Tern Plc (TERN.L) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Well, good afternoon, and welcome to the Tern Investor Webinar. My name is Tim Metcalfe. I'm Managing Director of IFC Advisory, which is Tern's financial PR and Investor Relations agency. With me tonight, I've got Al Sisto and Ian Ritchie from Tern. And I'm very, very pleased to welcome from Tern's portfolio companies, Device Authority, FundamentalVR and Talking Medicines, Darron Antill, Richard Vincent and Jo Halliday. And we've also got from Vortex IQ, Susant Patro, who is also going to give you a presentation and introduce his business, which will be new to everybody on the call. Really appreciate everybody joining us this evening. Also appreciate all those who've taken the time to attend. Hopefully, you're going to find this as a useful session. This will follow the normal format for those who've joined in the past. We will have presentations from the 4 companies, followed by a Q&A session. Thank you very much to everybody who submitted questions and opinions ahead of time. I'll talk more about those at the end of the presentations. But as always, we do anticipate and please do give us further questions. As I always say, unfortunately, the number of people who attend these, it's not possible to go to everybody asking to unmute and put their questions directly. [Operator Instructions] I would apologize in advance that there are certain areas that we can't stray into such as the financial performance of the investee companies and other forecast information or things that public companies can't debate on a session like this, but we will do our best to answer your questions. So that's the introduction. And without further ado, I'm going to hand over to Richard to talk to you about Fundamental Surgery and FundamentalVR. Richard?

Thanks, Tim. Appreciate that. Hello, everybody. Thank you for Al to invite me to -- for inviting me to come along to share an update on the business. Let me just pull up a slide and make sure that's showing okay. Okay. I think that's running okay. Tim, let me know if that's not presenting correctly, but I hope it looks like it is.

That's fine. Thank you, Richard.

Thanks, Tim. So as I said, my name is Richard Vincent. I'm the CEO and Co-Founder of FundamentalVR. We've been a portfolio company of Tern for some time now and really benefited from the support that the organization has given us. I'm going to give you a little update on the business, as I mentioned, and where we are and how 2024 went. So let me get straight on with that. Button's working. There we go. Okay. So the platform that we've built over the last number of years with FundamentalVR is designed specifically for the med tech and health care industry. And it's a platform that is all about really trying to help move the industry towards what I call prehuman competence. And that is the rehearsal, skills acquisition and training should happen away from humans, whether those are specimens or in terms of cadaveric or whether they are actually live patients, which is where most training happens. They should move away from that and into a digital environment where people build up that competence. And we've been working hard on that for a number of years now. You see the way surgical procedures are taught is slow. It's expensive. It's often dangerous for both the patient and the health care provider. And really by digitizing it, we can help significantly in changing and improving those outcomes and really addressing a very large market that's been -- haven't changed that much in many years. So we're doing our part to really affect that change. You see there's a lot to learn in medicine and particularly in the way that new procedures are being adopted. The rate of development is massive. It's significant. It's changing very fast. Think about things like gene therapy and robotics. The need for health care providers for doctors and nurses to acquire those skills has never been more acute than it is today. So that's what we do. We strive and push the industry towards prehuman competence. Now this image you see here is actually a render from one of our simulations. You can see we can get to hyper-real visualization to help our customers, those health practitioners to really get there and to achieve what we call competency at scale to get to competency faster. We do that using our immersive platform, fundamental surgery, and that's made up of a number of different elements. And for those who've been on these talks before and these updates before, you'll have heard me talk about this platform. It hasn't changed in structure that much, but in content significantly. It's made up really of 3 key modules: standalone VR using just standard off-the-shelf headsets like the Meta Quest you see here and other devices like Apple Vision Pro; HapticVR, where we start to bring in the sense of touch using physical devices. We don't make any of these, but we ingest software into them to deliver this feedback in a sense of weight, resistance, force feedback that allows you to learn the touch, the sense of how it feels to do something right and wrong. And we do that all with a virtual collaborative environment so that we can join together inside an operating room or a cath lab or an EP lab or a training environment without ever actually physically leaving the environment that we're in at that time, whether that's being at home after a long day in the hospital or whether it's inside the department itself. All 3 of those modalities are completely hardware-agnostic. We are purely software. We ingest into those great pieces of hardware that other tech giants are producing. And we integrate all of that into the platform in a way that allows us to get really deep data understanding of performance. And I'll come back to that when we talk a little bit about AI in a moment. But like everybody, we're using AI to understand that performance and to bring things to life. And I'll talk about that in a couple of slides' time. Our platform also had something we call Fundamental Core, which is a set of building blocks so that people can author into our platform and then publish themselves. We're still at the beginning of that journey, but it's an important one. There are so many procedures, so many techniques. But we feel it's important that people can have the building blocks themselves to also build. So whilst our content team delivers cutting-edge high-quality simulation, we also have an authoring system called Fundamental Core that allows others to do just the same. Talking about our go-to-market and the way we access it, we focus very much on the med tech side of the marketplace. So we work with medical device and pharmaceutical companies. In fact, you can see a number of them here. We target the top 30 med tech and pharma businesses, predominantly domiciled in the U.S., all of them multidivisional organizations, billion-dollar businesses, both by revenue and by market cap. Our approach is to enter those businesses to land them and then to expand across those different divisions. And we've had some really good traction over the last couple of years in doing just that with organizations like Johnson & Johnson. We target both vertical and horizontal growth with those customers, vertical growth being adding more capability and more users to their current simulation, horizontal growth being moving across those different divisions. They're moving from ophthalmology to robotics through to general surgery and so on across the different organizations. Most of our customers have been with us more than 2 years. About 85% have been with us more than 2 years, reflecting that long-term relationship. They change their go-to-market as they start to adopt our system. And therefore, we've become quite sticky with them. And all of them have expanded. So back to that land and expand key part, we've managed to expand everybody in these last 12 months, which we are really pleased about. For our customers, for those med tech businesses, we are really this an acceleration multiplier for their biggest challenge. And it's a universal challenge across the entire industry, as I've already touched on. It's that idea of how do you get people to competency fast, how do you get them to the point where they can use safely your drug, your product, your device in a way that means that they can use it with patients and therefore, from a med tech standpoint, consume those products. We digitize that element. We virtualize it, and we help our customers to get there faster. We become an acceleration multiplier for them by digitizing and virtualizing that capability. And we do that across multiple procedural areas. There's no part of the medical industry that we can't service. We focus very much on the surgical areas. But in that, all of those disciplines, whether it's big movements in orthopedics or whether it's micro movements in ophthalmology or neurosurgery or heart surgery, we're able to train and deliver competency at scale for all of those different elements for all of our customers. And you can see some examples of that in action here, well, maybe not in action, but certain stills from that here, showing you some of the diversity of the things that we're doing ranging from -- on the left-hand side, you can see an example from a cath lab. Again, these are all simulations from a cath lab where we're helping with something called IVUS, which is mapping the internal structures of an artery to find defects and then help with the repair through to EP mapping of a heart through to ophthalmology into gene therapy. Down the bottom of this set of images, you can see a small baby. We work with the American Academy of Ophthalmology on the training of something called ROP, which is a degenerative disease inside the eye, particularly hitting premature babies, almost impossible to teach away from simulation. And so we've been able to put it into our platform and roll it out across the world. Teaching trainees to really get there faster, teaching experienced surgeons new techniques. And not just in the first world, in developing nations too. You may have seen some of our showcases through Meta over the last year or so. The image on the top right of this slide shows you an image of a lady, a trainee in Bangladesh with all those learning a cataract procedure. And all of it, as I mentioned, hardware agnostic. So whether it's the Meta Quest, the new Quest 3 and 3S or whether it's with Apple Vision Pro, whether it's haptic devices like the ones you see here, we don't make any of those. We ingest our software into them. Our IP travels really efficiently through those different devices, is able to really bring them to life in a way that's not possible outside our platform, whether that is the visual side or whether that's the haptic side. Looking at 2024, we're pleased with where we've ended in 2024. The market has been difficult, mainly driven by macro market conditions. Share price suppression and restructuring in a lot of our customers has not helped us, but we've been able to see good growth in spite of that, particularly in the areas where we focus, which is in that specialist surgical suite in those new innovation areas like gene therapy and robotics. We've seen our revenue grow really well. It's up about 20% this year. We've seen our recurring revenue as a percentage of our overall revenue increase again. We've seen a margin increase as we've got more efficient in standing up these different products for our customers. We are seeing good, strong growth across our customers. As I said, all of them have expanded. We've seen really good strategic alliances develop with people like Apple and Meta and Logitech as well as those device companies and those customers like J&J and Abiomed. And we've seen really strong tech development on our platform around things like hand tracking, removing controllers from the experience and just using your hands to interact around our haptic innovation, which is our core IP around things like Apple Vision Pro and, of course, around AI. So to summarize, 2024 has been hard but successful. And we are really pleased with the growth that we've achieved during that period, and we look forward to a good growth year in 2025. Just to touch on the AI part for one second. Like any business, we're using AI now in ways that we haven't imagined probably 3 years ago for knowledge, for expertise and for guidance. We've been able to use it to help to understand performance through telemetry of movements of hands, eyes, legs and head. And as a result, we can predict outcomes on to our platform in a way that simply hasn't been possible before. We've also been able to manifest it into 3D virtual tutors. They're able to ingest all of the content, published content around a particular procedure or device and then deliver that back to the trainee inside the virtual environment. So let me show you an example of that in action as a way of closing this off. [Presentation]

So a very simple but important voice to text and then translation and interpretation and replay back, all within very controlled LLMs that allow us to make sure we don't stray away from truth when we're talking with our users inside these spaces and lots of other stuff coming in that area. So immersive technology really in the medical industry is proven now. It's proven by validation. It's proven by customer experience and use cases. 2025 for us will continue to execute on our strategy of really pursuing that med tech space those medical device and pharma companies. And we're seeing that market use cases growing in a really satisfying way having got over the hiatus of a couple of years ago. And we'll continue to leverage the opportunities that AI, et cetera, bring to us to make that platform work even more effectively. Thanks for your attention. I'll hand back to Tim.

Well, thank you very much, Richard. Fascinating as always. Darron, we'll hand over to you.

Okay. Do you hear me?

Yes, I can, indeed.

Just sharing now, screen show. All good?

All good. Thank you.

Fantastic. Okay. Thank you, Richard. And I pass on my congratulations on a good year, and welcome, everybody, and I'm looking forward to giving you an update on the Device Authority business. And I guess just to pick up, and I'm delighted that Tern's invited us again. I've been -- Tern has been with Device Authority since its inception with creation, and we created the company together several years ago. So thank you very much for your support thus far. Okay. So let me just jump in. One of the things I wanted to do, I guess, right out of the gate was really talk about the relevance question in the market we operate in. Is Device Authority, what we do, still very relevant? And absolutely and you bet we are. When you look at some of the new logos we've won last year, but also some of the expansion of some of the key clients as they now gear up to have mass scale in production. And I'll talk about that as we go through. But I wanted to just touch on, I guess, some of the shifts and the changes in the market because you should consider us very much in the identities market space. And people have talked about how do you manage human identities and even machine identities. And there's been a lot of market momentum in that space over the last couple of years. So you see organizations like Okta and CyberArk, all have been very successful in that space. But what people are now looking at and the real significant growth vector is nonhuman identities of unmanaged devices, those devices outside of the network. And more and more people, especially those human identity-based companies are talking about that and I guess talking up in terms of a market. And that's becoming very important, especially as the ecosystem plays out, which I'll touch on a bit more. So if you look at, I guess, the size of the market, you go from human to machine to the device side market. We're on the right-hand side, which is the big growth area. And even when you talk to some of our customers, some of them have 500 or 1,000 devices connected today in production. And they have business plans and business models that they're going to roll out up to 1 million over several years. So that effectively is the type of growth from those sort of digital transformation. Connecting those devices is what drives that huge number on the right-hand side. So it's a big market. People are clearly getting very interested in it and think of it really as the next segment of the identities market. So I just wanted to touch on, I guess, some of the challenges. And again, a macro level because I think this is really important. And it plays directly into where we operate and touches on the relevance point. The first thing is this whole cyber-crime market is now the third largest economy in the world, so behind the USA and China is significant. The amount of spend is getting out of control, is tripled in recent times. And I guess even at a national or international level where people were talking about nuclear summits and other various things, now you see headlining in the press cyber attacks, cyber warfare, cyber threats and the impact not only of those on companies, but also on nations. And the data is absolutely backing that up. And I just wanted to touch on it because you talk about, I guess, the people factor because we very much really operate, but how do we replace human activity, managing the identities at scale for all of those devices. And when you look at the challenge people have on the people side, most hackers don't actually break in. They just log in because identities aren't managed properly. And if that happens on devices, imagine the scenarios when devices are in the wild of the magnitude of numbers that I spoke about, how are you going to manage that problem, but more importantly, the impact it can have in your business. So people are starting to care about and worry about it. And it's not really so much about being able to lock down the data. It's about trusting the -- sorry, the device. It's about trusting the device so that you can manage and use the data securely from those devices. And I think that's very, very important. And then, again, at macro level, the speed and the scale is huge. Just look at the number of threat actors that now Microsoft is tracking. And these are now impacting nation states as well as significant ransomware groups. And I really like the bottom slide, and I'll just put it because I think this sort of sums up the market, but also the opportunity. If you go back a few years, that sort of market sector view at the bottom of the cyberscape, let's call it, had about 1,500 companies and had less categories in the whole cyber world. And most end customers were buying somewhere in the region of 45 to 50 technologies. In fact, Al and I went to meet the people who actually create this. And in a number of years, how that's moved on, there's now over 2,500 companies. And it's a complex world and it's absolutely an ecosystem play. And most companies are now buying 80 or so technologies that they need to stitch together to be able to protect their organizations. So let me bring that down to the bit that we talk about. And I talked about the ecosystem. We're absolutely focused on the right-hand side. And this is how you should think about it. I just want to build this slide out. So when you talk about the ecosystem, we built and you've seen announcements of new partnerships such as CyberArk. And CyberArk is becoming very significant and strategic to us in terms of how we go forward. We've been -- we're actually working with CyberArk or working towards a partnership that we announced as a business a few months ago. And actually on the day that we met their senior team at their company event to announce that, they announced they were acquiring Venafi, which from our perspective and now theirs, as everyone understands the true end-to-end value, that's great news. And so -- and this is a great example where somebody on the left of that spectrum I showed before look at the different identity groups and how do you manage that across your organization. And where we focus is on the things, the unmanaged devices typically outside the corporate network, where people are looking to deploy at scale without any human intervention. And as some of you know, and if you go back a couple of years ago, again, closely working with Tern with myself, we actually closely work with Venafi and not just as a technology partner in terms of being able to develop over-the-air solutions, et cetera, with Venafi, but also they invested in the company. So now actually, CyberArk is also an investor and is on our cap table in the company. But they have 8,000 customers. Venafi has 2,000. And it's really important as people are looking to see how the identity is challenged and how you manage that across that spectrum to include these devices or these things. And we're an industry leader for that. And we get great recognition from that, not just from them, but also the analysts that we both interact with. So if you boil that down, it really comes down to 3 categories. And we are very much, again, just to bring back to what we do is focusing on the right. And in the last 12 months, I mean, Richard talks about it's been a challenging year. I think there are market conditions that work against you. One of them is actually some of the market consolidation of some of the big players. But customers are having to figure this out. And we've continued to work in the verticals on the right-hand side where we've landed new medical, new industrial manufacturing and automotive. Those are still really the 3 primary sectors. And what is good is organizations that we started to deal with last year or some even a year before have gone through their sort of POC pilot and now they're into production. And now we're starting to talk to other divisions within those companies that they're looking to scale. And that's all back to that chart I showed you before. They need to try and consolidate on the number of vendors they're working with as they're looking to scale and manage the security around the transformations. So it's complex on the right. But the good news, and I think it's interesting, we attended and we've always been a member of the IoT Software Foundation since its foundation several years ago. And that's a really now good global forum or initiative driven from the U.K. We've been a founding member. But just to add, compliance now is absolutely and global regulations is absolutely on the agenda of most companies. More and more, you've got OT compliance, IoT compliance and very much the convergence of those things. And NIST is playing a bigger role. So I say this because it isn't just about what, I guess, the market says. It's actually now what the governments are trying to drive people to do because people need to start taking more notice of it. And best practices is one thing, but real guidance that then becomes law is very compelling. And when you talk to medical customers, it's absolutely important to them. And you hear more and more of that now in industrial and manufacturing. You're hearing about these 2 directives. In the financial world you hear about DORA. So each vertical has its specific compliance and regulatory bodies that are driving the agenda. But coming back to the business, and again, why it's important, where customers really buy into us because people often ask about the landscape and our competitors and PKI or managing certificates is important. But other people do that. That is often -- that's the simplest thing to do for a small number of devices. But it's very complex when you have a large number of devices. And you need a software solution, which is what we are, all software. We're agnostic, as Richard mentioned in his presentation. We can work with any device, with any application, with any specific authority. But the point is it's not just about deploying search. That's just one example of credential. It's -- people really care about trusting the device and being able to use the data, especially with the AI umbrella that is also driving the need and use of data for differentiation or new markets. But also our platform is very interoperable. We've invested heavily to make sure it works and interoperate with those any device and those any applications and those any other security vendors such as CyberArk. And then we have a software integration to their PAM solution, so we can take care of the IoT use cases for their customers. We work very closely with Entrust and some of the examples I'll talk about later is very -- again, it's working closer to Entrust and winning clients. Because you don't win alone, you win together working with market leaders to solve some of the challenges. And most customers are touching on a number of these hexagons or, in some cases, all of them. And when they're in play, those customers become very important. And we can become very sticky, and we are absolutely solving the problems across the board for them. So I talk about ecosystems. And I guess some of you have seen this slide -- well, I say this slide, you've seen the announcement, I think, and some of the press has been talking about it. But one of the things I just wanted to mention -- and actually, it is public information now. So my apologies. I don't have that slide, slipped in this version. But one of the things -- this is a Microsoft reference architecture. They're announcing, I think it's 6 focusing specifically in the automotive market, which is a big play for us. And we are one of the key security vendors to help deliver those architectures. And it's really important for us, working with Microsoft. Again, they have access to huge customers. And what's really good about this is we're working closely with CyberArk, that we pulled them into that solution. So our coupled solution is very important to the Microsoft reference architecture. And we need that to help drive our elevation of our opportunities in the market. So more of that to come. The reference architecture is not published. But the news is being talked about, and you'll see it published. And we'll make the most of that as it comes out. But I just wanted to share that as a most recent new example in the last week. The other thing is building on partnerships in the company. We've talked about defense as an evolving sector, and that continues to be so. Whilst there's been a lot of government changing -- or there is a government change in the U.S., we just wait for grant funding and that to filter through. But there's a number of important identity-based projects where VIPC and some of the respective organizations they're working with that are funded by the Department of Homeland Security and science and technology. And we are fundamentally a key part of that. And that continues to evolve. So that's expanding into some of the Air Force initiatives, some of the drone initiatives, et cetera. So again, this is an exciting partnership. But I think that highlights the importance again of working in an ecosystem. And just to build out a bit more, I guess, some of the new partnerships, and I think were worthy of note. And I'll just pick on 2 here. I mean Carahsoft is very much closely aligned with CyberArk but Accenture and Avanade is a really interesting opportunity. They have -- and we have won some energy opportunities where they've got excellent relationships with the customers, driving big transformations of where we have been brought in as a security partner. And now they're looking to standardize on an application platform that they're looking to deploy to their other clients, of which they asked us to be the security partner working with [indiscernible]. So again, a great example of having access to the right people around the right table in large companies and how you need to integrate and work with these people. So again, we're looking forward to that being a backbone of one of our growth pillars in the coming years. And then the other area is MSPs and managed service providers and managed security providers. So people who typically have some form of security operations, so a SOC or a NOC as people have heard, who are dealing with cyber security services on an ongoing basis, very much in the sort of mid national market. And as IoT or managing IoT identities is becoming more important, we've now had early discussions and discovery conversations with a number of MSPs. And this is going to be a new go-to-market initiative for us as we're investing specifically in that area. And I'll just touch on that in a bit more in terms of the discovery tool if you just give me a second. But the point I wanted to mention also was in terms of customer growth and one -- we -- this is just a quick view of an internal dashboard from a week or so ago. And at the end of the day, we're managing identities around devices. So we have customers who are constantly connecting and testing. Some people like to test their identities more than others based on their security policy or effectively what they're looking to do in terms of their market, their market position and how they want to work with their customers. But the point I'm trying to show here, this is all to do with our cloud service, KSaaS. And it highlights -- we invested in this 18 months, 2 years ago when we brought it out, invested in it before. It's to drive customers to a cloud base to make it easy to use, easier to adopt, easy to get up and running. And this is very rapidly becoming the sort of go-to initial platform that we move customers to initially. And you can see it's growing and scaling into an enterprise-class ready system. And then I touched on the discovery tool. So one of the things in the past, I guess, we've helped people protect and help deploy their zero trust platform. But one of the things we've learned along the way, we need to help people, especially as people are looking to understand more, how do we help them discover the potential challenges they've got of these unmanaged devices in their environment. And that's one of the big topics of conversation. People need help. So we're bringing out a discovery tool that will enable people and help educate them, help elevate the agenda and hopefully drive more ambition to solve some of these challenges. And here is just a quick example of the type of risk order and a dashboard and this will show customers. And then they'll get a report that effectively aligns to the problems we can help solve with KeyScaler or KSaaS our cloud servers, as I showed you a second ago. And so this is going to become an important initiative and effectively kicking off as we speak. So I just wanted to share that news. So I just want to, I guess, to wrap up, talk about a couple of examples. And I think it always brings it down to reality in terms of some of the customers. And I think I heard Richard talk about this customer has been with us now 3 years. They've now injected over 2 million identities into their products, and they are putting security, which we're a key part of their manufacturing process, into their products that they're then selling through the supply chain into Tier 1 automotive OEMs. Very important client. In fact, I'm going to see them next Tuesday with some of my team in Boston. They continue to grow. We become more strategic to them. Again, ecosystem is very important here. We work very closely with Entrust. In fact, Entrust and Device Authority continue to keep -- and we beat Gemalto and Thales several years ago, and we keep them at bay. So integrating with their PKI and the HSM investments is important. That might be security technology, but think of it as investment protection for their own key management solutions. So this continues to be an important client, and we're looking to leverage that more. And then this is another client that actually -- I think this is very interesting in terms of the complexity around this where this client is looking to, yes, be more efficient in how it deals with its distribution and supply and now has a security agenda that it needs to take care of in terms of its engines that end up in industrial generators or diesel trucks, et cetera. So that's a really important business initiative. There's a necessity to be secure, there's a necessity to trust and information, but there's also a necessity to ensure that they can do this through the life cycle of those devices without having the expensive recalls of those devices that could end up in some -- on a rig or in some industrial manufacturing center, which would be clearly very expensive are unmanageable. And so these type of opportunities again scale, and now we're looking to build other divisions from the initial division that we work. So again, it's an important -- so this is a great example, as was the previous one of land and expand. And sometimes, land is POC pilot, get that referenceability, you get to production and then you expand. And when you expand in the environments we're talking about, it's significant in terms of number of devices, as I showed you in the market data. So I guess to wrap up, last year, we were able to acquire some new logos, which is great, which sets us in terms of building and scaling again for this year. We continue to look at acquiring new logos. It's very important. The 3 primary sectors I touched, medical, industrial, automotive and defense and government is evolving. Expansion is a key part of our strategy. Moving from several hundreds and thousands to many thousands of devices, it's very important. And once you're in, that's really important in terms of underpinning our growth. And I guess finally, CyberArk and Microsoft. They have significant customers. They play at the C-suite and the C-level. We've invested heavily in our integrations and our go-to-market partnerships. And I'm delighted that CyberArk acquiring Venafi, completing that sort of vision story for the identity spectrum. They've got lots of customers. We're highly regarded, and we really look for them as a key partner this year in terms of driving new acquisition growth. So on that point, I will pass back to you.

Thank you very much, Darron. Much appreciated. Susant, I believe you're next on the agenda.

Perfect. Thank you. I'd just share my video first. Thank you. And Tim, my screen as well. Can you see my screen?

Yes, it's perfect. Thank you.

Perfect. Thank you. Thanks a lot, Al, for this opportunity to present today. And just one second. Yes. So Vortex IQ is the AI-powered platform that's transforming e-commerce with our intelligent AI agents. And this journey is about bringing the gap between data and actions or bridging this gap between the data and actions that has to be taken. And it helps in empowering the businesses to optimize the operations to be more efficient with the use of our AI agents and also our framework. So here is what we will cover today. First, we will start with the vision for the future of e-commerce. And then we will look at the problems that we are solving and obviously, the market opportunity. And I will then talk briefly about how we plan to capture this opportunity with our go-to-market strategy and how Vortex IQ stands out of the competition. And we will also very quickly touch upon our great relationship with the investors we have. So starting out, the vision of the company at its heart is about empowering merchants to optimize e-commerce businesses effortlessly. And this vision comes to life through AI agents that the businesses cannot live without, making optimization seamless, faster and very effective. Generally, we have seen across the board that e-commerce businesses have too much information, but they struggle to use this information to take actions effectively. And this poses a big challenge for the businesses at large. And they lose a ton of money because they cannot use this information fast enough to deploy the changes that are required to make improvements in their sales and also to drive efficiency. And we have conducted surveys and found that 98% of businesses suffer from these implementation delays. And insights takes weeks and months to implement. And by the time they implement, the opportunity, in many cases, are already gone or diminished. And the second thing that we have noticed is that there is a lot of information overload. And businesses are overwhelmed with data and analytics from disconnected systems across CRM systems, Google Analytics, Power BI and their own NetSuite systems, ERP systems, leading to analysis paralysis. And then these conditions are spread across multiple departments within the same organization. And sometimes, there also the implementation requires them to depend on agencies, which may not be within the same organization, but spread across SEO agency, the design agency, the web optimization agency, the DevOps teams. So that's the reason why it becomes so hard to implement the changes. And finally, all of these lead to missed revenue opportunities and slow optimization directly impacts sales and their competitiveness. The cumulative effect of these challenges is significant because of this insight to action gap, costing businesses millions every year. Now let us look at 3 examples of what happens when these kind of inefficiencies exist in a business. So when you are not able to make changes on our website, it leads to slower website. And you can see that there are -- there has been a lot of research, which leads to suggest that 53% of mobile users would abandon a website if it takes more than 3 seconds to load. And similarly, a 1-second delay on a website load can reduce 7% conversion. And similarly, about 79% of customers who have poor experience using the website will not go back to the website forever, which leads to long-term losses. So these are the key pain points that we address through our Vortex IQ Agentic Framework as a solution. But despite all of these challenges, the opportunity is immense. The global AI and automation market is valued at $310 billion. And the e-comm automation market alone represents $9.4 billion in terms of the total addressable market with a serviceable obtainable market of about $6 billion. And this is just the beginning as the market continues to grow at close to 40% year-on-year. And this is for the adoption of automation in e-commerce. And the serviceable obtainable market for Vortex IQ is 120 million with additional opportunities also from backup as well as AI agentic marketplace. Because once we release these AI agents for all of our merchants, we would make it available as a marketplace for other people to also add their own agents, which is the merchants can do. The web developers, partners can deploy their own AI agents through our infrastructure for other users, other merchants to use them as well. In general, business -- this is a general graph, which shows how business declines over a period of time with no innovation taking place. And at the center of it, when we look at AI agents before the business declines for a period of time, we -- whenever we change through innovation or through IT and technology, it can transform the business and lead the entire operations to scale again more effectively. And we have seen that -- when ATM was introduced, for example, getting money out of the bank was way more easier than waiting for the cashiers. And that is how technology has been able to make banking service available 24/7. And similarly, now AI agents are the next big thing that will help businesses to do the work automatically, saving them time and making everything run more smoothly than ever before. And we have seen this time and again in the e-commerce industry as well. So this is not the first time when technology has had an impact on the e-commerce as a whole. In the last 20 years or so, we have seen that in the mid-'90s, when custom e-commerce platform began, that's when the e-commerce started, there were fewer than 100,000 websites because it was very time consuming and very costly to build these websites. And by 2000, when open source platform like [indiscernible] came in, the number jumped from 100,000 to 200,000 to 300,000. And then by 2008 when Magento came up with automated website launch with 3 tier architecture, and then the scale of business grew to 500,000 websites with much greater flexibility and scalability. And then in 2010, each time a technology improvement has happened, there has been a significant spike. And that's where the inflection points have happened in the past many times over. And with Shopify introducing a low-code, no-code interface to be able to click and launch a website with zero technical knowledge, obviously, they were able to hit 1 million websites. And now in 2024, 2025, the AI agentic workflow will represent the next leap forward to transform all of these 20 million websites that has been built over the last 20 years in 2025 and beyond, obviously. This evolution is driven by the need to reduce manual processes, streamline operations and capitalize on exponential market growth. And over 70% of businesses plan to adopt AI to automate the processes in the next 5 years because they have a need to improve the operations, reduce the cost and also drive sales. And all of these are possible through AI agents. And e-commerce is also expanding rapidly with -- in the next 2 years, by 2027, the forecasted sales is $8 trillion. And there has been a recent survey where it has been found that more than 80% of the businesses are looking to adopt AI and AI agents to improve their efficiency and to remain competitive. And in this growing e-commerce market, businesses have to optimize and keep the costs under control. And they have to come to use platforms like Vortex IQ. And the recent study, like I mentioned a moment back, conducted by Capgemini has showed that 80% of organizations are planning to use AI agents in the next 1 to 3 years. So when it comes to using AI agents, I'll tell a couple of reasons as to why people are so motivated about the AI agents. So to do that, if we have to compare a human's work on an average, typically or traditionally, we humans work about 40 hours a week. And the AI agents tend to make us more effective by about 40% improvement in our efficiency can be achieved. And what's more significant is that the moment you add AI agents to the mix, they are always on and they're always ready. And they operate 168 hours, which is 24 times 7 days in a week. They're always on as compared to 40 hours of a human work week. And this translates to more than 4x more available, ensuring that the tasks are continuously optimized without any downtime. And this obviously leads to not just the 40% improvement in the existing human's work, but also more availability for the automated tools to run and do the manual tasks which humans were doing, leaving humans more time to take more strategic initiative and improve the sales and efficiency of the overall business. So let us take you very quickly through behind the scene how Vortex IQ works. So at the center is our customer-facing website. And we have built a monitoring and insights platform, which is another AI agent, which looks at everything that happens within the website itself. And it identifies good news and bad news through monitoring. And examples are like spike in underperforming pages, triggers, corresponding action as to what has to be done to make it faster. Then the AI agent behind the scene compresses the image, does a release to the staging environment for somebody to test and then deploy it or see that, okay, it is approved, and they can push a button to publish it. So next is this box, which shows all of these different job roles. The AI agents for roles like web designer, UX designer, web developer, SEO specialist takes these proactive actions to resolve the issues as and when they detect throughout the 24 hours and 7 days a week. And all of these are deployed from the staging with data anonymization, data integration. And they are all seamlessly integrated through multiple AI agent network, which is able to detect the issues and solve on its own. Our AI agents are designed to do important jobs in e-commerce. And they help website builders and people who organize products and teams and keep customers happy so that they can do their job more effectively and run the business smoothly. So coming back to our go-to-market strategy, we believe in a partner-led ecosystem because our customer segment are B2B. And instead of trying to build a relationship and convert over a very long period of time, we already are in the process of signing up with partners who already have a huge number of customers. We've already signed a 5-year contract, for example, with BigCommerce, who has 60,000 merchants worldwide, and 6,000 of them are enterprise customers. And that's the way to improve our adoption or drive our adoption at speed. And then the second tier below that is our web agencies. And we are collaborating with 1,000 top web agencies globally to amplify our reach and to scale faster. And then comes the cloud hosting providers like AWS, Google Cloud and Azure. They also play a critical role because that's where the solutions are hosted and deployed from. And in terms of -- I heard the word land and expand quite a few times in the previous presentations. And I think that's the right approach because we are not interested in spending 6 months to 12 or 18 months to sign up with an enterprise customer. It makes sense for us to give them a portion of the solution, like a backup solution or a monitoring solution or a staging solution or just the AI agents. And then once they have seen a portion of the service, we can obviously expand the reach to a much wider portfolio. And that's something which we have tested with some of the large enterprise customers, one of them being Krispy Kreme in U.K. and Ireland, where we gave just a staging solution. And now we are writing new contracts for a large global deployment worldwide for the AI agentic implementation. Coupled with this ecosystem-led growth, we also have planned activities for deployment to drive these sales through our partner relationships. And we clearly have got a defined process for the mid market and then we have the enterprise. Enterprise are the customers who has the potential to spend 10,000 or more. And these are the people who would require specific onboarding flow. They would require us to deploy the solution into their GCP or AWS or Azure cloud systems and hence, the workflow is a bit different. But we are very mindful and that's how we have been able to secure more than 150 enterprise customers to date. In terms of our competitive advantage, it lies in our proprietary custom-trained LLM, which is designed so that other AI agents can work with it to be able to deliver a custom solution for e-commerce marketplace. And we provide unified agentic framework that automates the workflow across the different job roles and from development to optimization. And this has meant that we have built-in capability for automated deployments. And then we have specific custom-trained large language model and then the AI agents. These 3 hand-in-hand is able to deliver a seamless workflow, which is what the customers are looking for. A quick note about our investors, which is Sure Valley Ventures and Techstars. Obviously, Sure Valley Ventures is our -- the investors currently. And our success is strengthened by our partnership with them, and they are a hands-on investor committed to driving innovation. And this relationship has solidified our foundation and positioned us for long-term success in this highly competitive AI and e-commerce space. They are beyond a normal capital-based strategic support, but they are also helping us in refining our approach to navigating this AI and e-commerce space. Obviously, they are specialists in AI, which has helped us immensely. And then unmatched network has opened doors to many partnerships in this space. And additionally, their operational support has helped us to establish key framework and go-to-market strategies and also in scaling infrastructure because they are very good -- they have very good connections with GCP and Microsoft as well. The Sure Valley Ventures shares our commitment in fostering innovation and growth, aligning perfectly with our mission as well. And their mentorship Brian and Barry and the rest of the team, DC and Saurabh all of the key team members have helped us and mentored us through this network and has provided a solid foundation in our journey to become a category leader in this AI-driven e-commerce space. And as we scale, their innovation and involvement will remain agile, obviously, from what we have seen to date. And together, we are building the future of business and looking forward to optimize operational efficiency and sales for all of our customers through our AI agents. And the future of e-commerce belongs to those who adopt these intelligent data agents, and Vortex IQ is leading this transformation. And thank you for your time today.

Well, thank you very much, Susant. We'll now move on to Jo and Talking Medicines. Jo?

Thank you very much. I'll just share my presentation. If you can just tell me whether you can see it? Is that working?

It's working perfectly. Thanks, Jo.

Brilliant. Thank you very much for inviting me to present, to Tim, Al and the Tern team. We work very closely, as you've heard from the other presenters, with Tern. It's a very close relationship and all about building value for Talking Medicines. So over the next 10, 15 minutes, as the last presenter, I'll be really giving you an update since I last presented to give you a sense of what's been happening for us. And it really has been a breakthrough year for us. So delighted to take you through some of the key points of what's been happening. As we've said before and for those who are new, we are all about revolutionizing health care intelligence for pharmaceutical marketing. And we'll come back to that, but driven by advanced data science and AI. And you've just heard a presentation about AI and the buzz and very good that we follow. So it's been our breakthrough year. So how do we evidence that? How do we know that? The trust that our customers have given us in 2024 is huge. They've given us trust in curating data intelligence for them. So in simple terms, what we do is we feedback to our clients what patients and doctors are saying about drugs and diseases from the real world. And in 2024, we curated a massive 2.9 million pieces of data for our customers. So that's data that they're very possessable, very valuable, but it was messy and it was unstructured. So we're very, very pleased to have done that and shown the value of it. In a regulated industry like pharma and the agencies, trust needs to be earned. And to many, AI is still a new scary tool. So it's a breakthrough when we can demonstrate the force and momentum for the sector, and this all paves the way for expansion into 2025 and beyond. So Talking Medicines has a clear positioning at the top of the AI pyramid. We see ourselves as a specialist vertical provider. What that means is we've tailored all of our know-how, all of our being to one specific industry. We only service one industry, which is life science. So we built know-how and IP moat with both that data science but also life science knowledge. That means we've got an awareness of the terminology that's used. We've got a high attention to linguistics. For example, the nuanced challenges such as the names of medicines in different markets, they're called different things, FDA approvals, patient journeys right through from the prediagnosis to the postdiagnosis. To really, really understand intelligence and data about patients and doctors and their views about medicines, you need to understand life science. So we very much brought the 2 together, but we are specialists in data science and AI. So it means our know-how and IP sits in delivering to life sciences where a commodity solution would lack precision. And it would be unable to get to the accuracy and the detail that Talking Medicines can deliver because of that know-how that we've built over time. So it means that we sit at the premium level through our specialism. And we overcome the issues that others are seeing where you may band on that we've got AI, but do you really have AI. And we know that for a sector that is so concerned about the accuracy and the compliance, you have to be a specialist ready to be able to deliver. So very glad that we sit at the top of that stack. And you've heard a little bit of this through the presentations today, the rise of AI. So 2024 could definitely be said to be the year of AI. But of course, AI was not invented in 2024. It's just that it gained that high profile. It's become a new era of AI. So many companies are saying that they are AI providers, but many will be operating at that commodity end that I just described or maybe delivering off the shelf for one element of AI. For us, we have always been an advanced data science and AI company, and that's taken a lot of specialism. We have in-house annotation, which means we can create high volumes of gold standard training data. And ownership of that training data is so important to our value. That means that we have mature proprietary models and a differentiator in the way that we deliver. We continue to annotate and we continue to update, but we can operate off of the models that we've already built. With specialists in 2 of the areas that you can see on the chart ahead of you, lots and lots to talk about LLMs, large language models. But for us, the heart of what we do is about machine learning and natural language processing. And you can see the growth of those in the charts. And they're fundamental foundations to what we've built in the recent past. So we're pleased to have those established mature proprietary models, and we're continuing to break frontiers in terms of moving forward with R&D advancements. As the technology emerges and advances, we are ahead of the game. And we have a stream of R&D at all times to make sure we're on the front foot. And it's all about for us about how we can deliver that in the broader life science sector. We evidence our R&D and scientific publications, of which we have published 3 this year. And along with that, we have our pending patents, of which we've introduced one this year. So our IP moat really, really important to us. And the relevance of all of this is that we believe in 2025, there's going to be more of a differential or more of a division between those who really do have AI and those who are banding it on. And what it means as the challenges of the sector become greater, regulators, robustness, transparency, some of the acts that Darron mentioned, there's going to be more scrutiny of the solutions. And we look forward to that because we have the opportunity to lead in it because of our experience and expertise in AI for life sciences. So what do we do? Just to remind you, for those of you who haven't seen us present before, we seek to solve $1 billion problem. So more prescriptions are written than pills taken. And what that means is there's a mismatch between prescriptions that are written by doctors and medicines that are taken by patients, and that's called an adherence gap. The problem costs the industry $250 billion of lost revenue. So that is a big number. So it's obviously a huge economic impact in the sense of lost revenue, but it's also a huge welfare cost. And both are so, so significant when we're talking about people's health. So what pharmaceutical companies do is that they spend $30 billion on marketing to support doctors and patients to get the right patient on the right medicine at the right time and to keep them on script. That's a massive figure, $30 billion. And it is that $30 billion that is our addressable market. So pharmaceutical marketeers spending the $30 billion on marketing will outsource it to health care advertising agencies. And it is the agencies that we at Talking Medicines target as our buyer. And the reason we do that is because they commission intelligence to drive those strategies. And those strategies are worth a lot of money to them, they need to get it right and they need intelligence to write. It is on education, med comms, research, PR, marketing, advertising media to name a few. For the advertising strategies and the pharma end client, there's plenty of source data, data that gives clues as to why patients and doctors do or don't take medicines or do or don't prescribe medicines. However, the data is very unstructured. It's messy. It's noisy. It's not clinical, and the sector doesn't have the systems to decode it in an automated, consistent way, which is where Talking Medicines come in with our highly specialized advanced data science solution, which we call Drug-GPT. Drug-GPT uses all of our advanced data science and AI delivered to a large language model so that our customers have an easy way to access the intelligence that we curate for them. I'm going to just play a very short, it's a 1-minute video, which really brings to life what Drug-GPT does and how it delivers that intelligence to the health care sector. [Presentation]

Cool. And so just to bring you up to date on 2024, kind of what are the milestones? What have we achieved? So we definitely see ourselves of having crossed that chasm from early adopters into the mainstream. And that is through the bigger advertising agencies adopting our solution. So to summarize just in a few bullet points on what we've achieved, we've really focused on building that trust to add value to customers asking us to curate their own first-party data sources. Where we started was really with social media and third-party data sources. And what we tend to do now for clients is combine both. There's huge trust about us being able to curate that first-party data. And it has huge value in it, and it's so useful when you mix it with the third-party public data to give a 360. So the data could come from patient programs. It could come from medical congresses. It could come from focus groups, and that's led us into a broader data ingestion. So we've learned this year to ingest data from numerous new sources for us. And we've shown that we can successfully pull them accurately through our curation models into Drug-GPT so that customers can access that intelligence. And that's given us a far greater breadth in terms of the ability to extract that intelligence, and it's given our customers a big advantage. Our data model initially was around patients and patient data sources. In 2024, we've done a lot of work on health care professionals and doctor data. It's mainly peer-to-peer conversations, and it is very, very valuable data to extract for pharma marketeers. We've continued to develop our advanced data science and AI know-how. And that's really about extending our IP moat through R&D, which I mentioned a minute ago and showing our differentiation and emphasizing our unique know-how has been really important to us. We've continued to improve the robustness of our user interface Drug-GPT, adding text as well as visual libraries for our customers to be able to interpret that intelligence. And for some, they need to extract it to PowerPoints. We've made that easier for them. And all of these drive internal efficiencies at the agency where we've shown we can show -- give them an uplift of 80% in time savings versus the old ways of getting to intelligence. Our go-to-market is powerful and has paved the path for 2025. New York is the center of excellence for health care advertising. And we are building out our presence in New York and along the East Coast states, where there are ad agencies or pharma presence with global contacts also in London. Our core route to market is through direct sales. And that's through the agencies of note, the big agencies who manage those big budgets for pharma. Our intelligence is on launch drug brands and the ad agencies across PR, media, creative and med comms. Our second pillar developed in 2024 is new, and that's on partner sales through OEM. And we're really excited to line that up for 2025, where partners can sell our solution on in return for a revenue share, and it opens up a new go-to-market and opportunity for '25. Breaking into a sector that has got a dominance of a few huge holding agencies is so, so critical. So from the hard work in '24, we penetrated significantly now into the global agency holding groups. They're at the center of multiple subsidiary agencies. So in a sector where a high proportion of the 30 billion is spent through these holding groups, it's so important that we now are able to work with them having come through a very robust procurement process and into approved supplier status ready for, and I'm going to say it, land and expand in 2025. So it really opens up opportunities for us to have such a strong year. Our own customers are validating working with Talking Medicines. Here's an example taken from our website with an NPS score of 10 out of 10 for a newly onboarding agency of our target persona VP of data and analytics, seeing the benefits of what we do. We've delivered our first OEM embedded Drug-GPT, which is our chosen route to partner sales just to give you a flavor here of how we can brand Drug-GPT partners and how they take it to market. This one is being delivered directly to pharma marketers by one of our partners in '25. This is of data curated from a community of physicians and doctors. It will provide pharma marketeers with intelligence from peer-to-peer doctor conversation, which has a huge value in understanding prescribing behaviors. We built the platform, and it will now be actively marketed in '25 with the revenue share model. And the branding within it gives visibility to Talking Medicines Drug-GPT. So we're really pleased to be opening up this second route to market, and it's going to be a force multiplier as we build more data vaults for them by disease area. And we will run similar models for other partners who have the ability to get to a similar scale. We've been endorsed in 2024 industry events. As I said earlier, the epicenter of ad agencies is New York, and it is this community that have showcased us. And we're very proud at New York Adweek to have been profiled and selected into the Accelerate program, which, again, is demonstrating acceptance of our solution. So in summary, our direction of travel for 2025. We're accelerating the mainstream adoption of Drug-GPT, and that means scaling through land and expand into those holding groups as well as our OEM route. We continue to develop a lead with our robust IP moat. We're building out our U.S. operation to capitalize on all of the momentum we've seen, particularly in quarter 4 of 2024. And we believe we know the '80s as the age of the Internet, the early 2000s as the age of the mobile. This is definitely the age of AI, and we want to rise to the top because being a vertical specialist, we really can lead in that practical application in life sciences to tackle a multibillion dollar problem. So we're looking forward to an exciting year of growth ahead. And thank you very much for your time today.

Well, thank you very much, indeed, Jo. Great presentation as always. We now move on to the Q&A section of the event this evening. Thank you for those who've input their comments during the session. Those are all noted. As I said at the beginning, thanks for those who've submitted questions, comments and opinions in advance. As I explained at the beginning, there are areas, financial information on investee companies because they are private and they need to keep their financial information confidential for good commercial reasons are not going to be disclosed. We're not going to be making any forecasts, and there's other inside information that can't be discussed outside of a regulatory announcement. If anybody has got any concerns with something that they've submitted ahead of this presentation that's not being addressed, please give me a call at any time, and I can explain exactly why and how it will be addressed in the future. But having said that health warning, we will move on to a few points. I apologize, Jo, Darron and Susant, these are mostly Tern-specific. So as always, but we really do appreciate your attendance.

The first point that's been raised by a number of people is the recent investment in Sure Ventures. Obviously was made at the beginning of the year. I don't know if Ian, Al, you can give some more color on the thinking behind that, particularly against the backdrop of Sure's share price going up 20% today, which we're very pleased to see.

Over to you, AL?

You want me to speak to this end?

Yes, yes, please.

Okay. I think the investment in Sure Ventures has twofold purpose. One to specifically generate income for us through participating in exits that we believe are imminent, both in Sure Valley Ventures 1 portfolio, which they own 25-plus percent of the proceeds that come from that investment they made early on, but also to expand our presence as well as our influence within Sure Valley Ventures 2. As you've seen from Susant's presentation, here and in the investment thesis within Sure Valley Ventures 2 aligns pretty succinctly with the investment thesis that we've made in the portfolio companies that are part of Tern portfolio. So the investment is really designed to leverage the technologies that we've developed. You heard from Susant and you heard from our CEOs the idea of land and expand, verticalization, proprietary and curated LLMs. There are a number of synergistic opportunities with the portfolios to gain accelerated presence in marketing. We also believe with this investment that we participate with Sure Valley Ventures 2 in looking at potential opportunities for us in the future should we have an exit within one of our portfolio companies such that the forward momentum and capabilities of Tern can continue. And then we can continue to generate value and opportunities for our shareholders. So -- and today's announcements from Sure Valley plc and from Mindflair formerly Pires show the potential momentum and value of this relationship where one of their investments, Landvault was purchased by Infinite Reality for $450 million and Infinite Reality today raised an additional $3 billion in investment capital. So we're participating in a very mature portfolio in SVV1 and an accelerated exit model in Sure Valley Ventures 2, which we believe will be beneficial to the shareholders. That, in summary, is what I think is the rationale.

Thanks, Al. That's helpful. And you raised some interesting points there. And it's interesting to see Mindflair former Pires share price up 93% today. So it does show what can happen to share prices if the right exits occur. In terms of access to distributions, it's my understanding that Sure Ventures is actually structured as an investment trust so that they have an obligation for distribution rather than being a pure investment company. So that does give shareholders in that business more of a certainty as to distribution should there be income coming in. But that leads me to a question that many have asked about Tern, and this has been commented on in the past in terms of if there was a substantial exits, would the Board be minded to pay a dividend of a proportion of the income received?

Well, yes. I mean, indeed, we certainly would be. I mean if we get a substantial exit and we have -- you've seen 3 companies today, all of which have gained enormous ROE. One of these companies, we got involved in when they were tiny, and they're now very substantial businesses. When we get an exit from one of these businesses, there will be a distribution, absolutely.

Well, thank you, Ian. And another comment that was made this evening. Obviously, Tern has had to raise money fairly frequently from shareholders. How does the Board look at the investee companies and measure the dilutive effect of raising that money versus exiting everything now and effectively winding up and giving it all what remains back to shareholders? Is that something you're looking at on a very regular basis?

Yes, of course. But our job is to maximize the value of the businesses. And if the businesses have considerable upside value, our job is to support them as much as possible to achieve that. Unfortunately, with private early-stage companies like the ones we have, you can't just sell them off. There's no market to sell it off. And if you did do, it would be a fire sale, and you wouldn't get very much. So we have to husband our resources -- the valuation of our company as best we can. And the goal is always to achieve a good exit for our shareholders and for ourselves.

Yes. And are you pleased with the performance of the investee companies in 2024?

Yes. I mean these businesses have been doing very well this year. Now the market, the tech market for M&A and so forth have been off the boil in the last year. But these things have got cycles, and they will recover. In any case, each one of these is a specialist technical company in its particular area. And so there's always room for exits. But unfortunately, the game here, and I've been a private investor for 30 or 40 years, the game here is you have to be patient. You have to be patient. You have to look after them. You have to make sure they're supported, and they're encouraged to grow. And then you have to -- and then when it comes to the point of an exit, you have to maximize as much as possible of an exit as you can achieve.

Yes. But you're happy that they continue on the right path to achieve that value in the future?

Yes.

Excellent.

Let me add to the question just a little tidbit in that our new structure with the investment committee being the Board and the operating management running the business, the analysis that we do when we go to raise money as well as when we invest money has been substantially enhanced as a consequence of the structure. So I think the thought process that goes into raising money as well as deploying the money has improved dramatically in recent times. So I can say from having to do the preparation, we've really become far more analytical. And we have a lot more spreadsheets that go into coming up with what it is we're going to do.

Well, thanks, Al. Without sort of putting words in your mouth, both of you, my understanding of what you just said, part of the Sure Ventures investment is about generating income and part of being self-sustaining as a company and not having to rely on the equity markets.

Yes.

One thing that was mentioned in the last set of results was management fees. Is this something that you're still looking to source from companies, whether they be existing companies, Sure Valley companies or indeed third parties?

I think from a management fee point of view, when we invest, we invest to put the money into the company to grow. With our now relationship with Sure Valley Ventures, the idea would be to look to generate some management fees for the company in regard to helping them achieve some value that we can generate, for example, being able to showcase their portfolio companies in Silicon Valley. And I think if you look at the points made today, I think the key things that we have that I think are marketable to the Sure Valley Ventures relationship is that the majority of our company's customers are all in the U.S., and they're all names that you can recognize. Land and expand is something we've been talking about for years. It's now part of the vernacular that Susant talked about. We're also looking and we've helped to develop these partner ecosystems with industry and market segment leaders. So I think we have a lot of value to offer, and I think we can generate some fees from that value in these additional relationships we now have.

Can I just comment on our Board changes recently because this is the first time we've had an opportunity to do this.

I was about to in the next question. Thank you.

All right. Okay. Alan Howarth has completed his period of a name listed director. And Sarah Payne has now got a new job, which is beginning to really stress out quite a bit, and so she had to move on. It did give us the opportunity to bring in 2 new non-exec directors who have colossal experience, particularly internationally and also on realizing and exiting businesses as well. Iain Ross has got a huge business experience over the years and particularly in his case in Australia. But Jane Karwoski is -- I mean I knew her from a career -- 15-year career in Scotland, but she's American and she now lives in Austin, Texas -- I am sorry, Atlanta, Georgia. And she has -- given that most of our businesses, and you've heard them today have got stateside presence and focus and probably will exit stateside. Having that kind of experience on board will be very valuable, we believe.

Yes. Thank you, Ian. Yes, certainly, I think from what I've seen, there's a lot of value being added there and the experience. As I say, always the questions that we received at these events are looking for things that are imponderable and none of us know the answer or can't answer. But is there any other comments you'd like to make on the portfolio companies and your thoughts on them and their stage of development and where they're going? We've said we're comfortable, but is there any more color you want to give on that?

Al, do you want to...

Yes, I think -- I mean speaking as if I were you, our shareholder investors, I think it was mentioned in several of the presentations that -- and as Jo summarized, it was the Internet era or the Internet, then era of the mobility and now it's the era of AI as the future for growth and value creation. What we have, I think, have delivered is companies that share technology, share resources to create big potential players in vertical markets in AI that everyone today says it's the only way you're going to make money in the AI businesses. And we didn't just start saying AI 6 months ago because it was attractive. We have been involved in machine learning, virtual reality, augmented reality and the natures of the technologies you've seen today for the past 18 months to 36 months. So we think we have a head start, and that head start is very valuable to the large companies, particularly in the U.S., as Ian pointed out, to gain an advantage. Like for example, Infinite Reality has now gained an advantage with Landvault and specifically speaks to that advantage created in their $3 billion investment today in their press release. So I'm very encouraged with the progress we've made within these companies and the technologies that we've developed that give us a unique market position and a unique leadership position within these businesses. It makes them very attractive.

Thank you. Just looking at the points that have been typed in, just to answer a couple of questions. One attendee says, "Please confirm Tern's holding percentage in each company." Don't have that off the top of my head, but if you look at the last RNS announcement in relation to each of the portfolio companies, that will detail the precise percentage holdings. Another question that says how we're going to improve the share price? Well, companies don't control their share price. I think all the Board can do is execute their strategy, tell the world about it. And hopefully, there's more buyers than sellers, and the share price will go up. But as we referenced with Mindflair, share prices can go up quite considerably when events happen. And as a shareholder in Tern myself, I'm hoping that those events are not too far away. I'm getting to the end of the list of points that have been typed in. I recognize we've now hit the 7:00. As I said earlier, any questions that you want to discuss, please get in touch with me, terninvestor-focus.co.uk or by phone. And I do discuss points that are brought up regularly with Ian, Al and the rest of the Board and management team. So thank you very much to Jo, to Darron, to Richard and Susant for your presentations and taking the time out of your busy schedules this evening. That's really, really appreciated. And thank you very much to everybody who attended. Just to let you know, if you did miss anything, there will be a recording of this available on the Tern website tomorrow. So thank you, and enjoy the rest of your evening.