Otovo ASA (OTOVO) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

[Starts Abruptly]. Additionally, we are joined by Otovo's CEO, John Berger, which will give a short introduction and Jack Berger as well, which is the Director of Software Engineering at Otovo. He will give a short live demonstration of the Endurance System. Afterwards, we will end the session with the Q&A. [Operator Instructions] And with that, I'll hand over to John and Jack.

Thanks, [ Albert ]. Thanks for having us. It's an exciting time with the technology change brought about by artificial intelligence. You hear a lot of things about what artificial intelligence is about and what it can do in the future, some being a little scary and most being pretty exciting, especially as it relates to businesses and especially service businesses like what Otovo does, which is behind the meter for both commercial and residential, we solve and provide maintenance for power assets for specifically solar, batteries, generators, EV chargers and load managers. So first, I'm going to go through and talk a little bit more about Otovo and investment thesis. And then I'm going to turn it over to Jack, who's going to take you through a live rendition and walk through customer journey, if you will, with Endurance. And this is all live. So if there's anything goes wrong, you know it's live, given technology. But also, he's going to walk through, including our Pulse system, which is an Endurance subset of HR, maybe some others as well if we have some time and love for questions. Please ask what you're thinking about because if you're think about somebody else is most likely as well. So appreciate that. All right. First of all, and Otovo at a glance, this is all Q1 information. Obviously, we have earnings next week, so we will not be discussing in any way, shape, form or fashion anything financial or change up some of the major metrics. Largely, we have a very big market, both Europe and the United States. Over 37 million installations for both commercial and resi have some sort of power asset with them. So solar, batteries, generators, EV chargers, load managers, et cetera. And roughly, and this number is climbing, about half of them, certainly, we've got here on the deck, about 13 million for sure, are what we call orphans. That means that there is no service provider. And that's important. I'll get to the investment thesis here and what we're seeing happen in terms of our sales and so forth. And when you look at what we can do with Endurance, what's this really all about? It's about increasing margins and not really necessarily the gross margin of our labor technician going out and solving a customer's problem. And it's more about the net margin. It's about cutting operating expense. It's about going in and slashing the SaaS costs, slashing the SaaS staffing. What does that mean Software as a Service? What does that mean Salesforce, HubSpot? These are the kind of companies out there that you've heard about in the so-called SaaS apocalypse, and we're here to tell you that SaaS apocalypse is a very real thing. And then from there, we're going to -- Jack will take you through the Agentic AI. What are we doing with agents to displace other costs within the system and to enhance customer service, to provide a better customer service. What we've done so far, I think you'll find pretty amazing. And then what we see in the coming weeks and months, I didn't say years, weeks and months, I think, is really interesting. But you can see the lift there in margins on the first page. And then consolidator. This is a very fragmented space. If you look at -- there is no big global service provider. Frankly, there's no big one U.S. service provider or European. And now there is with Otovo. So there is a lot of fragmentation here, and we'll get to that here in the investment thesis just in a few seconds. You can see the cost savings, the legacy customer base. We have access to near 2 million customer information and so forth, how many acquisitions we're trying to close our -- and we'll close our eighth acquisition. We have more right behind that, as everybody knows. So it's in a very exciting space here as far as large, fragmented, needs technology and frankly, needs a better performance and level of service that customers can't get out there. In terms of going through and how does Otovo make money, we make money through memberships, so both residential and commercial. So we are monitoring your power assets, think solar system or batteries. And then we make money on the repairs. So something is wrong, we roll a truck and fix it. And then we make money on upgrades. So think you need a battery, say you're in the Netherlands and net metering is ending at the end of the year, you're going to need a battery. We can do that as well. And then retail power and then aggregation of power and selling it back into the wholesale system or what we call virtual power plant or VPP. And that is in the deregulated markets. Currently, right now, we only do that in Texas, but we're going to work to launch that out in both the Northeast and Mid-Atlantic United States and across all of Europe because all of Europe is actually more deregulated than the United States and enjoys a better marketplace and better pricing for consumers as a result. So on the next page, before I turn it over to Jack, just give a quick overview and investment thesis of Otovo. Otovo really sits on the -- at the epicenter of 3 major investment thesis. So that's power. And so we all know about all the AI demand with data centers and driving power demand and so forth. And we obviously serve customers, both commercial and residential for power. And we do so with many of these assets at far below the current prevailing utility rate and at a better reliability because that generation is on site and matches with load. There is an enormous amount of need to keep power assets running and running optimally now given what's happening in the power markets, given demand pricing moving materially higher and expected to do so for the next several years at least. So we have a nice investment theme here with addressing this secular megatrend with power demand. Then second is service itself. Service has been very challenged in behind the meter, especially solar in both Europe and the United States for both commercial and residential. And what we're able to do, and one of the thesis here was to essentially take a very fragmented market, be able to aggregate a bunch of companies that were profitable. And then when you start to look at getting economies of scale and cutting out costs and so forth, but being able to serve big customers like major manufacturers of equipment, major asset holders, these are things that have really performed very well. So we've done very well on buying service companies at incredibly low multiples. further cutting the costs out of them and then doing a lot of transactions and signing increasing more contracts and getting more business from very large manufacturers, very large asset owners that have nowhere to go. They don't have the scale. And the last thing a big manufacturer wants to deal with is was -- is to say, you have to deal with a bunch of hundreds of small little contractors out there that, frankly, are really installers and not the service business. And that's 2 very different businesses. One is a construction business, one is a logistics business measured in hours and days. The other is measured in months. And so this -- there's an enormous amount of demand. There's been a great amount of execution. I can't wait to talk about that on the next week's earnings call. And this has been a huge upside in terms of starting the company, doing these acquisitions. This has gone much, much faster, much better, much cheaper than we thought when we originally started. The last one here, and that's what we're all here to do this afternoon is to talk about AI. This was something that was obviously not well understood. Certainly, I can say that not understood by me that well, but really was able to bring in Jack and his team to be able to come in and say, let's lean into what artificial intelligence can do. Let's lean into what the large models can do. And what could that look like? And what you'll see here is the result of that. So again, building our tech stack from the ground up, we own the entire thing and then displacing that software cut -- cost, cutting the software support staff and then being able to easily deploy very inexpensive, very powerful agents. And as those models exponentially improve, and it is exponential, 2 weeks is a long time in AI, as I think everybody is aware of at this point. That further has cost cuts to it. And then down the road, who knows embodied AI, there's Elon Musk and a lot of others that firmly believe that, that's right around the corner, and I have no reason to doubt that. But that's something that we can talk about at a later date should that come to fruition. So exciting to see what we've been able to accomplish as a company. Quite candidly, it's hard to still get your head around how fast AI moves and what you can do with it. And really, our -- what gives us a real advantage here is that we've built the company up. We are what they call AI native. We forced the AI to be injected in the organization, restructured the organization, which has helped by pulling in a lot of the different acquisitions of the companies, but we -- this is not easy. If anybody tells you this is easy to adopt, they don't know what they're really talking about quite candidly. This is very difficult. And so pulling this off, we have the advantage of being a leader, started ahead of time, so we got a head start, but also being able to build this company up with all these acquisitions from the ground up with AI first and foremost in mind. So with that, I'll turn it over to Jack, and he can talk a little bit about his background and so forth and get straight into showing you Endurance. Jack?

Hello, everyone. I'm Jack. I'm the designer and implementer of Endurance here at Otovo. So I'll kind of get right to it and show you all exactly what Endurance is all about. So this will be a live demo, just heads up ahead of time. For those of you in the technology space know that this is incredibly rare to do, primarily because of the usual risks involved with doing something like this. We're confident enough in our platform, in order to do this. I would say that this is a fairly rare occurrence to say the least, for most people. So get off, this is the main dashboard you'll see as you enter Endurance, if anyone is wondering about the data on the ship, that's our marketing technician guy in Endurance is Shackleton, the explorer ship. So we have a little bit of fun with that. I'll be showing you a couple of different systems today in Endurance. Let me see if I can head on over to my account here at Endurance. So you can see here, we prioritize speed a lot in our systems. We're building everything from the ground up ourselves. So we want everything to be very quick, very snappy in our systems in order to be able to scale appropriately. As you can see, we have all of the customer information here, any of our tags, this is my test account. So you will see quite a lot of kind of junk in test items here as you're looking through this. So you'll see all the tags from different campaigns that we're running or anything like that. We at Otovo have a bunch of different systems, all built into Endurance. And often where we're going, we don't necessarily always have the license to be able to operate as Otovo in those regions. For example, in California, we are not licensed. We've purchased a company, EnergyAid to work in California. And we work under their license, and we are transferring the license over. But for the time being, we have to operate as EnergyAid there. And how do we keep track of all these customers that we need to say, oh, hey, we're EnergyAid or oh, hey, we're Otovo. We just -- it's really, really difficult, especially on a global scale. So we've built a brand ID system in here, as you can see, provider Otovo. In this case, we are licensed in Texas, where I live to be able to operate here. We bring in all of the customers' information from the phone networks, any of the customers' mood, their preferred channels that they want to operate in, any of our consent tracking, anything like that is all in here. We have our full marketing engine directly into Endurance here. Any of our sales status, so we have a central ledger for everything here where we have our first touch, last touch, any of our sales and inbound calls, outbound calls, all throughout the system. Of course, mine has quite a few in there in order to tune our marketing engine and actually get a real customer journey all the way through the system. So another important part of Endurance here is we need all the data all the time into Endurance in order to be able to actually give a really, really good holistic experience. So I think part of the thing with AI in general and then also, of course, Endurance is making sure that you have ownership of every single point of your data. And so that's been very important for us is that we have every single thing in Endurance. There's nothing outside of Endurance. Any quotes to be paid here, I'll show this in a little bit. We work with Stripe and Ramp, as they were really only outside partners for primarily financial reasons and regulatory reasons. So Stripe will handle our PCI compliance and Ramp will handle our like actually issuing our credit cards to our technicians and things like that. Both are very, very tightly integrated into Endurance. All of our information on viewing Google Maps here and any of our answers to our questions about if we're okay to proceed, it's not home or anything like that is all stored here in Endurance, any open customer cases and any of our activity in here. So on the sidebar here, you're going to see kind of our central communications system with the customer. Now we have this sidebar available pretty much everywhere in Endurance. And the idea is that this is a full holistic view of everything that the customer has experienced. So all of the outbound calls, inbound calls they've had, any of the transcripts, any of the call summaries, the dispositions, the recordings, all of it is immediately available right here. So -- you'll see in here someone named Iris. Iris is not a real person. So this is your first AI agent that we put into Endurance. So when we set out to build Endurance, of course, we set out to build AI -- Endurance with AI. But that wasn't the primary system of like putting AI into Endurance. We set out to build a really good CRM first and then get to the point in which we put AI into it. We, for the past couple of months or so, have gotten to that point. So that's where we see Iris being able to schedule appointments, as you can see here or notify appointments, confirm appointments, set up a checkout for a subscription. for our membership, which if anyone on the call is in one of our service areas, check us out for membership and give us a holistic view of exactly everything that's going through the system, any files needed for permitting or anything like that, all available at a click of a button. So I'll show you one of my services. So we've got EV charger service here. This is the start of the service. So this is you create a quote and we need this customer to accept it. In this case, it's me. And I did change a little bit of this before the call, but all of our inspection reports from prior systems, if we need to create a change order on the quote or anything like that, any context that we need for the system, anything like that our AI will inspect the inspection report and get an actual overview for the quoting team right here. But this is the second part is we're actually pulling -- starting to pull in. This one is a bit older than our newest version of the system. But all quotes that are inbound for our system now, so all B2B, all B2C new quotes are made by AI for us now. We have about 90% to 95% accuracy given the correct information submitted by the technician on site for the request on this. And that is a reflection towards our actual estimating team. So we've been using this. We saw those numbers. We're very happy with those numbers, and we went ahead and changed our entire system over to that. So -- all of our stuff is first intake by our AI estimating and quoting team. So any of our commission that we need to pay out for the sales team is also brought directly into here. Also our sales tax, if we need external financing, if it's covered under warranty, linked to external accounting systems, all brought directly into the system here. So let me show here. So we actually had a very unique problem here at Otovo that I think is a little bit interesting. A few months ago, one of our salespeople was complaining that we had a customer complaining that all of our quotes seem like AI. And at the time, we actually didn't have any AI in the quotes when we were presenting to the customer. So right now, you're looking at the customer view. And so this is where an example of what we're using AI to resolve a problem that like you just wouldn't really think of. And it was because our quotes were too technical. The customers couldn't understand it. They didn't know what a 40-amp breaker meant. They didn't know why a type QP breaker was important versus a regular breaker. They just didn't understand it. And they didn't really care to understand it. They just wanted their stuff fixed. And so that's where we have actually brought AI in here, and we've not gotten a single complaint afterwards since we've built this system of our quotes sounding like AI, which is a little bit ironic, but very interesting to me at least. So we have a little breakdown here. And then we also bring our eSign system directly in here as well. So this eliminates the need for DocuSign. This eliminates the need for any e-signing system. We put it all directly into Endurance. And also, you kind of eliminate the back and forth. We're like, oh, hey, I need to need a quote on Square or one of these other platforms. And then, oh, and I also need to send you a second email it's going to come from DocuSign. You need to sign that and pay the quote. Here in Endurance, everything is the same. Now when you go -- when you signed your quote, you'll see us here. We'll be able to add a card or bank account here directly, select a payment and then complete the charge directly on here. So all of that is directly into Endurance here as well. So additionally, we have quite a few systems in Endurance. So when you're looking at a Salesforce product or a HubSpot product or any of the other different systems that we've ripped out, a lot of them kind of end here. This is your base CRM system. We've got our base dispatch system. We've got all of that. This next part is really kind of where we take Endurance further as we bring everything into Endurance. It's not just some things, we take everything. So anything in terms of our call systems here. Of course, there's no calls today in the U.S. at 7:00 a.m. here. But we -- we're bringing everything into Endurance. You can call directly out of Endurance. Usually, with Salesforce requires a separate talk desk, separate air call, then you have to connect those into each other. Oh, okay, they don't sync. We know all these issues because they're the exact issues that everybody that we've acquired has had problems with. We have a dialer directly in Endurance, being able to dial on our outbound leads and anything like that. Again, another separate SaaS. So when we acquired EnergyAid, we cut over 30 to 45-ish different SaaS subscriptions precisely for this reason because they had a Salesforce system that was fairly good. In fact, we've got a couple of offers to try to maybe think about even buying their like setup of the system because it was so good at a setup for Salesforce. But it just didn't end up making the cut because you have so many different SaaS subscriptions that then get put into the system directly. We have our technician management. We have our clock in and clock out here. Some of this is going to be sensitive information that we won't want to reveal on the call here. But all of this is directly into Endurance. We also have an automatic dispatching engine, where we automatically wrap our technicians based off of our skills and the nearest technician and then load balance it according to what is the best profit margin, especially on the drive time. Drive time is the worst thing in the service industry because it's purely lost margin. And so you really want to be able to eliminate that. We have a deterministic system that we built into Endurance directly. We originally tried to use some of Google maps and a little bit of their API there, but it ended up being extraordinarily expensive. So again, as you'll see is a common theme here, we built it in-house. I'll kind of move through this quickly here. Legal, any of our issues in Endurance here. We have also built AI directly into Endurance with the context of all of our systems. So if you've ever seen a bolt or lovable whatever else this is, we've actually built that directly into Endurance. So we have each of our team members able to build out their own dashboards directly with AI, with our AI chat system, being able to -- and then our Canvas system, which allows them to pull directly from our database and get any of the data that they need for whatever they need to do. We've seen some pretty creative stuff as we are -- or at least I've seen some pretty creative stuff over the last few months and people -- that is actually probably our biggest success on new features in Endurance. Another thing I want to show is Endurance is more than just this one system. We bring a bunch of different systems together, especially systems that need individual permissions or whatever else it is, all with the same login. And companies struggle with a bunch of different issues with HR. So a lot of it is managing like how do we manage a global organization because we've got about half and half in Europe and the U.S. And that's going to change even more when -- as we're working with Green Panel. So this is our solution to that system. So clock in and clock out, there's specific laws in different countries that we have to manage all of that directly into Pulse. This is another one of our systems under the Endurance umbrella, and it sinks directly with Endurance. So the Endurance mobile app for the technicians and for the customers sinks directly into here. So if you clock in an Endurance mobile, it clocks into Pulse here as well. So all of our policy documents, any documents that have signed, again, obviously, very sensitive information, and this is actually live. I did sign our total whistleblowing policy. So now we've got one of those. Any members of my team, any time off requests, attendance, anything like that will be directly in here. We will be bringing some payroll systems directly in here as well. That is not there quite yet. But we also have service access and system access directly into here. So all of our systems are directly accessed in Pulse. So we have an API connector to Google Workspace, Slack, NetSuite, Ramp where with one press of one button on Pulse, we can terminate access to tons of systems all throughout the organization with just one click of a button. There's no -- oh, man, did we turn off Fred's access yet? Shoot. I forgot. Now he's had access for 3 months. That's been a couple of -- there's been a couple of cybersecurity issues with that with companies in the news recently. And here at Otovo, we're striving to not make that an issue. So technician leaves, decides it to the last day or we do, his ramp card is turned off automatically with one click of a button through here. No hanger on here. No -- please remember just writing your card and return it. And then additionally, we're building another system here at Otovo with [ Themis ]. I'm going to need to log off here. So we put additional security measures into Themis. But any of our -- we're going to -- we start building a legal assistant in Endurance here as well, again, under the Endurance umbrella. This is allowing anyone in the company to e-mail or with the allow list in the company -- sorry, not anyone, the allow list in the company to e-mail the central repository of all of our legal documents and get responses usually in the form of just like making documents and things like that. The issue that we've had with AI is a lot of people have trouble with how long it takes, how much time it takes to really get these responses or like building out new NDAs or at least -- or at the very least kind of doing a preliminary red line before the legal team takes action or takes a look, and that's what we've strived to also resolve with Themis here as well. And this is our platform for being able to handle this. Now Themis is special actually. Themis has access directly as you'll see in the credentials system here, which, again, is kind of a bit sensitive on that. But you can see the systems directly. So our -- so Themis actually has access to its own browser and is able to -- and has its own credit card as well. So it's able to submit trademark applications, anything like that and pay the like ceremonial $11, $12 fees to the U.S. government or whatever government you need to pay for the licensing fees. So things like that. Themis is able to operate its own browser here as well. As you can see, I was working on some home improvement contracts and working with Themis to be able to handle quite a few of these at the same time. This is really bringing down our costs on a global scale because this is a lot of work to be able to handle all these home improvement contracts. And then as well and the last one that you saw here is Nefi. So Nefi is our AI bot that we use. This is our recursively improving software system directly into Endurance. It's built off of some lower-level agent loop systems like open cloud codecs, but is uniquely us. So this is built directly into all of our systems. This takes customer requests from Iris. So if someone -- if Iris realizes someone has a technical issue, it actually passes it off to Nefi. Nefi fixes it then passes it back to Iris. So as you can see, we're kind of like really -- at least I hope we're really kind of running away with it on this system with multiple different AI systems with different permissions, different security settings working directly with each other to be able to resolve issues. I have an approval system here. I have my runs. As you can see, Nefi is running right now with approvals. And then I also rate how Nefi is working throughout the system. Nefi learns over time through my ratings and through the -- my team's ratings in the system to be able to improve the response behavior. And we've seen quite a lot of improvement recently just from that system alone. So any approval that needs to make new features or do runs run here as well. Some things don't need approval, and most actions can happen autonomously. But we have about 70% to 80% resolution on an autonomous basis. And then most things that Nefi asked for approval end up getting denied because there are like other usually customers or outside features that we don't always want to build, but this is our way of like actually sorting through the system properly. So we have about an 85-ish resolution rate with Nefi on all technical issues throughout the company. So it's -- and that includes new features. So that's not just plugs, that's new features as well. I'll open it up for Q&A. I trying to think -- there'll probably be some more items that I'll show you in Endurance throughout Q&A, but I would love to hear some questions.

Perfect. Thank you very much, Jack. We have gotten some questions already, but if you have any more questions, you can use the Q&A function here in Teams. So maybe we can start with scalability. Could you give some more color on the scalability of Endurance versus how it was with traditional SaaS providers?

Yes. So actually, we found with Endurance, we still have to -- and as we go into these new companies that we've acquired, we get to work with their systems for like a few days to a week or whatever else it is. So our median time to transition from a SaaS system to Endurance is about 3 weeks. So we do a pretty good job of actually -- we've done quite a few of those transitions at this point, about 5 of them now. So we get to play around with those systems. We find them slow. We find them like very, very difficult to scale appropriately. With Endurance, we've been able to modify the source code to directly impact our scalability. So all of our hardware in the United States is a onetime cost of about $6,000 or $7,000 roughly. So that is quite low compared to what you see for an AWS-like system. I think if I did the math, the number on an AWS on a per month basis was about $40,000 to $45,000 to buy that equivalent hardware in the AWS cloud directly. So quite a bit of expense otherwise not used. So Endurance in general, is very scalable. We can edit the code to be faster. We actually did have an issue at one point a few months ago, where we were really starting to feel the strain. We were adding all these companies. We were really -- Endurance was slowing down. It was an issue. In just a few days, we were able to completely rewrite most parts of the stack underneath to optimize them, and we've been running ever since just fine. And as you can see in Endurance today, it's a very quick system. We have -- it's very scalable accordingly. So we have a lot more fat to trim on that, but we can get a lot faster. But Endurance is the fastest CRM in the industry.

Yes. And also, you recently acquired EnergyAid. So did you experience any hiccups with the integration? Or did it work without any issues?

I mean there's always going to be some issues. There's never like nothing ever goes according to plan. I would say a lot of times to what we do with Endurance in general is like, okay, we take what is this company doing well? Because when you're acquiring a company, they're not like they're not doing everything bad, right? Like they figured some things out for sure. And so every single time we take a look at what their processes are doing, take a look at our processes and then merge them together into the best possible process. So every acquisition, we get significantly better in Endurance. And the great part about controlling your own software is your company's processes are built directly into the software. They're not like, oh, hey, you're supposed to do this in Salesforce or -- this is the way that you're supposed to do this. It's like you can't do anything else except for the process. And so we got to learn a lot from the operations and sales team there and build that directly into Endurance and improved our numbers dramatically. So each acquisition is a learning opportunity for us, and that's how Endurance evolves over time is how do we get better with new people entering, new suggestions and things like that constantly.

I want to add in there something, Jack, if you don't mind. One thing to look at is when you look at traditional SaaS stack and you've got somewhere between 25 and 100 different SaaS providers in your tech stack, pretty much all of them have a per seat cost to it. So as you're building up a company like we've done in a very short period of time in a large company, your costs explode. This happened to be in a previous company that I built, and it turns into tens of millions of dollars a year. Trust me, and those who are running companies and know about it, you'd see that. You don't have that here. I mean all-in cost, all in total, total, total, even with tokens, we can talk about that, is about $1 million. And that is very, very scalable. In fact, that is inclusive of bringing more agentic AI to agents within the company to further cut the cost out. So when you look at, for instance, 50% of customer solutions or service today is done by Endurance, 50%. I mean think about that. Think about the cost structure. What is that going to be in a few weeks, certainly 90 days or so. materially higher than that, especially as you have the new models that are coming. So the cost reductions here are tremendous. We've listed out what we said publicly, it's far greater than that. And as you move forward in the next few weeks and months at the back end of this year, you're going to see a tremendous more millions of dollars in savings against both the SaaS, that's been cut out. It's reflected in the last payments that we make under the contracts when we acquire these companies in the first part of this year. That, by definition, will not show up again because we've terminated all those contracts. But on top of that, now you're starting to get displacement as far as administrative folks in the office and so forth. And so we're seeing a very significant amount of cost reduction, dispatch over 80%. We will actually be moving that to almost completion will be done by Endurance. Procurement, I mean, marketing, financial analysis, there's so much here that's already being in terms of cost structure wiped out, and you are seeing a significant, significant impact on the bottom line and the widening out of the net margins as we went through and as I said in our Q1 call. It's really -- frankly, it's unbelievable, and that's the purpose of this call is to say, here it is, this is real. This is working. Here are the costs that we are avoiding. Here's where we think we can go. Here's our cost to run the system. No it's not millions of dollars of tokens and some things that you've heard out there. We'll give you the straight answers as always, about here is, this is what's actually happening. This is real.

Yes. I'll add on to that. So I was just reviewing the numbers actually right before this call. Our handoff rate, which means our rate that AI cannot handle system is 17.4% right now. So over 82% is handled by AI on all customer communications. So -- sorry, on text and e-mail, so text-based. So we have a pretty high rate there. I will say, come Monday, we will be turning off the ability in Endurance for our dispatching team to set the start time and the duration time of all of our appointments globally for service. So we will be doing everything with our automated system directly into Endurance. So that will be a big paradigm shift even for us, and we're really, really pushing the frontier with that one. I would say that's going to be definitely a big deal for us, but it's going to rapidly give us the ability to actually scale the business.

And just another one here. What are your estimated cost of the system -- the running cost of the system? And what are your estimated cost savings also related to specific use cases like CRM?

Yes. So our running cost for the system, U.S. server costs are -- was the onetime cost of about $7,000 -- $6,000 or $7,000, as I said earlier. And then that's pretty much it. You need the salary. I have 1 person in my team in California, 2 in Houston with me and 2 in Poland. So the running cost of their salaries, and that's pretty much it. We do, do some renting of physical metal servers in Europe just to comply with GDPR regulations. But it's not like AWS, where you have -- where you're like having a VM if we actually -- the actual metal is what we work on directly there. So those costs come out pretty materially lower on the -- from the AWS side.

Great. And then I saw sanity on a tombstone on the slides. Is that sanity.io? And how do they fit in or rather don't fit in anymore?

So Sanity is still hosting our web pages for the last few days actually here. We've been ceremoniously taking them out here. They -- we built our own CMS system directly into Endurance. So we host everything there. Some of our -- we're trying to find the last few websites in Europe that are still hosted with Sanity at the moment, but we've already replicated those over into Endurance and are in the process of finding and turning them off in the next few days. So Sanity is going to be ripped out. It was a holdover from the old Otovo European team, but we built our own CMS directly into Endurance as well. We -- again, the philosophy with at Otovo is we built everything ourselves. If it needs to be built, it needs to be built in-house.

Yes. And also on your Graveyard slide, you mentioned Twilio. So how have you managed to bypass as voice or SMS provider? Or is it primarily add-ons that you have cut down? And if so, how much have you reduced the expenses?

Yes. So we still use some of their services at a very, very low level and a low, low cost, much, much lower than the overall regular cost. So Twilio and others, as you know, have SDKs that allow you to bring everything directly in the system, handle your calls that way. We don't use any of that. We use the raw SIP signaling infrastructure, which I'm going to get is a little bit technical at the moment, but it's about as low level as you can get. It's the actual connection from the phone lines into the Internet. So literally the switches. So that's built at a much lower rate. And then we've actually built our phone infrastructure to connect that to the human, connect that to any of our customers ourselves. We're looking into building our own infrastructure there as well. That one is a little bit harder in terms of regulatory burden for us. But all of their software on the top end, any of the add-ons, anything like that, none of it is used, none of it is not built in-house. So any of our actual -- like any of our actual attribution, any of our AI phone systems, all of that built directly in-house. We started with some open source repos that we've now significantly forked and some [ MIT ] licensed open source repos, and then we significantly fork and built on that infrastructure as we found certain things work and certain things don't work for us.

I think, Albert, on the cost side, we need to stick with what we've previously publicly disclosed. And that is about $4 million in SaaS with the companies. There's obviously more that goes with that with SST and so forth and additional acquisitions. And then we've talked about at least $1 million already in savings on essentially back office administrative costs. That is going to explode higher. We'll talk about that in the earnings call. But when you look at every time you add a company, there is and when this goes into talking about scalability, there's no movement up in cost. I mean a little bit in tokens, a few hundred bucks an acquisition or something literally in that kind of number, Jack can correct me if I'm wrong. But this is really going to be flat line. And so what we've done at Otovo, think about -- just forget about the power service business for a while, just overall, there's always been a relationship between the number of guys or trucks or however you want to phrase it in the field doing work, whatever the work is, fixing an air conditioner, fixing a solar system in our case or whatever it is. And then you have the back office. And that's inclusive of your SaaS, your software spend and everything else to try to make that back office as efficient as possible over the last 30, 40 years. We've broken that relationship, where every time you add somebody in the field, you got to add somebody else that does dispatch or customer care or whatever it is, we've broken that relationship completely. And what that is entailed, again, we'll talk about it more next week is you've essentially what you've done is you've created a highly, highly scalable. So as you add more revenue to it, your actual cost structure stays flat to actually declines and your revenue is moving materially higher like orders and multiples. So as you buy companies, as you do organic growth, your cost structure doesn't grow. I mean that's never been done before. And we see that, that is where you're going to see a lot of competitive advantage, particularly over the next few years, we have a head start. that we will literally have a cost structure that nobody else can even touch. And that's where we sit today, and that's what we talked about in the Q1 call. And again, we'll update some pretty exciting updates next week on that.