C. E. Info Systems Limited (MAPMYINDIA) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the MapmyIndia conference call hosted by Anand Rathi Shares and Stock Brokers. [Operator Instructions] I now hand the conference over to Mr. Shobit Singhal. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you, Sagar. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of Anand Rathi Shares and Brokers Limited, we welcome you all to the conference call of C.E. Info Systems to discuss developments which company had announced last Friday. To discuss the same, we have with us Mr. Rakesh Verma sir, Co-Founder, Chairman and Managing Director, Rohan Verma, who is our CEO and Executive Director. And from the team, we have Mr. Nikhil Kumar, President, Geospatial Business; Ms. Sapna Ahuja, who is the Chief Operating Officer; and Ankeet Bhat, who is the Chief Business Officer of Enterprise Limited. I will now hand over the call to Mr. Verma for his opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you, Shobit, and welcome to all the participants. I think all of you must be anxiously looking at and wanting to hear from us about the outcome of the last Board meeting held on November 29, Friday. The outcome of the Board meeting was posted on the stock exchange right away. Yesterday night, we also posted the MapmyIndia's official version in the form of a press release. I hope most of you must have gotten a chance to look at the press release, also read it and understand it. I will suggest -- I know you have more -- we will have questions. So it's better that I stop here. And just to let you know, the entire management team of MapmyIndia is here to answer your questions in the manner you ask. Thank you so much. Shobit?

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from Mr. Shobit Singhal.

Sir, I have one question from my side. So do you think the decision to run the B2C as a separate company for this 10% is in the right interest of the shareholders, as we have invested in B2C segment over the last few quarters now?

Okay. Let me address it in a very simple way. The Board considered all possible options. And the options, there were 3 different options. Option 1 was related to why not B2C business being done within the company itself as a vertical. The issue that came up was, it will adversely -- it has started impacting the P&L, meaning decline in margin. So what do we do? Last 2 quarters, we have been talking a bit in the investor call about our interest to get into B2C, which is a long-term play. And long term, I mean, 2 to 3 years minimum. The -- at least the management was not getting any very positive response from the investors on that front. What we thought that maybe on a yearly basis, the investors would consider this kind of a long-term investment in something new. But again, we found that it was more on a quarter-on-quarter basis, which everybody looks at. Of course, we are not going to be affected that much by what -- different investors think differently. There are investors who look at long-term play very much. Now, the second option was why not create a subsidiary of MapmyIndia, and in that subsidiary, we do the consumer business. The issue was again the same like, subsidiary, if we own more than 20% in the subsidiary, then the problem doesn't get solved. The problem that gets solved would be the MapmyIndia doesn't have the DNA or the people-wise, and the thinking of the management, I'm not talking about Rohan, the rest of the folks, who have a good understanding of what to do with the B2C business. That could have been solved in the subsidiary, but the impact on P&L would have remained the same. So the third option was we go ahead and let it be done outside the company. And we examined and we found a lot of symbiotic -- a lot of advantages if the two companies work closely in the interest of all. But -- and ultimately lead to a win-win situation. So this was the rationale that -- on which we decided to let the new company do the B2C business.

The next question comes from Anuj Kotewar from JM Financial.

Yes. This is Abhishek on behalf of Anuj here. Sir, I have a question that has been asked to me over the last couple of days by investors. So let me just kind of be...

Can you speak a little louder?

Yes, yes. So I hope this is better.

Yes.

Yes. So this is Abhishek here on behalf of Anuj. So a couple of questions that investors asked me over the last couple of days since this announcement came out. So the first is, do you think giving out the brand for -- to this entity and all the investments that we have done over the last few years in terms of building that brand out, et cetera, for a 10% stake, is that fair for the minority shareholder? That is question number one. And question number two, given that we will continue to own the brand, is there any royalty arrangement in terms of if this entity generates revenue in B2C segment, that we are entitled to get from that entity?

This is Rohan Verma here from MapmyIndia. I'll take that question. If you look at the company's brands, which is MapmyIndia and Mappls, I think MapmyIndia's brand in a 20-year-old brand that is quite well embedded in people's minds. And keep in mind that we are primarily a B2B business which deals with the automotive industry, the corporate world and the government world. And there, we have been doing business under the MapmyIndia brand for the last 20 years. We are quite well known there. Stock ticket is also MapmyIndia. The idea behind Mappls have been to reach out to consumers. And this is a relatively recent activity. I mean, recently just last 1, 2 years, and the investments to create that brand are in extremely early stage. I don't know how many people, even now, know Mappls because of MapmyIndia enterprise, especially MapmyIndia enterprise. So in that sense, the main brand of the company under which it is generating all fixed revenue is coming from MapmyIndia. Having said that, MapmyIndia have access to the Mappls brand for its B2B and B2G, B2C business as it needs.

B2B2C.

B2B2C as it needs. So that kind of, I hope, answers the question on the brand. I mean -- and yes.

I think another part of his question is, this 10% stake only the new company? Let me help you on that. We can't take more than 20%. If we could have taken more than 20%, then why shouldn't we have taken 100% or 90%? So that 10% or 20% could be the answer, nothing more. Now, MapmyIndia is already also investing in the form of CCD, which probably will create certain equity at some point of time based on the structure we have done, about 25% discount at a third-party investment into the new company with active valuation. So keeping all that in mind, we felt that the 10% is better so that we don't cross 20%. Remember, any startup -- this is a startup. Any start-up, and that to a start-up in the consumer's business, will be burning cash like anything. Now, how they manage that burning cash is their fiscal responsibility. But we don't want MapmyIndia's P&L to get affected by this new company's losses in the P&L, and that's how we have kept the CCD as one part and 10% stake on the other side.

Okay. Maybe next question was on CCD itself. I just wanted to understand the modality in terms of how and when this will get converted. So let us say, if there is a fundraise in the immediate future, even on round 1, do you have the option to convert this at 25% discount?

Yes. With this 1 year -- within 1 year or within 3 years, it has been kept flat. So it's flat 25%.

Okay. So basically, now, let's say, there are 2 scenarios, one, in which this entity becomes really large and its valuation increases significantly. In that case, despite the fact that we are providing the initial seed fund at the most vulnerable time of any start-up, our equity stake in the company when the valuation really increases will still be limited to INR 35 crores. That's one scenario. The other scenario is if this entity for whatever reason, doesn't take off, right? So in that scenario, probably we may not get back anything. So isn't this risk-reward slightly unfavorable for the shareholders of MapmyIndia?

Not really. You talked about 2 scenarios. I believe you talked about 2 scenarios. In the first scenario, if the entity takes off, then we convert it into the equity with a 25% discount. Now where are we losing out? Because if you look at the other side of the business structure, you will understand it better. Don't look at it only the financial structure independent of business structure. First, do we have a consumer business today? I think, Rohan's answer is saying this practically 0. So now as a start-up, he is going to start it. And because he has a conviction, he has everything in his mind, all that he tried to do over the last 1 year is see, try to incubate and see is it possible or not. And that's the stage 1 has reached. Now, the next part of it is any start-up -- MapmyIndia has invested in several start-ups. It's not the first time. And we have noticed that in every start-up we invest, we try to take 2%, 3% stake to something below 20%. That's our standard practice, provided there is a strategic relationship. We are not a financial investor. In this case, there's a huge strategic relationship that whatever the consumer pull of app, let's say, app is one part of the consumer business, it's not the only consumer business. That consumer pull, in any case, is basically powered by MapmyIndia map data, powered by MapmyIndia platform. Don't you see Mappls App, in the bottom, it says MapmyIndia. That gives us a lot of credibility in the B2B business. So think from that angle, that there is a huge business relationship and, along with that, a financial gain also. Now, to answer the second question, if it falls, it doesn't take off. So now we have invested in 8 or -- 7 or 8 different startups. And quite -- so far, it has not happened because we have been very careful. We first understand the founder, and then only we make the investment in a start-up. So -- but the ones which have already succeeded, financially, MapmyIndia got highly rewarded and it has come out in our financial statements a year back or so or 2 years back. So here also, the founder is Mr. Rohan Verma. Now who doesn't have the confidence in his abilities or in his thinking about making things happen? So why should we doubt that? So the risk of -- or considering that there's a risk, risk is there in any financial structure. So that risk will always remain. But the risk is mitigated by the wisdom of the entire Board. It's not a 1% decision. We have in the Board 10 directors, 5 were independent directors, and it was a total -- what is about -- 100% consensus to go this route.

The next question comes from Nilesh Shah from Envision Capital.

Yes. I just want to understand, I mean, agree Mappls is at a very early stage. But nevertheless, the brand belongs to MapmyIndia. I want to understand, going forward, who will be the owner of Mappls brand?

I think, very clearly, our press release specifically says this. A new company will be using the MapmyIndia's retail brand, Mappls. Whereas the MapmyIndia will use the brand for its B2B and B2B2C offerings. And we'll continue to access the same Mappls Mall. That's it. It's provided so clearly.

Yes, it says clearly who will use it. But my question is who's going to own it?

Yes, the new company will own it. And MapmyIndia we'll be able to use it for its B2B, B2B2C, B2G, B2G2C business.

Okay. So basically, the brand is getting -- the ownership of the brand is getting transferred to this B2C venture?

Yes. Let me help understand -- let me help you understand this. One of the purposes of the consumer business, one of the purposes, not the only purpose, is to showcase and complement MapmyIndia offering. Now, I mean MapmyIndia is pretty unique company, pretty good company. I strongly believe in it. I mean, this is the only company, which is deep tech, digital project platform, API Solutions company, providing MaaS, SaaS, PaaS to enterprises, corporate government, automotive. On these three pillars of maps, IoT and drone. There's no other company that does this. Now, the objective -- and it's got pretty large growing addressable market. It's profitable in what it's doing. The way to get more customers for MapmyIndia and the way to get more customers to use more of MapmyIndia's maps and technology, a little bit of showcase of MapmyIndia's maps and technology across different use cases and industry has to happen. Sometimes this push doesn't come when you are only dependent on third-party customers with which we don't have necessarily a fully symbiotic relationship. Whereas in the consumer business that we are building, after all, the more people use the Mappls App or this Mappls consumer business, the more people will see the power and capability of MapmyIndia's maps and technologies. And that will have a knock-on effect on the B2B business of MapmyIndia. Also, the more the people that use Mappls App, the data coming out of that, obviously anonymized data, will help in improving MapmyIndia's map data. That's what people talk about, that what Google does on other things, that's how it helps Google. That whole platform benefits from people using the consumer's app. At the same time, MapmyIndia can't -- is not in a position right now to deal with the burn that comes from a consumer business. Even today, there is no revenue of this consumer app, but there's a burn of -- on the annual equity, you can think of the annualized burn of INR 30 crores, that is there. Is MapmyIndia in position to deal with that P&L hit, is the question that the Board strongly asked as we look to scale up the consumer business.

Actually, as a matter of fact, we asked many investors to -- serious investors. I'm not talking about retail traders. None of -- all of them said, your quarter-on-quarter, your half year to half year, your year to year is what matters to us. We said fine. Then there's no issue.

So then, Mr. Verma, having said that, and should we assume that now going forward, there will be no quarter-on-quarter issue in terms of the performance?

No, no. I didn't say that. I didn't say that. Don't try to put 2 together.

No, Mr. Verma, it's coming out as we said, this whole thing has been done with...

They will not. The investors were not really prepared to see the burn of its consumer business. Absolutely, the rest is all B2B business outcome.

No, no, I'm just saying is you are repeatedly saying that this whole thing has been done to address investor concerns around quarter-on-quarter performance. So if you believe that this issue will address that concern, then we should expect quarter-on-quarter performance then.

No, no. Let me restate it. In the last 2 quarters, the investors started asking about it. That was part #1. The part #2 also was that the DNA in MapmyIndia doesn't exist. Even in the IPO time, we always said MapmyIndia is a B2B and a B2B2C company. It is not a B2C company. So it would have been a change of the entire strategy if we -- one, if we had continued -- if we wanted to introduce B2C into the system and also ready for the burn.

So again, I just go back to that earlier point, one of the participants made. Why didn't the Board consider the possibility of paying royalty payments to MapmyIndia for having incubated Mappls and build the app and having had millions of downloads so far and made it amongst the top ranking app on App Store? Now in view of that, why essentially can't this B2C venture pay royalty on basically sales that it achieves to MapmyIndia? Isn't that a fair deal?

Okay. So you are asking about if something is sold then only in the royalty.

Yes, exactly. Whenever revenue happen, wherever the B2C venture starts earning revenues...

This won't.

Nilesh, I don't think this is an issue. The businesses want to work together to each other's benefit. So having a business relationship which is win-win is totally fine. And so I mean, not what you're seeing is not off the paper at all.

No, I know it's not off the paper, but why not make it crystal clear now rather than leaving it for a situation 2 years later, 4 years later? Why isn't that done now? This happens in the pharma industry. When somebody builds a molecule and it is licensed to somebody, that somebody is required to basically pay royalty payments apart from paying milestone payments. Here, it's the reverse. MapmyIndia is funding the new venture and basically not going to receive any royalty payments. How fair is that? This should be crystalized something right now.

Okay, let me answer in another way because for this purpose, we are sitting on the upper side of the table, right? So first, the way I look at it is -- the Mappls brand itself is not a consumer business. I think we should understand that. Mappls app will always remain a CS. So that's the way the world is operating. Tomorrow, these apps may become paid worldwide by Google and everyone, it's a different matter. So now the other part is consumer business. Consumer business, could we grow and describe it, what possible consumer business we can think of today and tomorrow, something else may happen? What is the role of MapmyIndia in that consumer business? I don't understand. Help me understand it.

No. My job is not to explain to you the business, okay? My job is to ensure that minority shareholders -- essentially minority shareholders get a fair deal. That's it. Basically, our understanding and that you have already present today that Mappls is an integrated part of MapmyIndia. If you are now basically allowing somebody else to use this brand, basically, it deserves a consideration for that. And that is also linked to basically whatever in future that venture earns, basically getting a share of that as royalty payment. That's already one participant has already flagged off that issue.

Do you think it's fair to ask someone? Forget about this new entity. I'm asking in general, would it be ever fair to what that entity does in the consumer world of the business that MapmyIndia has not even attempted to do? That will be the sole thinking of that new entity. I'm keeping the Mappls brand aside for a minute.

No, it is the Mappls brand. No, Mr. Verma.

We are only talking about the Mappls brand. Am I right?

Yes.

Not about anything else. Okay, fine. Your point taken. No, no. We have built -- the MapmyIndia has created a 25 million downloads today, and it is being at least going to them, but -- through the new entity, but at the same time, MapmyIndia is also keeping it for 5 years, the full brand usage. So now after 5 years, the question definitely has to be answered, maybe answered now. But after 5 years, what?

So is it there after 5 years?

[Operator Instructions]

Anyway, my questions are not being answered, but anyways, just in the interest of everybody.

Your question have been answered, sir. Don't say that, I have answered it saying that you remove the business part, you are only talking about the Mappls brand. And the Mappls brand, I said, both are going to be using it today for the next 5 years. So the answer only is not given related to after 5 years what. And you are expecting us to answer -- put it on paper today. Am I right?

Because it is a related party transaction, minority shareholders deserve total clarity and transparency.

There is the transparency. Where is the...

No, there is no transparency because you are now leaving it for a period of 5 years later that we will see what is to be done then.

No, no, no, I said your question is decide it now what will happen after 5 years.

Not after 5 years, I'm saying up to 5 months, let's assume you achieve a revenue of INR 1 crore that venture.

What business we'll have to give the data back towards, tell me?

Sorry.

What business they have to give the data with this, what business they have?

I'm talking of essentially the brand, the Mappls brand is being allowed to be used by someone else.

In view of that, they are also giving us the data that they're getting it from the consumer for free. Could we -- then they should charge us for that also?

Let it be yes, why not this happens, you look at the way multinationals charge. And the way basically you look at that. So I honestly don't know what the Independent Board has studied. I honestly don't know whether enough data was provided, but you see, this is a very standard operating procedure. That multinationals have a subsidiary in India, basically the multinational charges subsidiary for allowing them to use their brands. If the subsidiaries do any work for the multinationals or the parent, the subsidiaries pay back, yes, paid back by the subscribers.

One last time to explain to you, this is Rohan here. What is MapmyIndia's core business? Is it not because of B2B and B2B2C company, which makes money by selling its solutions, it MaaS, SaaS, PaaS, maps, IoT drones, 2 automotive companies, corporate government, enterprise customers? That is its business, and that's where we see a large addressable market where we are focused on, where we put a stated target of 1,000 crores by FY '28. We are on track for that. Consumer business is a distraction for MapmyIndia. There are 15 intangible benefits to MapmyIndia to have a -- to have this, which is what we have reserved with the business agreement which is the more people that use this app, which showcases the MapmyIndia maps and technologies and which generate data that could be useful to MapmyIndia, that's what MapmyIndia is getting the benefits of it from.

You can consider that as a royalty.

And that is -- that will help MapmyIndia's B2B and B2B2C business. I think see it in the light of, if this works well, then it equally helps MapmyIndia. Because otherwise, by doing it inside, would be -- would cause the pain to the company and the investors because it could lead to the losses or drag, whether financial or organizational, where the DNA is also quite different.

No. I mean, you're giving reasons for rationale of doing it as a separate venture, I get that. I'm only talking about that -- I'm not questioning the need for the venture, which is fine. That is well understood and you explained it really well. So that is fully appreciated. All I'm saying is the terms between MapmyIndia and this new venture honestly are not necessarily fair to basically the shareholders of MapmyIndia. That's my point.

Okay. We can move on to the next participant.

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from Farokh Pandole from Avestha and Management LLP.

I think given the previous conversation and the fact that it's been vocalized that the drain of the consumer business going forward would be too much for MapmyIndia to bear, could we get some sense? Because I believe that this will continue until March 31. So could we get some sense of what precisely this drain is going to be for this quarter and for next given that this was an issue in the previous quarter also? And could we also understand that from April 1 onwards, regardless, there will not be any drain whatsoever? Am I right in saying that?

Yes, Farokh, from first April, there won't be any. And from December 31 also, December 31 also, there wouldn't be any. Smooth -- in Q3, we are anyway through it, I mean.

So from Q4, there won't be any. And of course, the future, there won't be any.

The next question comes from Piyush Parag from Elara Capital.

Am I audible?

Yes, sir, please go ahead.

Okay. Sir, can you just throw some light on how this -- the cost that you have already incurred, how that will be treated? And probably...

Speak it louder, please.

Please speak louder.

Okay. Cool. So can you just throw some light on that in creating Mappls brand, you might have invested significantly. So how is -- this is going to be treated and how would we have overall impact?

Okay. Help me understand, significant in your mind for the Mappls brand.

Yes, no, so I'm trying to understand. So basically, now this will be given to the new company. So what would be the current risk that you're going to take over the next 2 quarters or maybe a single quarter? So overall, how it will evolve, how we should look -- how the accounting will be done for this?

First is, I don't know what kind of investment we have made in Mappls brand. If I have to put the numbers and even pick up from my accounting books, it will be major amount as far as the cost is concerned. And the second thing is the brand is going along with MapmyIndia India. But now your other question, I didn't even understand how it will impact our books. What was that question?

Okay. I got it. So I'm also looking how much would have -- you have been investing into this because there has been, as you said that there has been a cost which impacted your profitability in the last quarter. So I was just trying to understand when the sense how this will go into look, I mean, going forward? So my question was more on the brand that -- how the cost would be.

We have already disclosed in the Q2. We spent around INR 5 crores for the consumer business, which is part of -- some might be part of brands, some might be part of people, some might be part of certain other activities related to consumer.

The next question comes from Shreya Banthia from Oakland Capital Management LLP.

Am I audible?

Yes. But speak louder, please.

Sir, my questions have been answered, so I'll get back to the queue.

The next question comes from Shweta Deshmukh from Arihant Capital Markets.

Am I audible?

Yes. Just speak louder. That's all.

Yes. Sure, sir. Sir, my question is, what is the current market size and the growth rate trajectory of the land mapping business? If you could provide insight into the share of digital and advanced mapping solution, like 3D and 4D mapping in the land mapping sector?

B2C.

I answered this question in the past in the earnings calls around the land mapping part. I mean, if you want to say something...

Nikhil would add. Nikhil is there, our President for Geospatial.

Yes. So there are two questions he has asked, what is the kind of trajectory that we are seeing in the land mapping market? So there are 2 types of projected that we are seeing unfolding. One is with regard to land record modernization in the rural segment. And second, back in the urban segment. That itself is about INR 10,000 crores that government is thinking of investing. The second part of this question is the digital trend. The government has been keen in creating the digital representation of the physical world. And that separate investment has been planned, along with its integration with state level integration of right of records. So that's first level of bolting that you have heard about, INR 11,000 crore was planned during the budget this year. But the total beneficiary states are receiving that in differently. And that is yet to be decided in terms of what the exact number is, but that's very huge. So there are two parts. One is the national mapping agency trying to create land records for the country. And second part of the investment is going to the state revenue department, integrating the right of records with this base map. So these are two huge opportunities in the land modernization segment, if that answers your question.

Okay, Nikhil, you stay on. I think in the previous questions, Nilesh was asking about on the brand, you have some opinion. Please speak up.

Yes. No, I was just looking at the two things that he needs -- Nilesh needs to discern. One is the company brand and the second is a product solution brand. I have worked in many companies where the product brand is what he was -- the company brand, what he was sharing, and he gave a distribution example, and that was very -- something very -- I was working with SV and SV India has this office in India, for which they used to pay royalty is not the manner which that we are stitching our business engagement here. I see it's very different. It's for a product brand, which is getting value addition in consumer segment market, where MapmyIndia is not present. And we have 3 distinct advantages that we are seeing, for which I don't think a royalty can be paid by a new entity. One is the new type of data that will be actually coming back, helping MapmyIndia to actually address new use cases. That will, in fact, help creating new use cases altogether, new solutions -- build new solutions. Second is the new market itself. There are various markets like insurance, CLS base tolling. We are not present because it's very linked with consumer. And that is going to be kind of opened up for us. So that's the second advantage. And third is also tomorrow, should that become a big patient, that we get back the share price on that. So in my mind, I think it's very different than the one the multinational example was kind of giving.

Okay. Can I ask my second question?

Yes, ma'am, please go ahead.

Yes. So will the company be looking at other substantial investment no more than INR 35 crores, either in the new venture or additional verticals over the next fiscal year?

I think I've answered that in the PR. If you read it in the business restructuring, the new company will operate -- no, sorry, where it is, in the ownership and all that. The CCD money will be invested in the new company, not in the personal name. Somebody had asked me so I'm pointing it out. It will be invested in the new company. The future capital requirement, what is missing is, if any, will be taken up by the management Board at the appropriate time. Good decisions about future investments are made at least not MapmyIndia in the beginning. We always are careful about it, and we -- and even if it's our other existing investors, we say we'll take a call when you need it. We'll see. Does it benefit MapmyIndia or not?

The next question comes from Manjit Rathore from [OIM Capital ].

Am I audible?

Manjit, sir, may we request to use the handset mode, please?

And just speak a little louder?

Yes. Am I audible now?

Yes.

Okay. Not that I have any new question other than what the participants have already asked, but I would like to still rephrase it and just give my -- ask the -- raise the concern from our end. Sir, I understand that Mappls as a brand, we might have done very little financial investment when we tried to measure it in financial outlook. But do we feel that -- it has not -- as a company, MapmyIndia has not benefited Mappls brand, other than the money that has been invested into that. I don't know whether that would be the absolute correct interpretation. Second question is, sir, while I understand that there were certain investors who would rightfully feel that they want to look at quarter-on-quarter performance, but that does not certainly represent all investors, right? like there were a few of us, especially us who have been a little excited about the B2C business. And we've also been very excited about the history of the management and the way you have executed and ramped up several other businesses. Now, as you carve out a different subsidiary, it is very well appreciated that the current structure protects the existing shareholders from any potential downside coming from the proposed new business. But sir, at the same time, what another participant has mentioned, I do tend to agree with it, that in case of an upside in this business, we don't see a full participation. Again, I understand that in terms of financial outlet, we may be able to see a very little investment that might have gone into Mappls brand. But at least some sort of royalty payment or any other arrangement and whatever benefit we get from the said company, we might pay to them. And we understand that the cash burn could be there in the initial years, we trust your adjustment, but if not paid out right, it could be accrued. I'm not saying that a perfect solution can be proposed by us. We leave it to you. But the way it is left currently, it does not leave -- it does leave a concerned taste.

Okay. Good. Thanks for your advice. When we finalize the business agreement, we'll keep in mind what you are saying on the brand part.

The next question comes from Deepak from Sundaram Mutual Funds.

Am I audible?

Yes.

Yes. Sir, I have 2 questions. My first was I was reading the press release. And in that, you had mentioned that the Mappls Gadgets, which is for consumer, will also be transferred to the new entity. And if my understanding is correct, the Mappls Gadgets is basically your dash cam and smart helmet kit, which will be a part of IoT business, right? And there will be a few consumers who will also be doing GPS tracker and SaaS revenue from that. So could you just elaborate like how much of the revenue currently could be kind of switched to the new entity because of this?

So Deepak, this is Rohan here. We are talking about Mappls Gadgets only D2C, direct-to-consumer. That means online through Amazon type marketplaces or the dotcom itself. We're not talking about off-line retail and definitely, we're not talking about anything B2B. So in that sense, actually, there is no revenue.

Today.

I mean, today for the D2C part of Mappls Gadgets.

But I will add assuming that tomorrow, this new company makes a big headway in the B2C market, online market, they will be buying many of those Gadgets from MapmyIndia only. So MapmyIndia's revenue will go up.

Okay. Got it. Sir, no, I just wanted to understand that Mappls Gadgets was data that it will get transferred there. So that's why I thought that smart kits and dash cam and GPS tracker which is used direct by the consumer, even that gets transferred there. That was my understanding.

See, the whole idea is this new company will create a marketplace of the consumers through the, you call it, Internet way, social media way, and that creation will take not only time but money also substantial. And then the business has happened. So coming to your gadget, it's a very straight, no-brainer answer that MapmyIndia will benefit is MapmyIndia is making those gadgets.

Okay. Got it. And sir, my second question revolves around costs. So in previous con call, you reiterated that the main marketing business promotion expense which we do, which is currently around INR 4 crores, INR 5 crores on a quarterly run rate, that is 100% attributable to B2C business, right?

Yes.