Sivers Semiconductors AB (publ) (SIVE) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hello, everyone, and welcome to this webinar. We are now going to first see the webinar from this morning, was sent at 8 a.m. CET, and then we're going to open up for Q&A and live session. So please watch this, and I'll be back. Good morning and welcome to this webinar. My name is Anders Storm, and I'm the Group CEO of Sivers Semiconductors, and I'm going to take you through more information on the acquisition of MixComm today. First of all, please read this disclaimer. So if we start first to give a little bit of background to Sivers Semiconductors today, pre the merger and acquisition. -- So Sivers is a semiconductor company focusing on wireless and Photonics business unit. In the wireless unit, we're doing 5G chipset, and the photonics unit, we're doing laser sources and for fiber optical cables as well as sensors. The company was listed on NASDAQ on the 10th full year. And we are about 120 employees with the head office outside of Stockholm in Kista and office in Gartenberg, and our Photonics business is in Glasgow. Currently, we have 20 PhDs in the company, and we have some strong institutional investors with Swedbank Robur, AMF, pension funds and so forth, third AP fund. And we had a cash position of $60 million at the end of Q2. So Sivers have had a very interesting journey over the last 5, 6 years. We were listed on Aktietorget in 2016. And when we started sort of a turnaround and had a plan to start using and developing 5G chipsets. Sivers had a long history in high-frequency products, making products for sort of low-volume type of applications, and there was really seeing emerging market of 5G and millimeter wave products. What we actually did then in 2015, we started the development, and we had our first chip set ready in 2017. And we got our first design win and partnerships with IDT and Ampion and others. And we also acquired a company within the Photonics business called CST Global, which is now Sivers Photonics. And we were also listed in the end of the year in NASDAQ. And over these years later on, we have then been able to grow the company. We were at sort of SEK 80 million in sales in 2016. We are now at about SEK 100 million in sales, and we're up to 26 design-wins. We've also been accelerating the Photonics business with more or less a couple of Fortune 100 customers that has invested quite heavily. And I'm going to talk shortly about the Photonics business today, but the focus is on the wireless type of business. So moving in what's been happening over the last sort of 10 months this year. We have added 5 design-wins so far. We had 2 new orders in the -- with synergy of SEK 25 million for the Fortune 100. We got our first sort of volume order from the 5G business in Q2, which grew the company 118% in the wireless part. We also were approved for NASDAQ listing. We've also had a couple of really good partnerships around our Photonics business, for example, with Imec and ASM. We've also seen our Japanese customer moving into volume production. It's is going to happen later this year. We started an establishment of a U.S. office. But with this acquisition as well, we are now going to be more grounded in the U.S., of course. We also launched our latest 5G chip set for focus on CPEs and that kind of applications. And we also closed the contract on the silicon photonics piece within Optical I/O, which is a very interesting future area. And now then yesterday, the acquisition of MixComm. So going into the acquisition and the background to it. So MixComm is a very interesting company who've been developed since 2017 coming out of the Columbia University, with Professor Harris founding the company with his partners. MixComm has been working hard within the informatics for 5G, SATCOM, Radar verticals. And we've been working for 1.5 years with MixComm with certain products. And it was a very good fit between the companies, and we decided to join forces basically. The most interesting piece here is, of course, that MixComm has a very good ecosystem network as well as local presence in the U.S. that Sivers don't have today in that way. And we're going to have a sort of local presence now in Europe and U.S. and Asia. And we're also seeing sort of a tenfold possibility of the total addressable market. The track record for MixComm is that they have actually a design-win with a Tier 1 customer in 5G base stations, which is a very interesting piece, where we see sort of a total addressable market over the coming 5, 6 years of SEK 400 million, with the sort of possible estimate of revenue about SEK 90 million. We also have -- where MixComm then is a major SATCOM customer where the value of sort of the orders are coming 2 years to $30 million and a lifetime valuation of about $250 million. There is also a big customer in the U.S. around the 5G repeat the product that MixComm created. We are very happy to be part of and it's a major U.S. communication company who is larger than $50 billion. And together, we increased the portfolio of design wins to 44 design wins and having a lot of different products within beam formers, rises and anteing package. If we look at the acquisition itself, the total acquisition cost is just about SEK 1.1 billion and with an earn-out up to SEK 1.35 billion, where we're paying a cash piece of SEK 195 million and which were financed with the private placement. That also took place yesterday where we acquired about SEK 400 million into the company. And then also the shareholders of MixComm will be our long-term shareholders of Sivers with a 12-month lockup of 50% of the shares that will be given in another 6 months, so 18 months total in the placement apart. There is some things that needs to happen, though, for example, is something called CFIUS, which is the committer of foreign investment in the United States that needs to prove the acquisition, and we expect that to happen somewhere in the early next year, which is sort of we have to wait with the closing until then. Also, there is -- the EGM is going to take place within 3, 4 weeks where we have to approve the new share issue. And we already have the major shareholders approving that in advance. So how will the new company look like when we add this together. Of course, we're now getting new offices in the U.S. And we will have then the main office for MixComm is in Chatham, New Jersey. Then we have an office in San Diego, which is a bit smaller. The company will then have 44 design wins, be working in a lot of adjacent markets like the beam formers, the repeaters, radars and SATCOM widening our stance in that sense. And if we look at the company, they have sort of been working from the sort of Columbia University and almost $94 million have gone into to the sort of business prefunding sort of mix comp under Dr. Harish. And that has been sort of what's then the exclusive IP licensing and the RF-SOI innovations together with GlobalFoundries have come to fruition. There is sort of approximately 20 employees and consultants within the company and nearly all people within sort of MixComm has a PhD, which is very impressive. There's 20 patents in the company, and they're also the only company which is part of the 5G Open Innovation Lab funded by T-Mobile and Intel for around mmWave. So the pipeline of 18 design wins is including, as I mentioned before, the repeaters and the base station and the SATCOM piece. Looking at the sort of overall business model, this is sort of a fabless business model, but also focus is, of course, on the wireless piece, but also SATCOM, others, and also future areas like consumer electronics and handsets and computers and stuff are actually in the MixComm mix here that we will see what we can achieve in the future. So as I mentioned, the Tier 1 is sort of something that Sivers have had a challenge to get. But with this acquisition, we get our first Tier 1 into the company. And a Tier 1 is the absolutely largest system vendors. And MixComm's sort of or high-end technology has been able to get in there. And volume production will start sort of end of '22, early '23. And the estimated value for that going '23, '26 is about $90 million. So these are the 4 areas that are the most sort of biggest one within the product offerings. So there are being former ICs in all the licensed band. There has been a lot of work together with GlobalFoundries, around 45RFSOI, 10 years of collaboration via the university, but then later also in the spin-out MixComm. Chip scale industry antenna package work together with GlobalFoundries has been one of the partnerships, for example. The SATCOM product is really interesting, and the prototype is going to ramp and trial now under 2022. And the repeaters are in the trial now with this really large company as we speak, U.S. MSO. So it's developed and prototyped and all the stuff inside this repeater give sort of what's needed. And that's made by MixComm, including the software and the hardware. And here is also a synergy actually for Sivers technology to use the 60 gigahertz technology for backhaul and stuff in these repeaters. Also what MixComm have been doing, they've been working on algorithms to be able to increase the efficiency of the RF part. So they are working with the sort of baseband vendors. And this is very unique, I would say. There's not many hardware companies who have this sort of thing and can offer this as a competitive advantage. So this is really interesting in that sense as well. So making also a more sustainable solution, which uses less power consumption. So here, we have the MixComm executive team. Mike Noonen has been with MixComm for a couple of years. He's the CEO and have a very long background within semiconductors. He's been working with GlobalFoundries, NXP, Cisco. And has been very a big help in this process we're working together. And of course, Harris Krishnaswamy, who is sort of a PhD, CTO and founder of the company. He's also associate professor in the electrical engineering department still on Colombia University, but we'll now sort of focus even more on MixComm. He has 20 years experience within RFICs and RF. And has the part of sort of the research funding he's been bringing into this fantastic company. Frank Lane is also a Co-founder and VP of Engineering, also 25 years of experience been working with Qualcomm and global companies, a successful startup experience in many places. Then we also have Arun Natarajan, who is a PhD Associate Professor from the Oregon State University and part of the team up in the Oregon area. He's developed some of the earlier sort of mmWave silicon phased arrays, 24GHz, 77GHz and at Caltech during his PhD. And then we have Jay Martin, who is the VP Business Development and going to be an important person also in connection to Sivers products going forward in the U.S. Jay has a background from Renesas or previous IDT as well and know silicon business very well. So if we look at the synergies of the acquisition. So what we're actually creating when merging these 2 companies is to create a leading challenger with a full-stack, full-spectrum major vendors. We'll have beam formers. We have RFICs. We're covering all frequencies to 24 to 86. We now would have repeaters. We provide modules and antenna and package with SATCOM, we have radar and so forth. Looking at the rest of the market, I mean even the large companies like Qualcomm and Analog Devices, they can't really cover all of this. And even other smaller similar vendors that Sivers have been working like Movandi and Anokiwave, we are now sort of creating a main challenger, I would say, above these companies with a much broader portfolio and taking a sort of a very important position within this very interesting market. So here again, here is all the reason sort of we have the licensed band. You will have CPEs, repeaters, base stations, satellite terminals unlicensed. We have everything on transportation, backhaul, radar, fixed wireless access and so forth. Combining 2 very strong ecosystems, so you know all about our ecosystem with NXP and Renesas and IDT and Fujikura and so forth. And within them, our Photonics business, we have IMEC and so forth. What our friends at MixComm bring to the table is that, of course, the partnership with GlobalFoundries and actually becoming an owner of Sivers in this transaction. Richardson RFPD, which is a very, very strong distributor all over the world with many people that can work and deliver technology and partnerships into a lot of places. So -- and also Xilinx and Situne modem vendors, modern platform, open RF, as we talked about. They are part of that open RF for handset manufacturing, open innovation lab and Rohde&Schwarz as a supplier. So this is sort of building on what we talked about before and building this out. So we're now getting into sort of 44 design wins. And most of those there are top design wins here we have from MixComm. It's really interesting. We have sort of a couple of them coming out and we're saying like 16 are now getting into volume in the coming 12 months with 8 of them from Sivers going into volume quite soon. And then under 2022, we'll see MixComm coming into volume. So that is really interesting, and especially MixComm with some sort of larger customers here who were creating a really interesting market. So looking at and going into the sort of major design wins here. So the major Tier 1 is sort of Mixcomm Inside becoming Sivers Inside Now. This is sort of a base station. They have typically sort of almost 50 beam former ICs, the solutions for all the N-band sort the 24,28, 39GHz planning ramp sort of late 2022. And looking at sort of the potential sales here over the sort of TAM or the total addressable market is going to start in 2023 with the sort of $71 million and going up to $151 million growing quickly. the total TAM is about $435 million. And if -- since we can't mention the name of this Tier 1, but most of the Tier 1 sort of have a 20 -- larger than 20% market share. So that will sort of be an estimate of about $90 million over this period from '23 to '26, and these are numbers and estimates for mobile experts. We look at the repeater project, which is also very interesting. There has been an NRE development and funding, and we expect even getting more into this. The repeater is built on coverage, much low cost and much lower cost than a base station. MixComm has sort of an array and built this software as well into this with Xilinx modems, and the trial is conducted as we speak. I've seen pictures of the trial going on, and that's really great to see. Gen II NRE funding expected in 2022 for system design with deployments with partners. Potential sales in this is around $10 million for this only customer. So of course, there could be other larger vendors who want to use this technology. And of course, putting sort of backhaul by Sivers inside in the future in these boxes is also the next step, hopefully. If we look at the sort of overall TAM in this market, it's about $83 million from '22 to '26. And this is one of the larger customers in that sense that can go there. So adding this together, is about $590 million in TAM in this. If we look at the SATCOM customer, there are 2 projects there, and they are very close to delivery now and also getting payments on this. They have also been delivering the current beam former ICs in smaller volumes so far to this project, which is now under usage and test. The NRE of about $2 million that is coming into the company partly now as well, I think, in Q4, but there will also be more NRE next year in the vicinity of that, expecting to have around 1,700 of these kind of beam formers per ground terminal. So that's a lot of chip sets and the volumes quickly become large when it's -- Here, we are estimating $30 million from '22 to '24, but a potential lifetime for this kind of product could be up to $250 million over that sort of a longer period, 10 years. So these 3 together with this is sort of the rollout now that Sivers has with the ADTRAN. And ADTRAN just released 3 new customers, and we're seeing more and more customers adding on and after the sort of pandemic now, it's starting coming and going more into this. And ADTRAN, they're working in 68 different countries with Tier 1, 2, 3 service providers and cable/MSOs. So it's really exciting now to see this rollout. And Sivers is sort of almost a year ahead, I would say, with hardware compared to MixComm in that sense. But MixComm also has some really large customers in that sense. Another customer that Sivers has today is Cambium, which is also now starting to roll out, and the first trials are happening as we speak. Cambium is another sort of large company. They have 17,000 network operators as their customers. They have 10,000 channel partners that are selling. So the big thing here with these things is not -- if you look at each customer, there could be sort of a small one to a larger one, but the total together makes the sort of volumes large going forward. Another customer that Sivers has this partnership with Blue Wireless, with EvoRail, where we really have this connectivity with -- connecting from base stations along the train tracks, so the call sort of tractor train where we can connect the trains with the 2 gigabit in the front and back so we can have possibly 4 gigabits at the same time, connecting all the people on the trains, and then the possibility to use Netflix and WiFi on the train. So this is sort of a broadband for the train, and it's been tested and run in 200 kilometers with latencies below 1 millisecond and so forth. So this is a really interesting product. Talks going away. This is another customer. We're just doing something completely different for Sivers doing what's called Arvine wave tunnel, where they actually can have cable replacement instead in the market, where the cables today are 100 megabit per second, you can get sort of 1 gig here without sort of pulling out all the cables and changing them and according to Airline moves the customer here there is 5 million buildings in the U.S. that needs recabling. So this could be a very interesting product even if airline is a smaller start-up. So the synergies, again, the broader customer base and complementary base will derisk sort of the revenue ramps and so forth, having 44 combined design wins. We will be able to leverage the strong existing GlobalFoundry partnership since Sivers is working with GlobalFoundries. Our latest chip is built in GlobalFoundries in the same fab. So that will go sort of cost, quality, time to market and accelerating design wins and leverage that is really important. Overhead costs, that is, of course, an important piece, positioning of the design wins across all areas with industry-leading companies. And it's always harder to find -- get the first Tier 1 customer, and we can leverage that now and hopefully win more in the future. And also the global market presence. I mean we have had this lack of market presence in the U.S., not maybe being perceived as a U.S. company. This definitely changes this. Getting new investors in like Kairos, who is one of the main investors in MixComm, is going to be very important for the company going forward and get sort of a footprint also in the U.S. So merging these 2 strong challenges together, we create the space between the large companies and the competitors where we can sort of grow and win market shares. Looking at the expected new shareholders from MixComm, we're going to have Kairos at approximately 9% ownership in Sivers after the sort of closing. Kairos is a sort of a company who invests in groundbreaking start-up and research directly from the universities and support spin-off and invest in them. So we're really excited to work with them and also seeing their possible and entering into our Board, Todd here, which we are looking forward to. Harish is also, as the founder, one of the largest shareholders going forward, is going to have 5% and going down. So total that's about 19% of the shares, including GlobalFoundries. Columbia University, will now be owners in servers after the closing and CFIUS and all of that. The share price has been decided on a sort of a 10-day VWAP. So that's the sort of closing price in that the same way we closed the direct share issue yesterday. Looking at sort of the pro forma figures. MixComm is in a phase just before sort of the big rollout, and it's a good phase to sort of do a merger in, I think. And the sales has been sort of just about $1.3 million for the first part of the year. But we are also, of course, foreseeing with all these design wins going forward that this is just the start of things. Also a few words about our Photonics business. There might be people online who hasn't heard about us before. We have a 3, 5 compound semiconductor fab up in Glasgow focusing on Indium Phosphide, Gallium Arsenide and Gallium Nitride. The Indium Phosphide is where we'll be most successful, I would say. And there, we do products in fiber-to-the-home, fiber to into the data center, optical I/O. As you heard about sensors, that's where we've been very good lately, winning Fortune 100 customers with quite some investments. Another project we're very proud of being part of this silicon photonics, optical I/O with AR Labs. They are sort of changing the world in the future here when we sort of getting to the wall on more slow and now sending light within the computers and CPUs and GPUs is sort of the future here. And many, many companies are working on this to get sort of light inside of the computers rather than electricity. And you will save up to 90% of the electricity or the power consumption by using this technology. So that we are really at the forefront of the technology also in the Photonics business. And here, something that you actually can see why, and sort of underpinning that is that we've been working now for 3 years with a very large Fortune 100 and invested almost $11 million into a new sensor that we are expecting to go into volume here in the future and start building pilot lines. We also have a second Fortune 100 customer. And this is really important. I mean the Sivers company here, we have a long history in sort of being an approved vendor with large companies. MixComm is coming, some as a bit of a younger company. Sivers has been around since 1951. MixComm since 2017, but with long history within the universities and so forth. But here, we can also bring this sort of approved vendor list and all of those things into this and support the future growth of MixComm. Also, together, we're creating a very strong, sustainable future with cutting-edge technology. So as I mentioned, fibers and silicon photonics with light is sort of saving a lot of energy. We're also building modules, state-of-the-art modules, reducing power consumption. They sort of call algorithms for the digital predistortion that the MixComm has developed will definitely sort of reduce the power consumption as well as the groundbreaking technology in the beam formers with one of the highest efficiencies in the market will sort of create a very strong sustainable company. And we will definitely work here in the future to sort of become a green designator on the NASDAQ and work hard on this side as well. So 9 strong points of the merger. So we have 44 design wins, 16 now coming to market within 12 months. MixComm has this really strong close ties to GlobalFoundries where sort of most of our 5G business is now conducted. And that's going to be extremely important to keep on building on that. And I've talked to them, and they're very happy to see that we are joining forces. We're increasing the total addressable market tenfold. Best technologies in the world now. We're collecting them both into the same company with BFIC and RFICs and really covering all licensed bands. Very strong IP portfolio. We're bringing in a lot of more patents than Sivers had ourselves in the 5G business, 20 patents. So we'll have sort of more than 30 patents in the company in general. Algorithm and repeaters, we didn't have that before. That's going to be a strong point in this. Strong sort of presence in EU and U.S., which is sort of really, really good. We're also adding 20-plus mmWave PhDs into the company. Strong distribution with the partners Sivers have in Asia and customers and ecosystem. But also Richardson RFPD, has done a fantastic job building the sales pipeline for MixComm. And we're very impressed what we can see also beyond sort of the design wins and design ins and so forth. There is a large pipeline with very interesting parts like, for example, getting into handsets and that kind of stuff. And also working strongly on the photonics and sort of reducing energy consumption and being a sustainable company and pushing on that as well. So that was my presentation.

So that was the presentation, and I'm back to live here, and we are open for Q&A for any questions, please use the window for questions, and I will try to answer as we go. So any idea when you expect to turn into profit? Of course, we have a great idea about that, but we have not shared any forecasts externally yet. So we can unfortunately not share it here either. We get more questions. With this merger, would you have 3 offices in the U.S.? Will you keep on your offices Sivers open or downsized? We -- Sivers don't have an office opened yet in the U.S. We have 1 employee that we hired for the Photonics business, which will work very close to the office that MixComm has in some year ago. So there is an office, a smaller office. And then the main offices in -- on the East Coast in New Jersey. And then there is sort of home offices in the Oregon state. So we will not close or open any new offices in that sense, we'll use what's on there we have today. Do you have any plans to acquire more companies in the future, or in the near future? The cost -- I mean this is our second acquisition since 2017. We like to sort of pinpoint and find the sort of the best possible mergers we can do with companies. And right now, we're, of course, we're looking into different things as well. But we are not out crazily chasing and having a sort of M&A agenda per se. We are looking to do the right acquisition if they pop up. But that's how we do things. And we'd like to sort of integrate companies and do that as well and not just buying more companies. Other questions? Progress with NXP? Yes. We have, as I said before, the new chip set that we just released from Sivers side, that is now still in the lab and it's supposed to go out to NXP a bit later. Actually, also, MixComm has a partnership with NXP. So exactly what we will do in all of these aspects is going to be quite interesting also going forward. Have you been in the U.S. during the due diligence? No, we've not been able to travel ourselves locally, but we've had plenty of meetings over teams, and we've got to know the team really, really well. And we have had sort of a very extensive data room that we've been able to review as well. And of course, we also talked to references like Tier 1 customers, GlobalFoundries, the SATCOM customer and so forth. So we have given a very good picture even without actually meeting. Do you think Sivers will be able to get the ESG stamp? Yes, I think so. This new NASDAQ Green designator, one of the demands is that you should have 50% of your revenue from green technologies sort of. And today, for example, fiber technologies are seen as green versus sort of copper and so forth. So in that sense, if you create these things that we were talking about and 50% of the revenue and also all the targets and stuff are done in the right way, we should definitely be able to get the green designator in the future. We're not going to hurry on that, but we definitely see a possibility to move there. It seems that there is an overlap in the beam former, especially the frequency at 26, 29 years come in how to manage. Will one of the beam formers be passed out? Yes, that's the only one. And the beam former we have from Sivers side, which is sort of a single beam former compared to the different versions that MixComm has developed further and has a stronger technology in is probably going to get -- gone away according to the synergies. What's the time line of realizing the synergies mentioned? Yes. So there is, of course, a lot of synergies here. And they're going to sort of come to fruition very quickly some of them, some later. And I can just tell you now that we are already getting things in from customers and questions, and people are really happy from all sides that we're doing this merger. So we will see a lot of synergies going forward in the coming as soon as the closing happens, which will probably happen early next year and then for the full of next year and going forward as well. When could you -- could we expect to hear if the 4 F 100 is going forward or not? Yes. I mean it's a hard question. We have been waiting for that for now for a while. We've got SEK 25 million in orders in. However, the challenges here is, of course, that we are not getting the final word and exactly what they're doing with customer -- the other sort of suppliers. And so when it comes to other parts of these sensors. So we're still in the dark a bit. We have had very good conversations. But I hope to be able to come back on that, of course. Is the deal with the Tier 1 customer actually order for value production or are the $90 million expected on the same level as the SEK 400 million? Yes, they are sort of estimates based on what the customer has said and what mobile experts is saying based on the informal market and so forth. So it's not an actual order yet. Tell us more about the possibilities within mobile phone sector, what type of product is MixComm developing? So it is connected to beam formers and they are connected to some customers. We can't mention any names yet. But we will come back to that. And currently, you can see also like from one of the slides that this is not the largest piece of what we're doing currently. But in the future, there might be a good opportunity based on the technology that Mixcomm have developed. How strong production line has MixComm or do they need to expand the production lines? So MixComm is a fabulous company, which is one of the good things here as well. And a similar series, wireless is fabless. And the fab, in this case, is GlobalFoundries that is then an owner of MixComm as well and will be an owner of Sivers going forward, a minority owner of about sort of 1% or something in that vicinity. So there is this very strong tie between MixComm and GlobalFoundries. And we will work on having the same good tie between Sivers and GlobalFoundries. So the expansion and the production lines are already built, I would say, in that to be able to deliver large volumes for this. The same question for the SATCOM customer. I'm not sure which question it was, but all the sort of revenues are based on what the customers have said and as well as a market expectation. So it is estimate even if some of the revenues from the SATCOM customer already had some orders, but not in the levels of SEK 30 million in the 2 coming years that this is expected. Can you talk a bit more about the MixComm antenna and package technology? Yes, that is the technology that GlobalFoundries and MixComm together has developed. It's a world's first. It's a very small package. It creates the possibility to flip chip -- chips directly onto the antennas, which makes it possible to do the chipset smaller and also do the antenna module smaller and more cost-effective. And you'll remove a lot of parts that then can make it even more cost effective. Which product will you have for the automotive sector? So today, I mean, we don't have products for automotive per se. We have products that is connecting automotive vehicles, like we have with the track to train and autobuses and so forth. So in the future though, I foresee a couple of years down the line that automotive companies would need connectivity in the cars in some way. And from the repeaters, we've also seen you can have repeaters in all of these things. And you can get the repeaters into the cars to spread millimeter wave in the cars, for example. So there's a lot of things you can do with that technology. We you get updates regarding MixComm in Q3, Q4, et cetera, for here on out? Also we see an [indiscernible] updates by MixComm. Do you wait for acquisition to be complete? Yes, this is something we need to discuss a bit more around actually how and what kind of message that -- messaging MixComm can do during this sort of period until closing, which is quite long. So we have not decided actually fully on that, but we are soon to have that discussion. And also when it comes to sales numbers, that is also something we need to discuss if that's going to be sort of a pro rata and are we going to show that or not. But that is actually not decided yet. And someone said good work. So thank you for that. I think we are -- No more questions now. I'll give it 1 more minute. If there is a question. Otherwise, I would like to thank all of you for joining. Okay. Here's have you already got any reaction from new possible customers due to the acquisition? Do they rumor spread around? Yes, we have. I can confirm that there are customers from each company who is coming in and wants to sort of see what we can also do on the other side of the business. So we will, as soon as we can close, have the closing see synergies on this, of course. Okay. With that, we're finishing today. Thank you so much. And have a great weekend, everybody. Bye-bye.