Wonderla Holidays Limited (WONDERLA) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Wonderla Holidays Q4 FY '21 Results Conference Call hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. [Operator Instructions]. Please note that this conference has been recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Adhidev Chattopadhyay from ICICI Securities Limited. Thank you, and over to you.

Yes. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of ICICI Securities, I'd like to welcome everyone today on the call. Today from the management of Wonderla we have with us Mr. Arun Chittilappilly, the Managing Director; and Mr. Satheesh Seshadri, the Chief Financial Officer. I would now like to hand over the call to the management for their opening remarks. Thank you.

Good evening, everyone. This is Arun Chittilappilly. We welcome you to this conference call to discuss the fourth quarter results of the financial year 2021. Hope everyone continues to be safe, and I would like to start off by appreciating the relentless effort of various COVID warriors who make sure that people are safe during this pandemic. After reopening Bangalore and Kochi Park in November and December, respectively, the calendar year 2021 started off on a good note for us as Hydropower Park also resumed operations on January 9. All 3 of our parts are operational after a gap of more than 7 months. I would like to emphasize that our team was ready to immediately reopen the park, on the necessary clearances were received from the government. The team continues to excel with their dedication and resilience as we found innovative waste safely entertained nearly 4 lakh guests. Post unlock, Wonderla continued to be a preferred destination for outdoor entertainment in our 4 cities and we witness substantial demand once our parks resumed operations. In January, our parks were operational only from Thursday to Sunday, which was further increased to Wednesday to Sunday in February and in the month of March, all the parks were open all the days of the week. Our attendance consistently improved every month since we first reopened the parks. Wonderla is also the first theme park chain in the country to be awarded the highly committed COVID Safe certification by Bureau Veritas. Wonderla Bangalore and Kochi certified with Diamond certification and Hyderabad Park has secured a Platina certification. We introduced industry-leading safety standards and protocols to protect both our employees and our guests to come to and have a memorable day with us. This includes encouraging online reservation system for admission, touchless temperature and security screening, contactless transactions and enhanced sanitization. Our outdoor venues have tremendous amount of open space and our park are naturally conducive to social distancing. Over the decade, Wonderla has faced many challenges, FY 2021 was the toughest not just for Wonderla but the industry and the world at large. The results for the quarter and full year may not be comparable to the prior year due to the pandemic limitations. Coming to our performance for Q4 FY '21. Our focus on digital marketing and to use innovative approach, including influencer activities and PR campaigns that yielded good results. We recorded footfalls of 3.1 lakh visitors across all parks, which is more than 1 lakh per month. We also introduced innovative SMB and retail offerings in [indiscernible] events during the quarter. On a Y-o-Y basis, our footfalls are at 77% of prepandemic Q4. We registered a gross revenue of INR 347.9 million, clocking a recovery of 77% of INR 449.1 million revenue registered in Q4 FY '20. We are also EBITDA positive for Q4 FY '21. The company's robust balance sheet continues to be debt-free and has ample liquidity of roughly INR 930 million. Even though there was a setback for us due to the second wave, and we closed our parks in April, our team is motivated, and we are trying to put our best foot forward to drive the company to scale new heights. We have identified high performance and rewarded them with increments. Additionally, we are also working on vaccination efforts for all our staffs. We continue to focus on sustainable value creation from our resilient business. Despite the recent lockdowns, we are optimistic that it will generate a widespread desire, which will help us drive attendance in the coming quarters. We are looking forward to put the worst of the pandemic behind us and delight our guests in our parks as and when the time is appropriate. We thank you for your continued support and remain confident in emerging stronger as our strategic plan remain intact. We can now proceed to Q&A. Thank you very much.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Sharma Kunal from Perfect Research.

So I have a few questions, so I'm asking them together. The first, when do you see the India open up like a U.S. where the post sufficient vaccination even masks are not required. And the second, sir, along with the opening of bigger park, shouldn't we also think indoor entertainment often in malls due to 2 reasons. The first is setting up these big parks in such a painful time consuming process and slower growth? Second reason is that the city people, would be able to use in the city entertainment option more regularly versus coming once implies to our big parks? Third question, any learning from running Wonder Nursery and Wonder Kitchen which could help us scale up our business later? And then lastly...

Can you limit your questions to 2 because I will not be able to answer all of them otherwise.

Then the last question, is there any opportunity of inorganic acquisition of the park in India?

Sorry, I didn't hear the last one.

The last 1 is, is there any opportunity we see of inorganic acquisition of other parks in India?

Yes. So your first question was when do we see the pandemic kind of receiving. That will only happen with at least 50% of the population is vaccinated as you may already be aware. Now in a large country like India, it could take 5 months, it could take 6 months. It could take 1 year, it could take 2 years. It's all up to the government, let's hope for the best. They are saying that we will finish vaccination by December, but I highly doubt it. Maybe a year is what I think. Second question, what is it? Is about -- sorry, could you repeat the second question?

Shouldn't we think about indoor entertainment?

Indoor entertainment yes. So indoor entertainment is a different format. It's not -- it does not come under the amusement park business. It's a completely different business and the entry barrier for something like that is relatively low. Like you rightly said building a large part is always much more costly and time consuming. But our expertise is in the large format parks, so we don't to get into the small park business because I don't think there are enough margins and I don't think there are any players who have been really successful at it. I don't -- yes, so I'm not really bullish. I mean for me, I don't think it makes sense for this company. Third question -- the last question was -- sorry, could you repeat your last one, I forgot your question. Please limit your questions to 2 questions next time.

Sure, sure, sir. Any learning from the -- like the Wonder Nursery and Wonder Kitchen?

Wonder Nursery and Kitchen and all was only for -- it was only to engage our guests -- sorry, our staff during the pandemic last year because we had an extended lockdown. Once we recover from the lockdown and we were in a position to open the parks, we found it difficult to run both the businesses together. And also running a takeaway food outlet had its own challenges because it's heavy low margin, high-volume business, and we did not have enough -- we couldn't recruit more staff to grow that business. And at the same time, you were also trying to reopen the parks. So we have to take a call on which we want. We obviously prioritize reopening of our parks and getting footfall ramp-up over the other businesses. So those continue to be there only as -- I mean we are not doing the Wonder Kitchen anymore, but Wonder Garden continues to be there, but it's a very low CapEx, very small operation. So we could come back and look at it again. There is a market opportunity, especially in the Kitchen business. But right now, I think because we are constantly going in and out of lockdowns, we don't have the bandwidth to run both. So I hope that answers.

Sir, your question is answered.

Actually, last 1 is just remaining. There is like opportunity, we see the inorganic acquisition of the other parks.

We are not looking at any inorganic acquisitions right now.

The next question is from the line of Rajesh Ranganathan from Doric Capital.

It's a tough time. So obviously, you're doing the best you can. But could you please give us an update on Chennai project? What is the current thought process around that? And secondly, we've tried different businesses but within our own park business, have we used the time that we've had in terms of downtime to make it better when things open up?

Yes. So I think for us, the downtime is mostly are using it for strategizing and trying to improve our businesses when we reopen. And I think that has helped us a lot, especially when being opened during the -- in the last quarter. We also had a fundamental shift in our strategy in terms of how we market our parks to our visitors. So that is gone through a new change and we are much more digital heavy rent right now. But a lot of that work is still in progress. So it's still not a finished product. Maybe we take off another year change in our marketing and customer experience to a fully digital system. So we are still working on it. So that's -- those kind of works are going on. We are also revamping some of our offerings in terms of F&B outlets and things like that. So small upgradation work and those kind of things are going on right now.

So are you saying that, let's say, this 12 months or 18 months that we've had as a downtime, there isn't any significant project in terms of upskilling of employees systems. Normally, we are not able to do in the running park, but we used to -- so that you can involve your clients when you walk in next time?

Yes. So that's what I said, we are working towards that, but it's more like a digital heavy. They are doing a digital transformation in the company in that sense. But yes, it's still early days. It will probably take us a year or 2 to finish a substantial part of it.

And on Chennai if you don't mind.

Chennai is kept on hold because we are not able to start work on it. So it has been put on hold for at least till the end of this financial year.

But we have the land for that? Or is that not yet?

Yes, yes. The land -- some land development -- some basic work is going on, but nothing -- we are not building the park as of right now.

Why is that? Is it because of lack of availability of labor or what is the reason behind that?

Yes. We don't have labor. We are not able to move people there. Also, we have some outstanding disputes with the government in terms of tax holidays and things like that. So those kind of things are being sorted. So we will announce whenever it's ready. So I don't see anything happen for the remainder of this year.

Okay. And then this tax dispute, how serious is it? How long is it likely to take those? Because that's 1 of the growth drivers for you when things open up right?

Yes. So I mean we are asked for a tax holiday exemption from the local body tax in Chennai. I don't know if you are aware, but Tamil Nadu is the only state which there is an extra tax on tickets. So we will not be able to build a large format park and run it with [indiscernible] tax in place. So they have categorically agreed the previous government, but now the government has changed, so we'll have to work again and see how -- we don't know how long it will take.

Okay. And from when did you, let's say, pre-COVID we have a certain 70%, 77% EBITDA. And let's say things should open up and we reached 77% in fourth quarter and maybe you can also comment on why, I mean when other businesses you're going to reach 100% maybe we have some peculiarities why even not able to, but suppose we do reach 50% at some point, will our EBITDA be similar or better or lower? What do you think?

It will be better or at least the same as before, once the COVID pandemic. The reason why we had only 77% footfall is because we were not allowed to open every day of the week initially when we opened. Only 1 month out of the 3 months, that is only in March, all 3 parks were open, all days of the week. The other 2 months to some days, we were open, someday we were not open because we have to limit the crowd also, right?

The next question is from the line of Parimal Mithani from Credential Investments.

First, sir, is it safe to assume the last year, we had the worst year in the company's history going forward? The second question is in terms of footfall.

Sorry, can you repeat your first question? I couldn't hear you.

Sir, there's a disturbance coming from your line, sir.

Now can you hear me properly now?

Yes, it's still disturbed, but I can hear you.

[Operator Instructions]

So is it safe to assume the last year was the worst year in the company's history in terms of financial performance wise?

Yes. It was one of the worst, yes.

Second is, it will be the base for the year of going higher, right, in terms of since the pandemic, it was the worst year that we've been that way, right?

Yes.

And second thing, sir, this footfall of 3.1 lakh, which you achieved in this last time of -- I think you were the operations 3 months and given the pandemic restrictions and all that. Both India reaching critical vaccination drive, do you see this number to surpass your prior expectations also?

Actually, we -- so I think 3.11 lakh is a pretty good number. In fact, it's kind of what we would achieve also. We had pretty good footfalls in all the 3 parks. So I think there is a lot of the latent demand. People are wanting to go out, but obviously, because of the pandemic, there is a lot of restriction lockdowns, all those things. Once the lockdown restrictions all the things is out, assuming that at least 60% of the population gets vaccinated, which you can already see in other countries happening now, I think the demand will be coming back strongly is what we think. And that is what we are seeing from other parks and other countries as well.

Status of the theme parks [indiscernible] lockdown over [indiscernible]?

Sorry, I can't hear you.

What are status of the park? Are they in lockdown or they're partially opening the parks...

They're all lockdown. Every -- all 3 of our parks are in a lockdown.

Okay. And sir, this footfall worried because of the open discounts or anything or there was just a latent demand which was there people wanted to travel?

I think it's because of -- mostly because of latent demand, but we also had some discounts and some offerings have been set up but mostly not discounted because our ARPU is also better than last quarter.

And sir, last question, if I'm seeing your company for next 3, 4 years, in terms of how do you see yourself in terms of the coming years? I won't quote you to it, I just want to understand the business from how you plan [indiscernible].

Yes. I think once the pandemic received, I think we will slowly get back on to our growth path again in terms of adding new locations to our portfolio, things like that. We're already working on it. Like, for example, we have Chennai and we have another project that we have signed in Bhubaneswar for a smaller -- like a small version of the park with the government there. But again, because of the pandemic, we've not been able to. We have a couple more opportunities 1 from Gujarat and there is another opportunity from Colombo in Sri Lanka as well. We are evaluating all these options. And then whenever time is right, we will start working on these projects. And also our existing parts also, we are upgrading them slowly. And once we reopen, I think we'll be able to give our visitors a better experience.

So the same ticket price range or like?

I think you've run out of your questioning time.

Sorry, if you can just comment because I'm just logging for the first time and it's [indiscernible] can give us a time that [indiscernible]. If you don't mind, and I'll go ahead. If there's a problem [indiscernible]

Yes. We told there only 2 questions per participant.

The next question is from the line of Geeta Mehta from [ LHS ]Ventures.

I only have 1 question. So recently, Gujarat government announced various incentives such as reduced electricity bills and property tax exemption for various multiplexes. Can we expect something similar for park industry?

I think the association of parks are actively talking to different bodies. But I think Gujarat has always been very pro industry, and they have been waiving some of those things, but I'm not seeing it as a countrywide initiative for other industries also. We are trying. We are hopeful that some kind of exemptions or the tax breaks, et cetera, might happen, but too early to comment.

So can we expect something similar in the other states as well?

I'm not sure. We are working on it. But at this point, we are not -- we can't comment on it.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Meet Jagani from PS Associates.

I have 1 question. How the current initiative of 50% of this gain in traction, how is the response over there?

That's a new offer that we have just given because we are currently lockdown and we are not able to -- I mean open the park, but we are selling the tickets for a future date, only limited -- it's a limited time offer. And I think we had really good response. I think we've sold about 7,000-odd tickets in about a week. So it's not a bad thing.

Okay. And apart Chennai, are we looking at any other location? I mean, [indiscernible] location are looking currently?

We are looking at other states, like I told you, I mentioned in the last answer. We are looking at a few opportunities in other states like Gujarat, Odisha and also that we have an opportunity which has come up in Colombo in Sri Lanka as well. So we are evaluating a few opportunities.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Nitin Dharmavat from Aurum Capital.

Just 1 question regarding Bhubaneswar, Odisha, the Board is approved for setting up this park. You mentioned that you have not worked out details about it. But if something is there in terms of what kind of investment that you are looking for because you mentioned that's going to be a smaller format. So what is the kind of investment that you're looking for this? And what will the time line once the things opened up?

It's very early stage. I mean, we want to do a very small format one. So it will be significantly lower investment compared to our existing parks. And also for us, Odisha seems like a smaller market as well. So we are trying to tailormade something working with the government, they have to see the way can do a small park. They have been very supportive. They have actually given us a lot of -- they've actually been very proactive in terms of helping us with the land and approvals and all those things. So -- but once the plans are finalized, we will be -- we will update everyone about this. Right now, it's still in the drawing board.

The next question is from the line of Manoj Dua, an Individual Investor.

Sir, when you look for a new opportunity like Colombo or Gujarat, what are the parameters you look into? What are the conditions you think that [indiscernible] opening of [indiscernible]?

We look at a few things. One is the area that there's a sufficient attachment area in terms of market size. We also look at that our business can operate 365 days or is highly seasonal, depending on weather conditions. We also look at how the government -- how proactive the government is in the state or area and how helpful they are. Then we also look at how far or how close are they to our existing project because you don't want to build 2 parks which are very close to each other because they may not -- they may cannibalize each other in. So there are a few parameters like that we look at.

And on infrastructure water, electricity, connectivity.

Water connectivity, water, basics like that as well .

Okay. Now if you want to see the company after 5, 10 years, the growth parameters of opening new park or [indiscernible]. If you are not able to open new park of the phase what you think and which has happened in the past, how [indiscernible] from our own parks [indiscernible] guideline because you talk about a condition in the past [indiscernible], we are not able to open new parks. So how far you can grow from our [indiscernible] in future?

I think our existing parks are still not saturated in terms of footfall. So that's something that we are looking at very seriously. So yes, unless we don't add new parks. I think there is sufficient headroom for us to grow in our native market. For example, Hyderabad, we still haven't reached one million footfall. Kochi -- we used to have 1 million-plus footfalls, and then it has dropped in the last 2, 3 years. So we need to fix that. So I mean there are some of those challenges we need to address as well. So I mean, definitely, there is scope for growth in our home market is what we feel because our parks, even if we have 1 million footfalls, it's still a very small percentage of the total addressable population of each of those cities.

The next question is from the line of Pavan from [indiscernible] Capital.

Most of my questions are answered. But just 1 additional 1 is what's the capacity or you just mentioned that, for example, Hyderabad has 1 million kind of capacity. So what's the kind of operating capacity that we can think about when we look at the business?

Roughly, I think we can accommodate about 5,000 to 6,000 visitors on each of our parks per day. So you multiply 365 and you'll get the theoretical maximum capacity. But obviously, we may not take that...

Sir, it's about 8,000 to 10,000 is the park capacity. We worked on a 50% capacity during the pandemic, which is 5,000 for the Bangalore and Kochi Park and 4,000 for Hyderabad Park. So we can go up to 8,000 to 10,000 capacity.

So I mean, I'm saying that's not sustainable every day to have that kind of capacity.

Right. So you have more business in the weekend versus the weekday. So you -- and on average out would be about 50%.

I would say you say 6,000 number per day, and then you can multiply that with 365.

Okay. Sounds good. And second was 1 of the previous participants asked about what you look for in kind of expansion projects or how do you think about capital allocation. When you're looking at these growth projects, what are the financial parameter we're looking for, like what are the ROEs or those kind of metrics are you looking at?

I mean we don't look at, I mean, ROE calculations, I mean, are byproduct of what we have achieved because it's not something that we -- I mean, but we typically want each of our investments to kind of pay back within 7, 8 years, that's the way we look at it. But yes, I mean, ROE at -- I mean, Satheesh may be able to answer this better.

Yes. We looked at the ROCE, we look at the payback and we also [indiscernible] first one is there a demand there. And then the business is the footfall is 1 thing. And then we look at the ROCE and the payback also on this. But these are all long gestation projects, whatever we have taken till now because the investment size is INR 300 crores, INR 330 crores for Chennai project, for example, okay, it has its own curve, okay. When you think about -- talk about the Odisha project, the investments could be slightly lesser there. So we look into various sector, but you can't have ROCE, ROE the initial year, you build up the -- over the period you have a better.

I think it will be harder in the initial years and then will get better as the footfalls improve and the cost of the park come down.

Let me rephrase the question. So 7 to 8 year payback period and breakeven you target about 3 years, would that be fair to say like your earlier projects?

Yes.

Yes, Hyderabad Park, for example, we had a breakeven in 3 years. EBITDA cost [indiscernible].

The next question is from the line of Anuj from M3 Investment.

My first question is the Gujarat opportunity, I think, has been on [indiscernible] for some time. But we have not taken any further...

[Operator Instructions]

I'm not -- just completing my question. Just on Gujarat, any particular reason why we are delaying it? Or do you have too much our hands off it at the moment. So that's 1 question number one.

Yes. So I mean, we have just been talking to them, and there has been interest on the government for us to set up a park, but it's still early days. We're still in the negotiating table on what we do, how to do it. Yes, these things are like that, it takes time for us to finalize on a budget.

Sure. All right. All right. My second question is Colombo. Pardon me, sir, for my ignorance, this name I've heard for the first time. Is it that you've got an invitation or any more specifics on the Colombo opportunity?

Once we have -- right now, it's a very new -- it's a new invitation that we've got it set up and turn a park there. Once we have more clarity on that, we will definitely keep all of you know. But I'm just saying, I will decide it because that's the kind of -- a lot of people do keep up -- keep asking us to invest in new geographies and the build parks or take over existing parks, for example, the Colombo opportunities for us to take over any finished park and to complete it and run it. So like that, there are different opportunities which keep coming from time to time. And so we will look at the suitability for our brand and whether it goes with our [indiscernible], and then we take that decision on that.

The management will decide, sir.

Sorry?

The management contract [indiscernible].

Sure, sure. And the third and my final question is we have all 3 existing parks in a similar model, Bhubaneswar was slightly different in terms of plan. But these are the 2 or 3 models we are looking at or beyond that we are exploring? So management contract is something we have explored that not classified until now, but just are these 2 or 3 models around or we are something more in our?

No, I think mostly will be -- we would like to build our own park. That's the ideal situation. But that is very time consuming and slow in a country like India. So the other next best would be to take over and run other parks for a managing contract. So that also, we are exploring. We have a few opportunities. In fact, we have at least 4 of our opportunities like that in India. And we have this opportunity will come from Colombo as well and many other countries, but we are just restricting ourselves to the Indian subcontinent from now.

Okay. So if you permit me 1 more, what is the key reason we are being slow in taking off? Because I do the fortunate and management contracts have been there for some time. Is it the financial consideration? Or is it our inability to visualize how parks would be? What is delaying? So I understand 1 in Bombay, which you have clearly said it's out of consideration, but others, what could be the reasons?

The different parks have different issues because usually, when they come to us maybe it's a half-finished project, maybe some projects have run out of money, maybe some projects were planned, but nobody never took off. So there are various reasons for why various projects don't take off property. So we have to assess it and then see whether we want to jump it to it. So we usually take our own time with it because we don't want to hurry in to something like this because it's a long-term commitment.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Saurabh Arora.

Number 1 is, most of the corporate companies have extended work-from-home culture for their employees. And they are saying it a great opportunity for post COVID as well. How do you think this would affect our business in Bangalore and Hyderabad as these are top locations for corporate companies?

I think work from home, I think it's here to stay in some form. Even I'm working from home for the last year or so. So I think there is some comfort in there, but at the same time, I think that cannot go on forever. Maybe for a tech-related company, it makes more sense to do it. But a company like us will definitely -- we have passed and we run them when it's a physical infrastructure. So remote working may not -- so -- but will it -- I think it will be better for us because people which definitely beacons just some of our cities. Traffic times will improve. And I think people will find it easier to commute, which is always a good thing for a company like us. Ease of commute is 1 of the main factors that decide how people come to the park.

Yes, but employees of corporate companies, private tech companies, maybe [indiscernible] customer base for our [indiscernible] if they are not in Bangalore and Hyderabad?

Just because they work from home doesn't mean that they never go out of the house, right?

Yes, but they will work from other states in their home towns like other towns like Uttar Pradesh, Delhi.

No, that is -- I mean, that's not going to be -- I mean, I don't see the populations of our cities going down as long as our cities are thriving and the populations of our cities are growing, I think we will also be growing.

Okay. And my second question is, in last con calls, you discussed about salary cuts as cost cutting. I want to ask what was in case of directors, what the remuneration and commissions that directors have received during FY '21?

You will see more of it on the annual report, please.

Sorry?

Those disclosures, you will see more in terms -- more of it in annual reports.

The next question is from the line of Rajesh Ranganathan from Doric Capital.

So through this pandemic and even before that things were slow in India, so we've lost some top management, I guess, some voluntary, some otherwise. What's our plan going ahead in terms of how do we recruit and retain talent given how difficult the industry is right now?

I think the difficulty in the industry is there everywhere right now, and I don't think it's unique to our industry. I think it's there I would say at least 40%, 50% of the businesses in India or anywhere in the world suffering right now. So It's not unique to us. So -- and I don't think it's not a perineal problem, it's going to go away at some point. We don't know when. So we are just getting ready for that day when we feel like we can open the park and welcome visitors. So whatever changes in improvement and -- improvements to our products and services that we can do, we are doing it now. So that's the way we look at it. We continue to hire people, especially in the digital and marketing field because we feel that there is -- that is the area where there's maximum change happening. You are all aware. So we continue to hire people. And yes, so that's an ongoing process. I don't think that will be impacted because of the pandemic.

Okay. So my second question, you had mentioned a few times already that 1 of the things you're focusing on is digital transformation of the firm. Could you give us some specific examples on what are you most impactful projects at list. Could you look at...

What we need to do with, I mean, we will start off with something like marketing automation, which I think we need to -- it is overdue for us. We need to do that. So we are working on that, automating our whole marketing system. And consequently, what happens with that is also how we interact with our customer in the parks. A lot of that can be digitized, knowing our customer better, like how often is somebody coming to the park? Is there an opportunity for me to give offers to him? We're already doing it, but we have just started doing it. So I think in a year or 1.5 years, I think we'll have that completed. It's still in our work in progress right now.

So 1 of the areas, say, globally, people have worked on is something you mentioned in terms of digitally interacting with the visitors when they are in the parks or even when they are about to enter the park or after.

That's what I'm saying. Yes. So there are 2, 3 aspects here: One is the whole marketing aspect of it; then the other is a whole customer aspect, customer service or customer interaction part of it that also can be digitized. And also the customer life cycle, like whether -- how do we make sure that people come back to us at a certain point, can we say we give them [indiscernible] deals or how can we stay relevant in their lives, even after they come and visit us and reduce the lag between 1 visit and the next. So a lot of things are available in that whole realm. Amusement park industry generally has been a little slow, even internationally to embrace our whole digital culture because it is expensive to do amusement park because digitizing park is also an expensive process. So we are looking into that, but we will -- once the plant is almost final, we will be sharing with everyone.

Okay. But this doesn't include digitizing the ride itself, right? You're not looking at digital rides or digital experiences in terms of...

Yes. That also will be part of it, for sure. Having virtual rides.

But at this stage, you're not able to share anything?

Yes, no, we can't. I mean still we've just started work on that.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Adhidev Chattopadhyay from ICICI Securities.

Just a housekeeping question. What is the breakup of ticketing and non-ticketing revenue for the quarter? And on that, on our F&B pricing strategy, how are we looking to get customers to spend more on that?

I think this quarter, we had about 75%, 25%, 75% of ticket and 25% non-ticket, which is higher than what we used to have in Q4 in previous years. The reason for that is we had higher percentage of retail footfalls as against group footfalls. Like pre-COVID we used to get a lot of schools and colleges during Jan, February and March. But in this last Jan, February and March, we got mostly retail footfalls, people who came for the tickets directly from us and came to the park. Because of that, they are higher spending people. They are higher propensity to spend is higher, and that is why our non-ticket revenue is better. I think Satheesh can maybe add something to that.

Yes, sir, I think you covered it very well.

Okay. And as I said, when things eventually get back to normal, how are you looking at that if we get back to where it was pre-COVID, a rough breakup or is there some strategic shift to see to get the margins up in terms of getting more out of the F&B business?

I think our strategy is definitely to improve our non-ticket spend because I think non-ticket revenue is something that we can -- again, going back to the whole digital transformation part of it is something that goes very well with that also, we will be able to sell upsell and cross-sell F&B and merchandise give our customers better once we have those opportunities. They're already doing it, but it's such a very -- we are at 75%, 25%, but we want to have obviously bring non-ticket revenue to at least about 30% -- 30%, 35%.

Okay. And just a second question then, obviously, the parks eventually reopen fully pretty soon. Do you expect the number of rides you can open, like something similar to what happened last year? Like the water rides were not active and then they make it active later on?

Yes. I think it's hard to predict how it will be, but there could be every district and every state has a different way of handling this. So at some states, they will allow you to open the water parks first. Some people -- some states, they don't allow you to do it. So I think it's a bit of a mess. But eventually, they do allow all aspects of the rides to be opened.

Okay. And if I just squeeze in a last question on the salaries last year, we have taken some pay cuts, obviously, with shutdown period. So this year, are we now again looking at a fresh round of salary cuts? Or are we like reinstated the salaries and plan to continue with that?

We had reinstated salaries whenever we were open and especially open every day and the people have to come to work and things like that. But during the lockdown, there is a salary cut again, not as deep as what we did last year, but we are definitely looking at some salary cuts so that we can maintain our cash flows.

There is certainly some cost rationalization, but we don't anticipate the lockdown period extended like last year. Last year, we had about 7 to 8 months closed, parks closed. We don't expect that type of a long lockdown on account of second wave. There will be cost rationalization growth.

Yes. So just for -- think last year it was around INR 4 crores a month, right, was our running cost, if I believe [indiscernible]?

Yes, yes.

So it would be a similar [indiscernible].

On the lockdown time, yes.

So this would be slightly...

We'll have similar levels that we are having.

The next question is from the line of Manoj Dua, an Individual Investor.

Sir, is it possible, can we have monthly breakdown of sales over the quarter?

Satheesh, do you want to take it?

No, we give our results quarterly. But what -- you want all of the footfalls or what exactly you want to know?

Anything. I want to understand how...

Because these are all very working figures and whether we want to go to that details.

No, I actually want to [indiscernible].

We can send it to him later on.

Yes, we can share with you separately.

Ladies and gentlemen, this was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Adhidev Chattopadhyay from ICICI Securities for closing comments.

Yes. Thank you, everyone, for joining us on the call today. I would like to hand it back to the management for their closing remarks.

Thank you all for attending the Wonderla Holidays' Q4 FY '21 results update. All of you, please stay safe and take care, and we'll see you soon. Thank you.

Thank you. On behalf of ICICI Securities Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.