EFC (I) Limited (512008) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, a very good morning, and welcome to the earnings conference call of EFC India Limited for Q3 of FY '25. We have with us today, Mr. Umesh Kumar Sahay, Chairman and Managing Director of EFC India Limited; Mr. Nikhil Dilipbhai Bhuta, Whole-Time Director; Mr. Uday Tushar Vora, Chief Financial Officer; and Mr. Aman Gupta, Company Secretary of EFC India Limited. [Operator Instructions] I would now like to hand the conference to Mr. Umesh Kumar Sahay, Chairman and Managing Director, to give his opening remarks. Please go ahead.

Thank you. Thank you. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us on the earnings conference call of EFC India Limited quarter 3 of financial year 2025. The results we shared yesterday show the hard work and dedication of our team. The number and milestone in the investor presentation highlight the progress we have made in achieving our goal and creating value. We remain focused on improving our operations, staying innovative and delivering a steady growth. Now I request Mr. Uday Vora, CFO, to give key highlights.

Good morning, everyone. I'm Uday Vora, CFO of EFC India Limited, and it's my privilege to welcome you all to our earnings conference call for Q3 FY '25. On behalf of the management, I extend our sincere gratitude for your continued interest, trust and support in our company. During today's discussion, we will provide an in-depth review of our financial and operational performance for the quarter ending December 31, 2024, as well as for the 9 months of the current financial year. Furthermore, we will highlight key strategic initiatives undertaken during the period and share our outlook for the future. Financial performance highlights. In Q3 FY '25, EFC India Limited delivered robust financial results, reinforcing our commitment to sustainable growth and stakeholder value creation. Revenue stood at INR 181.5 crores, representing a sequential growth of 6.1% compared to quarter 2 FY '25. EBITDA came in at INR 96.92 crores, registering an impressive growth of 10.3% quarter-on-quarter. PAT was INR 40.47 crores, reflecting 10.7% sequential increase. For 9 months FY '25 period, revenue totaled INR 457.87 crores, surpassing FY '24 full year revenue by 7%. EBITDA stood at INR 230.51 crores and PAT amounted to INR 92.81 crores. These results underscore our ability to maintain strong profitability while navigating a dynamic business environment. Leasing vertical performance. Our leasing vertical achieved significant operational and financial milestones during quarter 3 FY '25. Assets under management now exceed 2.6 million square feet, spanning 70 sites with an average site size of 35,000 to 40,000 square feet. Seating capacity has reached 57,000 seats with an average occupancy rate of 90%, translating to a healthy average rent per seat of 6,250 and upwards. During the quarter, we added 2 lakh square feet to our AUM and enhanced our capacity by 5,650 seats. Rental revenue for the quarter was INR 96.34 crores, a 31% year-on-year growth, while EBIT surged by 37% quarter-on-quarter and 157% year-on-year showcasing our strong operational execution and ability to capture growing demand for managed workspaces. Design and build vertical performance. Our design and build vertical recorded exceptional growth executing projects, spanning over 4 lakh square feet across key sectors such as real estate, education, IT and ITES. The total project pipeline stands at INR 92 crores with INR 32 crores worth of projects under execution and an additional INR 60 crores in progress. The vertical achieved a 51% increase in revenue and 27% growth in EBIT year-on-year, reflecting the strength of our integrated turnkey solution and our ability to address evolving client needs with precision. Our furniture vertical, the Ek design. We have established our product lines and achieved standards to increase the turnover. Revenue from completed projects amounted to INR 13.33 crores with INR 2.65 crores of projects currently under execution. The order pipeline remains robust with projects worth INR 8.57 crores slated for completion within 30 days and an additional INR 14.35 crores within 30 to 60 days. This performance underscores our ability to deliver high-value projects efficiently, further strengthening our relationship and leadership in the furniture and design space. Our Q3 FY '25 results are a testament to EFC India Limited's resilient business model, operational excellence and strategic focus on long-term growth. As we look ahead, we remain committed to expanding our footprint strengthening our core verticals and consistently delivering value to all stakeholders. Thank you once again for joining us today. I request Mr. Nikhil Bhuta, Director of the company, to address further and take up the questions.

Thank you, Uday, and welcome, everyone, to the conference call for Q3 financial year '24-'25 of EFC (I) Limited. I'm Nikhil Bhuta, Whole-Time Director of EFC India Limited. I'm genuinely overwhelmed to inform you all that we have received a certificate of registration for our Emberstone SM REIT which is -- will be managed by our subsidiary, EFC Investment Management Private Limited. We received the certificate of registration in the last quarter. This is the third registration in whole of India and first of its kind in terms that a managed office operator has come up with [ floating ] in SM REIT. Now without taking much of your time, and as we've already highlighted the results quite in detail, I request moderator, Mr. Ryan, to open the forum for a question-and-answer session. Thank you, Ryan, please.

[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from the line of Sahil Sharma from Columbus Capital.

Umesh, sir, and Nikhil, sir congratulations [Foreign Language] on very good numbers. This is very good growth, especially -- yes, especially given the fact that in the last year, [Foreign Language] and this time that is not there. So congratulations on that achievement. Sir, [Foreign Language] going forward on the SM REIT [indiscernible] expectations time line, when, can we expect to file a DRHP And when are we expecting to do the IPO for it?

Sahil, first of all, thank you so much. And yes, with regards to SM REIT, we're almost now in the final leg of preparation of the offer document. The -- we have appointed CBRE as our industry business partner, and they are right now conducting the research on couple of cities, primarily which we are right now identifying certain properties. So I think we are expecting that -- roughly around in the month of February, we are expecting to file the DRH, I mean, offer document with the SEBI. And then as for the, I mean, approval receiving from the SEBI, immediately upon receiving the approval, we will definitely go for the IPO. So our at least offer document filing, we are expecting it to get filed during the month of February. As it looks right now, probably towards mid- to third week of February, we should be able to file the offer document.

That's very understandable. And my second question is that if you look at the investor presentation this time, you have given very good details on the order booking for both the Design and Build and the Furniture. And so with that visibility, I think, like at least from my calculations, we are somewhere close to achieving something like INR 690 crores to INR 700 crores top line and around -- from my calculations around INR 130 crores to INR 140 crores bottom line. So I think this year is going as per what guidance you had given in the earlier call. Sir, my question is going forward for FY '26, what is the kind of guidance or expectations that we have for the growth of the company?

Sahil [Foreign Language] in terms of bottom line. Second, furniture manufacturing [Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

Sahil [Foreign Language] as a management, we will make sure [Foreign Language].

The next question comes from the line of Amit Agarwal from Nuvama Wealth.

Congrats on a good set of numbers. My question primarily relates to rental income has grown by about 31% despite your total number of seats having grown about 52% on a year-on-year basis, talking about it. So approximately what I calculated, probably on year-on-year basis, for build seats, I think there is a big growth of 14%. Is it normal in this course of business ups and downs? Or is there any particular reason for that?

No, it's obviously normal because everything is contractual. And what happens is the timing also is a very significant contributor to this deviations because what happens is that, let us say, for an instance, in a particular quarter, if the seats are -- majority of the seats, which are getting built -- incrementally built during this quarter are built during, let's say, in the first month or the second month or the third month or on an average, so that matters a lot. And then also, obviously, in some of the cases, once the builds are booked, some of the seats which are booked in a staggered way of seat building up also happening because clients -- large clients when they kind of join in, the total seats which they contract with us might be larger seats, but they also start filling it up in a staggered manner. So the revenue would show a little bit of variation in that range because the timing difference is very critical, as I explained. And that is how we have always said that to analyze the results on a quarterly basis on the rental site becomes little difficult, because on every quarter, depending upon the situation in that particular quarter in terms of revenue getting booked, in terms of sites coming on live, et cetera, would make obviously a difference in the result for that particular quarter.

The next question comes from the line of Aayush Saboo from Choice Equity Broking Private Limited.

Could you please give us some guidance regarding the total CapEx that we'll be doing for financial year '25 and '26, considering all 3 verticals?

So, Aayush, with regards to the CapEx, with regards to our leasing business, as we always maintain that we are trying to add around 25,000 seats on an annualized basis every year-on-year, at least going forward a couple of years. Considering that, there's about per seat CapEx of about INR 50,000 that is generally what is the thumb rule that we follow. And then about INR 10,000 we consider in terms of investments in deposits. So if you consider it completely, then in that sense, we are looking at about total INR 150 crores-odd amount of investment. Now what here comes into, I mean, Board calculation is the fact that we try our best in ensuring that maximum of this CapEx is funded through our landlords because as you appreciate that when we take the property on lease from these landlords, we try to ensure that how much we can try to get it funded through the landlord so that rather than the CapEx, that rather comes back to us in the form of OpEx because that gets amortized in form of rental, that the landlord would charge me for the furnished property. So if you look at it from a leasing business point of view, the total outlay likely to be is around INR 150 crores, which we will try to manage between us and the landlord. Generally, our ratio has always been very positive where we do a comparative lesser investment, let's say, about 15%, 20% of the total outlay and balance we try to get it funded through the landlord. And that's why we don't take those aggressive stand in terms of building up the inventory without having a backup order pipeline with us. So that's on the leasing vertical. On the furniture vertical, there will be investments, but that investment would be largely in terms of working capital because the moment our business will grow, there will be also growth in the institutional business on the furniture vertical and the institutional vertical would call for a larger working capital deployment. So if we are expecting a business of about INR 150 crores next year in the furniture vertical. And at about 2 months minimum of the working capital deployment, that's the kind of investment that we would be making in the furniture vertical. There will be no further CapEx, which would be required in the furniture vertical because all the infrastructure, machineries -- I mean, plant and machineries, tools, et cetera, has already been developed and ready for operations. So there is no further CapEx in terms of the plant and machinery, et cetera is required any further. With regards to the design and build vertical, again, as we've always maintained that it is largely a working capital business because it's -- at the end of the day, it's a service business that we carry out for our principles. And there also, we -- our estimates are about 30 to 45 days of working capital deployment that would be required, where this year, we are expecting to close the -- targeting to close this vertical at about INR 225 crores, INR 250 crores. And the next year, we obviously would like to kind of continue the same trend of growth if that we consider for about 35 to 45 days -- 30 to 45 days of working capital requirement, that's what would be the investment that would outlay that we would look for in the entire coming financial year. I hope I've answered your question.

[Operator Instructions] We move on to the next question, which is from the line of Shubham Jain from NV Alpha Fund.

Congratulations on a fantastic set of numbers. I had a couple of questions. The first thing I wanted to understand was there's a sharp rise in our interest cost quarter-on-quarter from INR 7 crores to INR 18 crores. And there's a dip in other expense from a INR 15 crore to INR 20 crore range to INR 9 crores in this quarter. So what explains this change in numbers?

So yes, the increase in the finance cost is also attributable to a few things. One is if you recollect during this quarter, only we -- I mean just about the previous quarter only -- end of previous quarter only, we had acquired a property in our books here in Wakadewadi, Pune. And obviously, the interest and the repayment on that on an EMI would have begun beginning this quarter, number one. So that was one contributor because that's also a loan of about in INR 55-odd crores. And on that, our repayment had started. So, I mean, our interest in repayment has started from September onwards. That's one. Secondly, also the contributor is the finance cost estimates, which happened due to the Ind AS implication. So that has also, because there are certain sites which have come on live during this quarter comparatively, then the portion relating to that would also -- would get accounted for during this quarter. And hence, there is an incremental interest cost in this particular quarter, Shubham.

Okay. Understood. And the other expense?

Yes. Other expenses, basically, I mean, there are obviously certain onetime expenses, which happens in the beginning of this, there are certain AMC costs, there are certain [ retainer ] costs, which should have happened, and those would have got booked in the first quarter. And hence, those onetime expenses are not further accounted in this quarter. So largely because of certain specific onetime expenses. Again, there were certain expenses relating to the research and the other activity, which carried out relating to REITs, the AIF, et cetera, that we are trying to come up with and the legal and the financial fees around that would have been contributed in increasing the other expenses in the first quarter, which is now managed well during this particular quarter because such no further expenses were there.

Understood. Understood. So just to understand how we account for our lease costs, right? Is that across our cost of operations and other expenses and more interest in depreciation costs? What would be the outflow of the rental that we pay to the properties that we rent out?

So in terms of touching points for the impact of lease accounting, the touching points are obviously, one is your rent outflow, one is your finance cost and one is your amortization cost, right? And then there is also a bit in the revenue side because there is promotional interest and certain financial lease income that gets booked at the income level. And then there is substantial impact coming on to the rent outflow and the amortization and the depreciation accounts -- heads. With regards to the rent outflow, are you talking in terms of what is an absolute quantum in terms of...

Yes, yes. I'm looking for the absolute quantum for the quarter.

Yes. So absolute quantum for the quarter, I mean, as I said -- as we said, that is generally in the range of around 45% to 50% of the total income that we incurred and total income that we earned. And so right now, let's say, if we are looking at more than around 55,000 seats that we have the capacity, so we are looking at anything in an average of about around INR 65 depending upon the new sites. And let's say, in the earlier -- I mean the older sites, we are looking at in an average of about INR 50. That is the kind of outflow that we are looking at, between INR 50 to INR 65 on a bare shell basis and about, let's say, INR 65 to around INR 80, INR 85 on a furnished site rate per square feet that we are looking at.

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Sandeep Agarwal from Naredi Investment.

The first question is regarding currently we have 70 sites out of which how many sites are with us for more than 5 years?

So more than 5 years, sir, would be around 55% to 60% because most of the expansion, as you would have seen, have happened post 2022. So yes, I mean, more than 5-year sites would not be more than 50%. It will be in and around that or a little less than that, in fact.

Okay. Sir, if you -- sir, my next question is, if we do any renewal site from the landlord, then what do you -- with the furniture do not renewal site from the landlord, so what are you doing with the furniture? Do you completely amortize or use it at a new site?

No, no. So if we are -- let's say, if we are continuing with a particular site, then obviously, the furniture which is fitted out would remain within that, number one. Number two, it will also matter that whether the furniture is funded by us or it is funded by the landlord. So let us say, if the furniture is funded by the landlord then it is immaterial, whether we leave after 5 years or we continue after the 5 years because anyway, we are going to be charged certain rental accordingly. Only in a circumstance where we are -- if we have to kind of renew ourselves and if we are not able to renew where we have invested for the furniture, then that is the reason why we always calculate that whatever is the landlord tenure for which we have invested in the furniture, we amortize that during that tenure itself. So we don't consider as if it is going to get renewed. If it gets renewed, that's a benefit, that's an additional advantage that we get because we've already kind of amortized the entire furniture during that tenure only. So only in case -- this question or this aspect is relevant only in case where a site where we have funded for the furniture. And if we are not able to renew the contract with the landlord for whatever reason, then in any case, we would have amortized this during this first 5-year contract for which we have taken the landlord's agreement.

The next question comes from the line of Sagnik Karmakar from E-Stock Broking.

What I wanted to ask is, this quarter, whatever financial revenue we have booked, so that comes totally from our internal orders, right?

No. I mean, because -- in fact, this doesn't really count the internal orders. So there is about more than about INR 2.5 crores, INR 3 crores of internal orders, which has got kind of knocked off during the consolidation. So this is completely a third-party contract that has got accounted for and reported in the consolidated results.

Okay. So we talked about order going through Hyderabad, I think, last quarter. Is that the one?

Yes. So no, so Hyderabad one was the first order, which has -- it was -- that was what we had received from an F&B company, and that obviously got delivered partially in the last quarter. And that is one of the contracts, which is part of this total revenue that we are talking about.

Okay. Understood. So I wanted to understand, when you say that the SM REIT will help the bottom line, how exactly in terms of financials is it going to help?

So under the SM REIT, our wholly owned subsidiary, EFC Investment Management Private Limited is going to be the manager to the SM REIT, because SM REIT, we will only be owner -- owning it 5% and the balance would be owned by the investors. So in terms of revenue, which will come directly on our books is the income for the services for management and operation of that entire SM REIT, including managing their occupancy, including taking care of their marketing activity, administration and operational activity, all the activity that we would be carrying out, that would be charged in a form of service fee and that service fee will directly add to our bottom line because all other expenses, whether on account of electricity, on account of housekeeping, security, which are generally booked in our books are -- now will get booked with regards to the property that SM REIT has acquired, in the book of SM REIT only. So we will get directly only a net service fee that we are eligible for delivering these services for those SM REIT. And that's why it is adding to the bottom line.

The next question comes from the line of Kushal Chauhan from Vyom.

Sir, I wanted to understand on margins. So the D&B margins have shrunk a little bit. So what is the guidance going forward and -- in all of these impacts? And how are we expecting around 40% of margins from furniture business as per your commentary? Because that is something which even big players are not able to generate.

So with regards to the D&B division, the margins -- I mean, we generally expect a margin range to be anything around 17%, 18% only, but largely because of the certain contracts that -- which we are receiving today that is really contributing in us enabling higher margins. And obviously, if tomorrow we get the blend, which is likely to happen in the coming quarter, where we get the blend of this contract, the average would come down around 20%, 22%, despite we are getting certain high-margin contracts because there will be contracts which are also of a moderate margin, which will average out the entire margin profile. With regards to the rental income, rental margins, if you see at an EBIT level, yes, EBIT level comes pretty high because it doesn't account for interest costs, where there are about 8 floors, which are now at this point of time owned by us and the revenue which comes from there, we don't have to pay out the rental. And hence, that proportionate amount is actually getting paid in the form of interest because we have taken LRD against those properties. So if you really want to understand the margins, then you have to actually calculate not just look at the EBIT, but also minus the interest portion, which is dedicated only to the leasing vertical, then you'll see it will come out around 30%, and that's the kind of margin that we have always guided to the investors that we are trying to achieve from our businesses.

And what can be the CapEx per seat? It was around INR 1,400 or INR 1,500 per square feet. So what is the guidance going forward? And how are we managing this cost efficiency?

So as I've explained earlier, that CapEx per seat would range around INR 50,000 per seat or, let's say, if you talk in terms of square feet, our thumb rule always has been around INR 1,250 per square feet, and we will maintain that thumb rule always because we believe very strongly that if we really do not kind of optimize or bring efficiency here, then there are really less scope for me to kind of bring the -- maintain my margin profile accordingly. And hence, my -- if you're looking at in terms of outlook, as I said, my CapEx profile would remain at INR 1,250 per square feet. And as I've also mentioned to the earlier answer that we try our best in identifying and locating properties where most of our properties are getting funded in terms of CapEx for fit-out expenses through the landlord only. So that there is a lesser CapEx that is getting burdened on the company and according to liabilities.

The next question comes from the line of Vishal Mehta from Raghav Capital.

Wanted to understand a couple of days back, you had this BSE notice that you have acquired this company Mather and Platt. What's the rationale behind that?

So this -- basically, we have acquired this company more like a strategic investor. We were not going to participate actively in the management and operation of the company. The management of the company is kind of a separately run through the significant promoter shareholders who are the promoters also. And our interest is to -- we are looking at some synergies that could be established with this company, which is operating in renewable energy sector, so that going forward, if those synergies could help us in bringing down our operation costs or maintaining our margin profile. That's the precise reason why we have kind of taken a strategic call in participating and acquiring certain strategic investment share in the company itself.

The next question comes from the line of Raj Saraf [indiscernible] investors.

Congratulations on the amazing sets of numbers. Sir, a couple of questions from my side, sir. Sir, in this Q3, sir, we have availability of operational seats like 51,000 to 52,000 total. So going forward, by the time we conclude this financial year, how much seats will be available for billing?

Sir, by end of this financial year from a billing perspective, we are trying to achieve total seats, anything around 55,000 seats that we are trying to bring it on a billing level. And on a capacity level, obviously, we are trying to achieve more than around 62,000 to 65,000 depending upon how the contract is getting secured -- closed for acquisition because this is the quarter we try to maximize ourselves in terms of securing the contract so that the revenues from those contracts can start spilling -- kind of generating from the next financial year first quarter itself.

Okay. Fine, sir. And, sir, as we are listening to the market and seeing some slowdown in the economy, so -- do you feel that this is also affecting our operations bookings like that, sir?

So at this point of time -- first of all, as you have appreciated one of the reasons why we have kind of created this integrated structure and also created multiple sources of revenue is to ensure that we kind of hedge ourselves or shield ourselves from potential risk that one can foresee from slowdown in a particular kind of a sector. Yes, all the 3 verticals are having dependence on the real estate and accordingly on the economy. Yes, the economic slowdown would have an overall impact. But as we can see right now, primarily post-COVID, the entire flex office market and also the way the office premises are getting on a leasing model, where the ultimate customers are looking at a solution which is more flexible for them and more solution which is kind of less CapEx-oriented for them, they are remaining to be an asset-light company. And hence, the likely growth in these sectors is likely to remain upward for next at least 1 or 2 years, independent of the overall economic situation as what it appears to be as of now. We are keeping a tab on this situation. And as we say that there are sectors which are essentials and would remain robust at least going forward, so let's say, education, health care, et cetera. And that's why our focus from our furniture sector is also not only on the real estate sector, but also onto those education and health care sectors so that we can at least try to tap those sectors and get more revenue from that in the furniture division, similarly, on the D&B division. And also our customers that we are trying to learn under the leasing vertical are also diversified. We are not only focused on IT, ITA or BFSI, but also trying to get into a different kind of customers who are operating in different industries. And so that we have a proper risk distributed across the sector that we are trying to work upon. So I mean that's the kind of strategy that we are adopting and I think we are trying to kind of hedge ourselves against the potential risk because of the slowdown in the economy, global economy or in the domestic economy could bring into our businesses.

The next question comes from the line of [ Rohan Shakani ] from [indiscernible].

I just wanted to ask a couple of questions that, first of all, you had -- in the quarter 2 conference call, you had given a guidance of the rent per square feet that was INR 6,250. But the rent -- but you mentioned that the further seats will have rent about INR 5,500 or more. But seeing more than 10% growth in seats. The average rent per square feet -- per seating hasn't increased. So like what can we expect in the further quarters regarding the average rent per seat?

So we have always maintained that we try to operate within this bracket, which is on an average, it ranges from INR 6,000 to INR 7,000, INR 7,500 and average out to around INR 6,250 to INR 6,500. And that's the range that we try to operate and that's how entire economics also we plan. So whenever starting - beginning from acquisition of site, so the rental that we pay out, the kind of CapEx that we do, and obviously, the price that we kind of establish for that micro market, we try to maintain within this range. Having said that, obviously, we are looking at a situation because right now, we are already seeing a trend where we are achieving anything around INR 7,000 plus/minus, let's say, 10%, that kind of range, depending upon, again, like I said, the markets, depending upon the location that we are kind of penetrating in. So -- but overall trend in terms of pricing would remain the same because we are very conscious. In our industry, location and pricing are the 2 very critical factors that one needs to be really focused about in terms of achieving the right growth and maintaining the right margin profile. So it would certainly remain in this range.

My second question is seeing the advent of furniture divisions, two questions here. What can be the revenue split going forward? And secondly, as you said that the furniture is in-house, so how much margin can we see to be realized in next financial year? Because currently, we can see that there is a very low profit before tax in terms of furniture division. EBIT, so, yes.

Yes, yes, yes. So no, yes, absolutely, in terms of the contribution of each vertical is concerned, going forward, yes, since our rental business is a legacy business and the core business that we have established ourselves with, that for next 1 and 2 years would remain a frontrunner and going -- but if you look at it probably down the line 2 years, we are -- we will be more than happy to see a situation where we are able to bring kind of an equilibrium among all the 3 verticals, number one. With regards to the margins for the furniture vertical, we are really confident that considering the kind of product that range that we have developed, and we are also continuously developing and the market conditions, we believe that 30% EBITDA is something which is really achievable when we entered the market. Based on the market report and the research, we've always been guided that anything between 35% to 40% is something achievable. But realistically speaking, considering the different product mix that one would come up with, achieving 30% margin in our mind is very much achievable and would be achieved. At present, you see a lesser margin, primarily because obviously, we are not at our best capacity because as we explained, we started only in last quarter. And obviously, it took kind of a little time in terms of establish the product range, establishing the quality standards and getting our team trained to do mass production and so on and so forth. So going forward, once we do a better capacity utilization, you will start seeing the margins in the furniture division in terms of its EBIT level as we have seen right now. But yes, certainly, we will be able to maintain a margin in and around 30% on an EBITDA level in the furniture division.

The next question comes from the line of Abhishek Dixit from Hem Securities.

Hello. Sir, my question was -- hello, yes, hi, sir. Am I audible, sir?

Yes, yes, please.

Yes. So in the earlier con call, sir, we have given the guidance of doubling our top line in FY '25. So, sir, are we intact on that?

So doubling our top line was obviously the target that we had once kept for ourselves because you know you need to hit for the -- those higher targets. And we are -- maybe not exactly would be in a position to double it, but we would certainly be going as near as possible to that. And right now, looking at the growth overall, we believe we'll certainly not be able to double it entirely, but would come somewhere near to that, maybe I mean, around 50% more than the last year will certainly be the achievable situation.

Okay. So like we are aiming for 50% growth in the top line in FY '25?

Yes, more than that, yes, in and around.

Like, what was the reason, like, sir, we missed our guidance?

No, no. So like I said, it is not a guidance. That was a target that we had kept and we still want to achieve such. But if you look at that, we have kind of improved our margins. So independent of the -- if you look at the margins, margin will get doubled from what we achieved last year. So -- which is what is more significant because we've kind of with these integrations, we have at least tried to bring the efficiencies. As you could see my last year, entire year, PAT was at about INR 62 crores, INR 63 crores. And this quarter, I mean, by 9-year result is at about INR 92.8 crores. So there is already more than 50% increment in the profitability by 9 months only. And with every profitability getting added, it's going to be marginally be adding only. So certainly, we'll be doubling our profitability. In terms of turnover. Yes, we would achieve a little lesser than what we have targeted for in terms of doubling it. But the more important, as I've explained, is that we are able to bring those efficiencies through this integrated model and achieve a better profitability in the overall business.

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question, and we conclude the question-and-answer session. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Aman Gupta, Company Secretary of EFC India Limited for his closing comments.

Thank you, Ryan. Thank you, everyone, for joining us on the earnings call. We truly appreciate your time and engagement. If you have any further queries or require additional information, please feel free to reach out to our Investor Relations team or drop us an email. Your continued support and trust are invaluable for -- as we work together to drive the company forward. Wishing you all a wonderful day ahead. Thank you.

Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of EFC India Limited, that concludes today's session. If there are any questions that have remained unanswered, due to paucity of time, request you to kindly send us the same to [email protected]. Thank you for your participation, and you may now disconnect the call. Thank you.