We need to take a bird eye view throughout the past 20 years in Europe, we have not had any such Petchem projects for an obvious reason. Energy in Europe is too expensive to build such petchem projects, which will deliver those products at a certain profit margin at a solid profit margin. So from this perspective, we need to remember that Aramco actually proposed optic operation in their own markets. This is still valid even after 2 years, but we will discuss it. And that's it. And the third question, the deadline in the SMR project. Our ambition is to wrap it up by the end of September.

[indiscernible] By the way, we have been celebrating 25 years anniversary this year. I have two questions. First of all, sponsoring policy and the way you will rebound your sponsoring policy. This all sounds very optimistic and I do hope that when you develop a new sponsoring policy, you will be working with specialists or experts regardless of whether or not they will be compatible with your business objectives.

We are talking about in the advertising agencies and the international advertising association. They are the people with a lot of experience in the decades of experience. So I would recommend that you work with those experts. The second question is the innovation, whether you will support startups in the future as well or maybe you will focus on the building of the Polish economy in general?

Thank you for those questions. And congratulations to your conversations, because you have been operating for 25 years already. So that's a major anniversary. It's the people who create value in our business. So it is the people in any area, be it production, be it energy, be it finance, be it whatever. In any field, including sponsoring are the priority for us, and we always take care of their competencies. We will focus on that in the future as well. We want to make sure that there are people there who know the market, who know the market ins and outs, and we will be -- we are sure that we will be proud about the way they work. What we'll focus on is we will focus on the core business. We will invest in startups. We have a special dedicated company. This will not be a major field of activity for us, but we will continue that, because it is important for us to have start-ups and to make sure that there is a mechanism in this country to support [indiscernible] ambitious innovators to make sure that they contribute to the economy in general. But let me stress it once again, we'll focus on our business, core business, Downstream, Upstream, Energy.

[indiscernible] A question to CEO. With reference to the history of the company, the compensation for the [ Druzhba ] crude oil pumped by the Russians to the Polish Transmission System. And in 2019, as far as we remember, ORLEN was also the fixing of that process. The management -- previous management Board did not report any information about the compensation received from the Russian companies. What's your comment on that? And what's the outlook?

I will send you this information by tomorrow at the end of the day. I was not prepared to answer that question, but I will send it over to you.

[indiscernible] Let me go back to what you've already mentioned the regulation. What was the major driver behind the negative net results. What's the main reason?

In a nutshell. Yes, in the second quarter this year, the company reported a negative net result is down PLN 6 billion year-on-year. The main driver or actually the sole driver were the write-downs related to the compensation that we had to account for in terms of the compensation for sensitive gas and electricity customers. So if we look at the numbers, the numbers will tell us the entire story. In the second half of the year, we are talking about a cost of PLN 7.7 billion. Last year, it was PLN 3.4 billion. That is -- the difference is PLN 4 billion, and the compensations that we received, this year, it was PLN 1.4 billion. And last year, it was PLN 4.2 billion. So that's a considerable difference. Higher costs, lower revenue from compensations. So all in all it is the difference. It is the reason, and the main driver. And if we consider additional one-off effects, then we are on the safe side here when we say that the result in this quarter would be definitely higher had it not been for those charges, those additional charges.

[indiscernible] coming back to SMRs. When you answered Mr. [ Kublik's ] question, you said that you wanted to arrive at an agreement by the end of September, but during the presentation, you said that you believe in this so much. Do you have any partners somewhere in the back of your heads, if for instance, those negotiations are not successful. Do you have any other options?

Certain business integrity here needs to be taken into account. We should not look for another partner. We should not look for any other partners before we arrive at a certain agreement. Obviously, if we look at the market, I met at the economic center forum in Geneva, this is a forum that's also dedicated to SMRs. Europe and the world are looking with a favorable eye on those projects. However, we do not -- we are not looking for any new partners here. We do -- here, we do hope that we will be successful in cooperation with the previous partner or the current partner.

I'd like to ask you a question about retail. I have four questions. First of all, the outlook for the market and sales for of the fuel on [indiscernible] stations. You said that you expected solid stable volumes. I'd like to ask you a little bit about in terms of volumes in the fuel and non-fuel offering. Also, I'd like to ask you about the takeovers. We have already taken over a fuel stations in Hungarian MOL and Australia. Do you have any more plans? Or do you really focus on your home markets and the networks that we already have? In terms of rebranding, what's the plan for rebranding? What's the deadline? And when will you move on to the expansion base organically? And the last question. You have already discussed it in detail in one of the interviews, but I would like to ask you about the deadlines as well. When will we expect -- can we expect the closing of those negotiations are moving to -- the selection of partners. And is [ Poczta ] Polska a real partner or a viable partner?

Let me start by mergers and acquisitions and the strategy -- and the current strategy, which still is a point of reference for us. Obviously, it will be revised but it's still a point of reference. And it tells you that the number of sessions that is currently at 3,500. We consider this a final number. Looking at the market situation, we feel and let me stress that we feel that we will not consider any more acquisitions. I use that phrase, we feel, we think, because you have to be agile in the business. You have to be flexible if there is an interesting opportunity for us to expand our business in Austria. And then in that country, we will consider it if the financial indicators, fact and figures show us that -- for instance, connection with our [ Electron Baltic ] project, it will be a good idea. We will consider it. But there is no drive for us to look at it more intently. The rebranding the rebranding question. It is underway, in Hungary and in Slovakia. We are preparing ourselves to rebrand our utilizations in Austria. It is still too early, however, to declare any schedules, any timetables. We have not accounted for this transaction yet. We have just been working on the strategy in the market. So we cannot give you any specific deadlines. But in terms of Austria, however, the rebranding project in Slovakia, in Czech Republic and Hungary is something that we focus on. In terms of the prospects of our business both in the retail, both in terms of fuel and nonfuel offering, we've mentioned our promotional campaign. We look at it pretty optimistically. We have an optimistic approach. Let me drop a bit of confidential input here. The effects of this campaign is -- are more than we expected. So it gives us a lot of optimism. The customers will buy more and more in terms of fuels and other products. In terms of [indiscernible] yes, it is not part of our strategy. We would like to drop it from our portfolio. We would like to know what we do with group by earlier and [ Poczta Polska ] is definitely one of the partners in the process, and this is all I can say at that point.

[indiscernible] I have a question about Polska press. You have mentioned that, you want to sell this part of the business. Are there any changes, do you have any reason here?

Nothing has changed. This is not our core business. We want to sell it. This is a business that brought hundreds of millions of losses to ORLEN contrary to the expectations of the previous management board. We have lost a lot of money. We see a potential. We want to restructure, the company want to recover part of the market and we want to sell it later on. And I do believe that this is something that we have taken on as a responsibility. We see that we have seen good results, and we do hope that we will be able to recover some of that money.

[indiscernible] I have a question on the figure of energy. In the group, there was a decision by court to unknown [indiscernible] decision. We still have, as far as I remember, 10% of shares floating in the market. As the future here in terms of the energy structure, will you have a new invitation coming on or will you stick to the structure that you have? Also a question about the international terminal for your project and won't exceed terminal [indiscernible] There were some news that there would be some delays. And that you would not be able to use that particular port and you'll be forced to use another core in other countries, for instance in Denmark, is that true? And another question, a disagreement with Venture Global. What's the stage of this process? You said that you were quite optimistic in terms of compensation.

Let me start by your last question Venture Global. It's a major problem, not only for us, but for a number of countries around the world, I have discussed this issue with the CEO of Shell and he thinks that we choose to revamp, revise our negotiation process with a partner. We do think that we are right here as a rule. It is a very difficult issue. We're talking about a lot of money here. We know that there is a number of partners that were also the victims, so to speak, by Venture Global. They want to enforce concession using also the political side of the story, I mean, the political forces. So this is something we have not been considering. We are only considering our actions in terms of the court proceedings.

A question about the port [indiscernible] Baltic Power recedes as plant were even ahead of the schedule. The port can have a major delay. So in order to proceed with the project, we decided to move on to the second option. So first of all, we can use that [ Arena ] port in the first part of the investment process. So we will use the Bolton Arena port in the first part of the process.

Any last questions? We're still waiting for the justification of the court, second instance court. It will be a starting point for us, what to do about it in terms of the listing, in terms of the announcement of potentially the buyout of shares -- new issue of the shares before we have a written justification from the court, we cannot take any decisions here. However, Energy, in general, is a major part of our business. Taking into consideration the competencies, the knowledge and the expertise of these people and also the role that it plays in the power system in Poland and in the Polish economy in general and the [indiscernible] region in general. We do not have any decisions yet in terms of what we do in the future. We have considered the delisting option. This is where the court process came from. We'll be waiting for the judgment of the court. And based on that, we will take a decision. However, we will need additional financing in the nearest future. So this is something that we have consideration when we take a look at this company and its future.

One minor thing. What is the stage of the process in terms of your ORLEN Switzerland issue?

Unfortunately, there is no progress in terms of the finances, but there is progress in terms of the legal process. We cooperate with the prosecution. We have forensic business, forensic actions taken, and we hope that the next time we meet, we'll be ready to -- we'll be able to give you more information in terms of the legal side of the story and the actions taken against people who are the perpetrators of this tedious business. About the first question insight, I'd like to come back to Swiss story. And the future of that, do we want to keep that company or will we have trade and fuels. Well, we have three trading companies in Switzerland and then in Munich and in London. The last two are the Windfall Energy, that's a legacy business. In terms of the company you asked for, it will continue to operate, these are the effects of our negotiations or actually consultations with our consulting partners. They say that if we face out of this business, the Swiss business, we would be in a weaker position in relations with our business partners and also the local prosecution office. We have three such companies trading in hydrocarbons around the world. So we want to take a decision to optimize this business, and this is all I can say today.

Two more questions from the audience. First question about audits, how many audits do we have underway? And what's the stage of that process? What's the deadline? And also, do you have any more plans for the audits and for the action taken in the first year of this?

We have 44. You can see that in our screen, I will not read it. We have three notices that we are directed to the prosecutor's office we expect so far, so that's questions throughout SMRs.

You said that [indiscernible] is the preferred location and Cintas wanted another location. So does Cintas know that you will focus on [indiscernible]

As I said before, answering your question. the relations between partner -- business partners should be based on trust even if we have any doubts in terms of our relationships. Even if we have certain disagreements, legal disagreements or maybe not a disagreement, but maybe in the process of negotiations. We want to bear -- we want to proceed within target in terms of relationship with our partners. So we want to know that Cintas knows that we are focusing on the product.

If there are no questions, let us move on to the questions from the webcast viewers. We have a question about the Czech Republic and the events in the Czech Republic. And a very dangerous event in the Czech refinery, a bomb from the Second World War was found. Do you now have any information about that?

Yes, a couple of days ago, we were informed that an explosive from the Second World War was found, 1,500 people were evacuated both the employees as well as the inhabitants of the area. And it seemed that the neutralization and removal of this explosive would be swift and unproblematic. However, it turned out that acetone leaks from that particular bomb, and we needed to put our operations on halt, whether or not it will have certain financial impact, we need to remember that this is still very fresh information. So we do not have any calculations here yet. We know that we need to close down the refinery with a safety area around it, and we'll be monitoring the situations. Our teams cooperate with the local teams in order to understand the impact, understand the effect on our both operations and financials. We can expect that the second half of the month, and we'll see certain problems there, obviously. But then we'll move on to relaunching the operations of the refinery and [indiscernible] The refinery is being phased out as we speak. So the work related to the explosive that was found will take 8 to 9 days before it's designated or neutralized in other ways. And then we'll be ready to relaunch the operations of the refinery. However, this is not a mockup thing. This is not a switch on, switch off. You need to remember that we'll need to have ramp up operations. So we'll take a couple of days.

So start and restart of [indiscernible] do you expected at the beginning of September?

Yes, this is something that we expect now. However, you have to remember that this -- that the situation is dynamic. We try to understand what the coming week will look like operationally for us.

Thank you very much. Thank you for the major turnout here, and thank you for all the questions. We'll now move on to unofficial part of the conference call. And obviously, we invite you all. [Statements in English on this transcript were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call.]